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Re: An honest eval from an EV owner 1 year in [Re: Powerflow] #3141334
04/29/23 10:18 AM
04/29/23 10:18 AM
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rust belt
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Moparite Offline
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rust belt
Regardless of what you think of EV's the first problem is someone needs to make one that has LOOKS! Ugly 4 door car/suv is not even in the ball park. They need to make a EV that has looks first and foremost before someone would even think about buying one. Instead they compete in who can make the ugliest one! Sorry I'm not driving a turd even though it costs me pennies to drive. Turd and a EV painted brown have a lot of similarity's.

Check out this link

Quote
Not gonna happen if the EV in question looks like a piece of turd.
up

Re: An honest eval from an EV owner 1 year in [Re: Moparite] #3141336
04/29/23 10:22 AM
04/29/23 10:22 AM
Joined: Feb 2022
Posts: 1,196
Nor here, Nor there
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Dart 500 Offline
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Nor here, Nor there
Not sure if true but heard you cannot oil spray an EV (obvious reasons). But isn't that convenient. It'll be rotting out just in time for the battery to die and the entire hulk be worthless

Re: An honest eval from an EV owner 1 year in [Re: Sniper] #3141363
04/29/23 01:39 PM
04/29/23 01:39 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,151
Canada -- Posts: 4034 -Registe...
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5thAve Offline
Doesn't care what this says anyway
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Originally Posted by Sniper
You are not going to get much heat out of an IC vehicle heater at minus 35C either, you can try the cardboard trick, but good luck getting a piece in there with today's cars.


Never had problem getting heat when it's -35 out, it doesn't take much longer to start blowing warm just takes a bit longer to actually warm up the inside of the car.

Re: An honest eval from an EV owner 1 year in [Re: 5thAve] #3141365
04/29/23 02:15 PM
04/29/23 02:15 PM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 4,984
new jersey usa
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11secdart Offline
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new jersey usa
My nephew had a Tesla ( I don't know the model , the cheaper one ) He liked it ran it for about a year and sold it at a nice profit and went back to a gas powered vehicle. I can see the appeal of an EV as a second car there are a lot of Teslas around here in North Jersey , If someone made an EV that was reasonably priced under $20,000 I would consider one just to try it and see . I agree about the charging every time I pass a rest area on the N.J. turnpike or a WAWA ( convenience store / gas station ) all of the charging stations are in use.


68 Dart 410 / 904
92 D150 original owner
21 Ram 1500 Quad Cab, Big Horn , Hemi ,4x4
23 Audi Q5
16 Honda HRV
Re: An honest eval from an EV owner 1 year in [Re: TJP] #3141408
04/29/23 08:03 PM
04/29/23 08:03 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 31,042
Oregon
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AndyF Offline
I Win
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Posts: 31,042
Oregon
I've been driving an EV for 6 years now and they are fantastic as long as you stay well within range. If you have to go outside of range then the EV experience gets sucky really quick. Extreme temps reduce the range and so does driving fast or rapid acceleration.

Re: An honest eval from an EV owner 1 year in [Re: AndyF] #3141427
04/29/23 10:02 PM
04/29/23 10:02 PM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 4,946
WI
Dcuda69 Offline
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WI
My wife drives 2 miles/day. Should be the ideal setup for an EV...right? But....my kids live a couple hundred miles away...so that makes the EV less desirable. Of course we could take my 15 mpg truck to see my kids but that defeats the purpose of the EV...right? I could buy a 3rd car with an ICE but that also defeats the purpose of the EV. The little fuel the wife burns in her commute is nothing but yet that's where the EV shines. So what's the purpose of the EV again?????

