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rod,stroke opinions for roots KP440?
#504524
10/23/09 01:04 PM
10/23/09 01:04 PM
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 8,647
ELYRIA,OH
blownzoom440
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looking for ideas for a 4.35 bore,10.725 deck height.1400hp maxand switching to some B1-BS heads flowing 325int later from my iron flowing 280 now.
thanks for your input.try to keep a budget minded $$.
and no aluminum rods please.
Last edited by METAL STORM; 10/23/09 01:07 PM.
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Post deleted by Defbob
[Re: blownzoom440]
#504525
10/23/09 02:42 PM
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Last edited by DusterDave; 10/23/09 02:47 PM.
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Re: rod,stroke opinions for roots KP440?
[Re: blownzoom440]
#504529
10/23/09 02:51 PM
10/23/09 02:51 PM
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Joined: Nov 2004
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Syracuse,NY
CompWedgeEngines
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Just curious, why arent you just asking Scotty?  Blocks look nice BTW, been reseraching them a bit, looks stout.
RIP Monte Smith
Your work is a reflection of yourself, autograph it with quality.
WD for Diamond Pistons,Sidewinder cylinder heads, Wiseco, K1 rods and cranks,BAM lifters, Morel lifters, Molnar Technologies, Harland Sharp, Pro Gear, Cometic, King Engine Bearings and many others.
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Re: rod,stroke opinions for roots KP440?
[Re: blownzoom440]
#504530
10/23/09 02:54 PM
10/23/09 02:54 PM
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Joined: Jun 2009
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Michigan
Hemiroid
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Quote:
i believe i can use steel rods for yrs and not have to change the aluminum after # passes.
Aluminum rods have come a long ways. The days of 200 laps and out and no street use are gone. A modern aluminum rod, like a GRP will last a long time and can be run on the street. They're also much more forgiving in a engine failure. Just my 
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Re: rod,stroke opinions for roots KP440?
[Re: CompWedgeEngines]
#504531
10/23/09 02:55 PM
10/23/09 02:55 PM
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Joined: Jul 2005
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ELYRIA,OH
blownzoom440
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Quote:
Just curious, why arent you just asking Scotty?
Blocks look nice BTW, been reseraching them a bit, looks stout.
i will get around to talking to scott but i need some brain power so i atleast sound like i might know even the smallest amount so i can relate to what he will say.
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Post deleted by Defbob
[Re: Moparteacher]
#504533
10/23/09 03:10 PM
10/23/09 03:10 PM
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Re: rod,stroke opinions for roots KP440?
#504534
10/23/09 03:12 PM
10/23/09 03:12 PM
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Michigan
Hemiroid
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Quote:
Quote:
Cunningham Rods.
Absolutely. Finish off the bottom end with a Fonzie crank, Potsy bearings, Mr. C. oiling system, and Joanie blower pistons with Chachi wrist pins.
 
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Re: rod,stroke opinions for roots KP440?
#504536
10/23/09 03:14 PM
10/23/09 03:14 PM
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Joined: Jul 2005
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ELYRIA,OH
blownzoom440
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Quote:
Quote:
Cunningham Rods.
Absolutely. Finish off the bottom end with a Fonzie crank, Potsy bearings, Mr. C. oiling system, and Joanie blower pistons with Chachi wrist pins.
LOL! 
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Re: rod,stroke opinions for roots KP440?
[Re: blownzoom440]
#504537
10/23/09 06:20 PM
10/23/09 06:20 PM
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Rock Springs
Bob_Coomer
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I wouldnt go with a 4.5 stroke for that motor..Its just not needed.
I would do a 4.25 stroke, and 4.5 bore...makes 540 inchs.
Whats the reason you are only going with a 4.35 bore?
If your not wanting to max the block out the first go around, do what i did. I went with a 4.44 bore. This was with a Indy Maxx block, in case something happened I have extra cylinder walls thickness for a few overbores.
[color:"red"]65 Hemi Belvedere coming soon [/color]
[color:"#00FF00"]557" Indy engine 1.07 60ft 144mph in the 8th 2100 lbs package [/color]
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Re: rod,stroke opinions for roots KP440?
[Re: Bob_Coomer]
#504538
10/23/09 06:29 PM
10/23/09 06:29 PM
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communist bloc of new jersey
jamesc
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Quote:
If your not wanting to max the block out the first go around, do what i did. I went with a 4.44 bore. This was with a Indy Maxx block, in case something happened I have extra cylinder walls thickness for a few overbores.
given the bb bore spacing limitations i could never understand why people insist on going right to a 4.5" bore. 4.44 is what i went with. i know i've seen bores over 4.5" but the gasket purchase between the cylinders gets pretty thin imho
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Re: rod,stroke opinions for roots KP440?