Last edited by Dcuda69; 04/29/23 10:04 PM.
Re: An honest eval from an EV owner 1 year in [Re: Dcuda69] #3141437
04/30/23 12:36 AM
04/30/23 12:36 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,574
Freeport IL USA
poorboy Offline
I Live Here
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Originally Posted by Dcuda69
My wife drives 2 miles/day. Should be the ideal setup for an EV...right? But....my kids live a couple hundred miles away...so that makes the EV less desirable. Of course we could take my 15 mpg truck to see my kids but that defeats the purpose of the EV...right? I could buy a 3rd car with an ICE but that also defeats the purpose of the EV. The little fuel the wife burns in her commute is nothing but yet that's where the EV shines. So what's the purpose of the EV again?????


the purpose of an EV?
An EV has to very important purposes.
1) EVs are designed to transfer funds. From your hand to the government as taxes and the EV manufacturer to purchase the product. From the Federal Government to the EV companies as tax incentives and environment credits. From the EV manufacturers to the government in the form of donations for government funded programs and campaign funding.

2) To allow the government more control over your life by limiting the number of miles you can travel, the conditions you travel in, and the frequency in which you can travel in the form of battery charge limitations and charging time. Then once you have your personal transportation limited the an EV and its travel limitations, you give the government the ability to limit the amount of electricity you can use the charge your EV through the power grid limitation and the control of how much electric you can use during a given time..Not only have you given the government control over how far you can travel, but also how frequently you can travel, and when you can travel, you have also given the government the chance to monitor where you travel, and how long you stay there.

Re: An honest eval from an EV owner 1 year in [Re: poorboy] #3141440
04/30/23 12:43 AM
04/30/23 12:43 AM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 18,493
Granite Bay CA
Kern Dog Offline
Striving for excellence
Kern Dog  Offline
Striving for excellence

Joined: Feb 2010
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Granite Bay CA
Fact.^^^^

Re: An honest eval from an EV owner 1 year in [Re: poorboy] #3141456
04/30/23 06:45 AM
04/30/23 06:45 AM
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 5,461
Michigan
O
oldjonny Offline
Don't argue with me.
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Michigan
Originally Posted by poorboy
Originally Posted by Dcuda69
My wife drives 2 miles/day. Should be the ideal setup for an EV...right? But....my kids live a couple hundred miles away...so that makes the EV less desirable. Of course we could take my 15 mpg truck to see my kids but that defeats the purpose of the EV...right? I could buy a 3rd car with an ICE but that also defeats the purpose of the EV. The little fuel the wife burns in her commute is nothing but yet that's where the EV shines. So what's the purpose of the EV again?????


the purpose of an EV?
An EV has to very important purposes.
1) EVs are designed to transfer funds. From your hand to the government as taxes and the EV manufacturer to purchase the product. From the Federal Government to the EV companies as tax incentives and environment credits. From the EV manufacturers to the government in the form of donations for government funded programs and campaign funding.

2) To allow the government more control over your life by limiting the number of miles you can travel, the conditions you travel in, and the frequency in which you can travel in the form of battery charge limitations and charging time. Then once you have your personal transportation limited the an EV and its travel limitations, you give the government the ability to limit the amount of electricity you can use the charge your EV through the power grid limitation and the control of how much electric you can use during a given time..Not only have you given the government control over how far you can travel, but also how frequently you can travel, and when you can travel, you have also given the government the chance to monitor where you travel, and how long you stay there.


Above is all true.

The Amish are closer to correct than EV.....BUT they still need the "English" to use their ICE vehicles to get them to see relatives, get to job sites, etc.


Never, ever argue with an IDIOT. They will drag you to their level and then beat you with their years of experience
Re: An honest eval from an EV owner 1 year in [Re: oldjonny] #3141458
04/30/23 07:09 AM
04/30/23 07:09 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,027
Tulsa OK
Bad340fish Offline
master
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Posts: 8,027
Tulsa OK
They for sure have a place, my wife could drive one no problem. 3-4 mile commute and around 10K miles per year. When we go on a road trip we seldom go more than a few hours away. We could easily do one of our quick family road trips in the range of a Tesla, worst case 1 charge out on the road.

I occasionally shop the Model Ys. But when looking in that price range I am easily distracted by used SRT Grand Cherokees.


68 Barracuda Formula S 340
Re: An honest eval from an EV owner 1 year in [Re: Powerflow] #3141555
04/30/23 04:16 PM
04/30/23 04:16 PM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 8,162
USA
3
360view Offline
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USA
Originally Posted by Powerflow
360view wrote: " My mechanical engineering senior class’s assigned “capstone” project was to split into 5 person teams and design flywheel powered vehicles to transfer suitcases from passenger terminals to and from airliners."

I had a similar Mechanical Engineering senior project when I went to college. Does the name 'Oerlikon Gyrobus' ring a bell? Those were flywheel-powered city buses that came out in Switzerland around 1951. They were used many years in Europe and later in South America. I never understood why the technology never caught on.


Gyrobus rings a bell!

Flywheels are very interesting.

Buckytube composite super high strength spokes
and super dense super strong depleted Uranium flywheel rims
would be a new “twist” on an old invention.

Last time I thought about flywheel science on moparts
was when discussing how to measure the power losses to friction
inside transmission, driveshaft, u -joints, differentials and axles.
for not much money.

I originally thought this required expensive special equipment,
but some engineers showed how to do this on the cheap:

Wheels with tires are “flywheels”.
Wheels filled with water instead of air are flywheels that store more energy at the same RPM.

jack the rear of a vehicle up so the rear wheels are off the pavement.

Run the “up in the air” drivetrain up to some speedometer reading like 50 MPH.
Time how long it takes to coast “in neutral” to a lower speedometer reading like 10 MPH.

Do this at other speedometer readings like 70 MPH coasting down 5 MPH.

Repeat with wheels filled with water.

This creates multiple equations,
multiple coast down times,
and can be mathematically solved to find
multiple “unknown friction percentages” for transmission losses, differential losses, etc.

One last “tricky” step.

You need to know the “Rotational Inertia constant” of these tire flywheels,
commonly called Ir.

Ir for an air filled tire will be a lesser amount than a water filled tire.

You can measure this Ir in a simple cheap tricky way
by rigidly attaching a long, but very thin diameter threaded steel rod to the center of a wheel using two nuts,
then rigidly attaching the other end of the threaded steel rod with two more tightened nuts to something high up
like a
garage ceiling,
basketball goal post, etc.

A small threaded rod 1/8 inch to 1/2 inch diameter
and 60 to 72 inches long
is typical.

The thin rod is scientifically a
“torsion bar spring”
just like Mother Mopar was fond of.

Have a stop watch ready to time.
Get the right size Torque wrench.

Use a torque wrench on a bolt to twist the wheel 90 degrees,
write down the torque,
then let go by quickly pulling the torque wrench off while starting the stop watch.

The wheel will now do the “wiggle twist” dance
rotating back slightly less than 180 degrees,
come to a stop,
begin a swing back less degrees than before to the other side,
come to a stop,
reverse direction, and so on.....

Stopwatch time 6 to 12 of these oscillations.

There is a physics formula to calculate the Ir of the wheel
from the torque first applied and the time to do one oscillation.

Old fashioned wind up wrist watches had an oscillating flywheel like this inside.

Now repeat with a water filled wheel.

Repeat with a wheel filled with calcium chloride saturated water, etc.

Or just repeat with heavier wheels or bigger heavier tires.

Re: An honest eval from an EV owner 1 year in [Re: 360view] #3141561
04/30/23 04:45 PM
04/30/23 04:45 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,151
Canada -- Posts: 4034 -Registe...
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5thAve Offline
Doesn't care what this says anyway
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This is why to me hybrids should be what is pushed. At least for them you don't have the distance worry so they would be more practical for most people to get into.

Re: An honest eval from an EV owner 1 year in [Re: Moparite] #3141646
04/30/23 11:24 PM
04/30/23 11:24 PM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,215
Someplace you aren't
S
SomeCarGuy Offline
I Live Here
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Posts: 10,215
Someplace you aren't
Originally Posted by Moparite
Regardless of what you think of EV's the first problem is someone needs to make one that has LOOKS! Ugly 4 door car/suv is not even in the ball park. They need to make a EV that has looks first and foremost before someone would even think about buying one. Instead they compete in who can make the ugliest one! Sorry I'm not driving a turd even though it costs me pennies to drive. Turd and a EV painted brown have a lot of similarity's.