[Re: Bob_Coomer]
#504539
10/23/09 06:50 PM
10/23/09 06:50 PM
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ELYRIA,OH
blownzoom440
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call the bore whatever you want.i think the stroke hase more effect on my combo.
Last edited by METAL STORM; 10/23/09 06:54 PM.
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Post deleted by Defbob
[Re: Bob_Coomer]
#504540
10/23/09 09:32 PM
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Re: rod,stroke opinions for roots KP440?
[Re: blownzoom440]
#504544
10/23/09 10:58 PM
10/23/09 10:58 PM
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Joined: Aug 2008
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West Central Wi.
1969 HEMI R-T
mopar
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mopar
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on the aluminum rods. I have had a set of alm rods in my Hemi for years now. I am going to remove them soon. but they worked fine for me!! since (1988)!!
HEMI,S ARE FOREVER!!!
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Re: rod,stroke opinions for roots KP440?
[Re: dodgeboy11]
#504548
10/24/09 12:13 AM
10/24/09 12:13 AM
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Joined: Jul 2005
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ELYRIA,OH
blownzoom440
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Quote:
If it's supercharged, the big bore isn't necessary. Valve shrouding isn't as important when there's more than atmospheric pressure pushing in the air.
With that being said, why are you smothering it with B1BS heads that only flow 325 if you're putting new heads on it?
no silly those are the better heads.i have iron 346 that flow 280 now! 
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Re: rod,stroke opinions for roots KP440?
[Re: blownzoom440]
#504551
10/24/09 10:10 AM
10/24/09 10:10 AM
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 2,172
Ohio
theclutcher
top fuel
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fill a kp block on a budget?
Why waste the $$$ on cheap internals and risk the block?
Carrillo rods and Callies or billet crank.
heads wil be fine just add a few more teeth if needed.
youll be blowin the tires off anyway you do it.
I'd do 4.25 stroke.
Last edited by theclutcher; 10/24/09 10:37 AM.
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Re: rod,stroke opinions for roots KP440?
[Re: bigtimeauto]
#504554
10/24/09 11:52 AM
10/24/09 11:52 AM
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ELYRIA,OH
blownzoom440
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thanks for your input! untel i could save some $$ for thye package i think i can use a 4.15 crank with my[in use] eagle H rods 6.760 with my wiseco pistons 2.050CH with my 95cc chamber headss and adjust the CR with the copper head gasket. i need to do the math on the CR but i can get a .100 head gasket.
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Post deleted by Defbob
[Re: bigtimeauto]
#504555
10/24/09 12:12 PM
10/24/09 12:12 PM
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Re: rod,stroke opinions for roots KP440?
#504556
10/24/09 12:25 PM
10/24/09 12:25 PM
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Joined: Jun 2007
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Plymouth Meeting, PA
bigtimeauto
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less piston speed. It will make plenty of power without the stroke.
BB, TT5,Procharged 3300lb Street Car 4.79/154
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Re: rod,stroke opinions for roots KP440?
[Re: bigtimeauto]
#504557
10/24/09 01:10 PM
10/24/09 01:10 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 903
Saskatchewan, Canada
cudabin
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Not a blown application in my case, but I chose to build a 540ci w/ 4.5 bore and 4.25 stroke in my new Low deck indy Max block. Could have built a 557" or 572" for the same money... Reasons were that my 440-1 CNC 345 int volume heads (flow 382 at .800")really could not support any more than 900 hp no matter what approach,so I felt that the shorter stroke would rev higher before the heads became the limiting factor and this would allow deeper rear gears for more torque multiplication. Also i am traction sensitive with mini tubs and 10.5W X 31 slicks and ladder bars, so the shorter stroke should soften the bottom end torque and add it back on the top end... If I would have had a chassis that could handle it, i would have built the 572 and then later upgraded the heads. Choose the bore/stroke/size on what ever your final objective is but be realistic as to if you can hook it up. My two cents Arnie
67 Cuda 8.48@ 158.7 mph 1.18 60' 2,600 DA(so far...)
70 Super Bee 440 Six Pack 4-speed. 13.2 @ 104 Stock exhaust/Street tires.
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Re: rod,stroke opinions for roots KP440?
[Re: blownzoom440]
#504558
10/24/09 05:46 PM
10/24/09 05:46 PM
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Joined: Jun 2007
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Plymouth Meeting, PA
bigtimeauto
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Quote:
call the bore whatever you want.i think the stroke hase more effect on my combo.
Wrong, the bigger the bore the more the heads will like it.
Flow your heads on a 3.75 bore ring then on a 4.5 bore ring. After that you will never use a small bore again.
I'm a big fan of the shortest deck, biggest bore, shortest pushrod i can get. After that design a piston ring package and then pick a rod length to connect the 2. Do not forget you have boost so you do not need nor want a long stroke. Since i drive my dart on the street I am even using regular size rings.
BB, TT5,Procharged 3300lb Street Car 4.79/154
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Re: rod,stroke opinions for roots KP440?
[Re: bigtimeauto]
#504559
10/24/09 06:04 PM
10/24/09 06:04 PM
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Joined: Jul 2005
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ELYRIA,OH
blownzoom440
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thanks for the replies.
so many of the boosted engine are in the 500 range like top fuel it makes you think.there are a lot of boosted engines in the outlaw 10.5 and so on but i dont know of there ci.
i am sure the head flow has some influance and the reason for my question.
Last edited by METAL STORM; 10/24/09 06:27 PM.
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Re: rod,stroke opinions for roots KP440?
[Re: blownzoom440]
#504561
10/25/09 08:27 AM
10/25/09 08:27 AM
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Joined: Mar 2005
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Ohio
theclutcher
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air flow is what makes the power.
the displacement dictates the rpm that is needed to utilize the airflow.
Last edited by theclutcher; 10/25/09 08:28 AM.
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Re: rod,stroke opinions for roots KP440?
[Re: blownzoom440]
#504563
10/25/09 10:19 AM
10/25/09 10:19 AM
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Ohio
theclutcher
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Need to talk to somebody with blower info.
Start adding boost and too many other factors come into play.
Ever talk to Dave Weber in North Ridgeville?
He might be able to give you some insight.
Him or Lou Novotny.
Local guys with lots of blower exp. in UDRA/NHRA
Lou ran blown BB mopar for long time and still playing with some exotic stuff.
Dave has competitive TAD.
Brains and experience well worth picking, in fact, irreplacable.
Last edited by theclutcher; 10/25/09 10:26 AM.
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Post deleted by Defbob
[Re: blownzoom440]
#504564
10/25/09 10:27 AM
10/25/09 10:27 AM
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Re: rod,stroke opinions for roots KP440?
#504565
10/25/09 11:42 AM
10/25/09 11:42 AM
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Joined: Jul 2005
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ELYRIA,OH
blownzoom440
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Quote:
Quote:
even with the better block i am not interested in more rpm.[6800] 
What if you stepped up to the B1 heads, instead of those smaller B1BS heads? You might have to get another manifold, tho.
i dont want to have to switch valvetrain,pushrods...to port match my intake to the bigger b1's may not be easy.my HP goal is small also so i only need a little better heads.a lot to think about.
i know dave weber pritty well.he did my block o-ring and ballance work.this was before i knew koffels.
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Re: rod,stroke opinions for roots KP440?
[Re: blownzoom440]
#504566
10/25/09 12:48 PM
10/25/09 12:48 PM
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Joined: Jun 2007
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Plymouth Meeting, PA
bigtimeauto
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I run 440-1's, 345 cnc'd 2.25 intake valve out of the box from indy, 23lbs of boost. If i would have built this from the begining my way it would have had a 4" crank in it.
Right now I am leaving the starting line with 4* of timing and ramping the timing in over the next 2.5 seconds. I shift at 6800 and go thru around 7200. I run a 29.5/10.5 tire.
BB, TT5,Procharged 3300lb Street Car 4.79/154
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Re: rod,stroke opinions for roots KP440?
[Re: bigtimeauto]
#504569
10/26/09 03:43 PM
10/26/09 03:43 PM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 12,592
Great Neck,LI,new york
hemi-itis
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Quote:
I run 440-1's, 345 cnc'd 2.25 intake valve out of the box from indy, 23lbs of boost. If i would have built this from the begining my way it would have had a 4" crank in it.
Right now I am leaving the starting line with 4* of timing and ramping the timing in over the next 2.5 seconds. I shift at 6800 and go thru around 7200. I run a 29.5/10.5 tire.
Is 23 lbs of procharger boost the same as 23 lbs of roots boost??I am still limited to 5 lbs of boost  ,,,,,,,,for now  
HEMI-ITIS has no cure.
My condition is fully BLOWN!!
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Re: rod,stroke opinions for roots KP440?
[Re: theclutcher]
#504570
10/26/09 05:36 PM
10/26/09 05:36 PM
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ELYRIA,OH
blownzoom440
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Quote:
Weber was making near 40 on his sbc years back.
Dont know what they run now.
What psi koffels run?
dave is using a 460+ cu in motor has alan johnson heads and i am sure runs more than 55lbs that the monster runs.he uses a screw blower also[weber]
hemi itis quit choking that engine and get some bigger carbs.  match my 2x 1250's 
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Dave you are too much...