Check out this link

Quote
Not gonna happen if the EV in question looks like a piece of turd.
up


I agree and the weirdest thing so far is that Buick nailed a design…and released it saying they won’t build it. Would’ve been a GREAT halo car with ICE or EV. But no, ball drop from gm, about usual.


I want my fair share
Re: An honest eval from an EV owner 1 year in [Re: Powerflow] #3141674
05/01/23 08:58 AM
05/01/23 08:58 AM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 8,162
USA
3
360view Offline
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360view  Offline
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Posts: 8,162
USA
Originally Posted by Powerflow
360view wrote: " My mechanical engineering senior class’s assigned “capstone” project was to split into 5 person teams and design flywheel powered vehicles to transfer suitcases from passenger terminals to and from airliners."

I had a similar Mechanical Engineering senior project when I went to college. Does the name 'Oerlikon Gyrobus' ring a bell? Those were flywheel-powered city buses that came out in Switzerland around 1951. They were used many years in Europe and later in South America. I never understood why the technology never caught on.


It is worth noting that the US Federal Gov is not presently giving huge tax subsidies to
Flywheel vehicles
Compressed air vehicles.

That technology actually has another advantage:
an “electro-magnetic pulse” or EMP does not stop mechanical parts from working.

Re: An honest eval from an EV owner 1 year in [Re: 360view] #3141747
05/01/23 01:24 PM
05/01/23 01:24 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 11,500
delivering your oil
nutso suave Offline
I Live Here
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I Live Here

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delivering your oil
It seems like the EV craze is here to stay, the pendulum has swung in that direction. EVs make sense in the city, where most people commute 30-40 miles and park all day. When the electrical infrastructure is enhanced to support the charging of all these cars, the pollution in urban areas will be decreased significantly. It makes sense to have a generating station with emissions filters and scrubbers instead of having tiny ones on every vehicle. That being said, the technology is evolving so fast that it's risky to get into the market and get a lemon. It also doesn't make sense to outlaw gas/diesel vehicles - what about us rural dwellers that need to drive long distances and tow? I feel like rational discussion and reasonable regulation could create a situation where a pollution is reduced in populated areas and combustion engine vehicles aren't outlawed completely. I'm probably dreaming....:0

I also am impressed by the performance aspects of some of the EVs. That weird looking rivian truck is as fast as a BMW M5 or a hellcat. Crazy!

Re: An honest eval from an EV owner 1 year in [Re: nutso suave] #3141875
05/01/23 09:25 PM
05/01/23 09:25 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 3,318
Southern Maryland
klunick Offline
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Posts: 3,318
Southern Maryland
All good points Nutso. That said, I'd still love to see all sorts of lawsuits against the gov, specifically the exec branch, for believing they can "Mandate" anything in this country. That would be the job of the Legislative side and trying to use the 1970 Clean Air act powers is a real reach. The Government has No business picking "Winners and Losers". This should have happened some time ago. I'm sure the Rivians excel is great, but how long could you drive it like that also. Saw my first one about 2 weeks ago. Looks just like that Honda half truck. Useful for garbage runs out here in the country but that is about it. As others have stated, EVs may well be the future, but not these EVs. An EV with at least 500 mile range and a battery about the size of a briefcase. You look at Computers, it is doable, but realistically, probably 25-40 years out. 7 states have decided to follow CA and ban new ICE vehicle sales by 2035. That is simply not realistic and perhaps a step way too far. Already, while moving certain goods, I am told that we have trucks that drive to the CA border for DoD and then sit and wait for a CA legal Semi to come to the border to pick up the load. That is insane, effects not only national defense, but also trips the federal gov because it now also effects commerce.


67 Barracuda FB 69 Superbee "Southern Maryland: If you want a good looking woman, you had better bring her with you"
Re: An honest eval from an EV owner 1 year in [Re: poorboy] #3141916
05/02/23 08:26 AM
05/02/23 08:26 AM
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 877
Pittsburgh, Pa
J
Jeff_383 Offline
super stock
Jeff_383  Offline
super stock
J

Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 877
Pittsburgh, Pa
Originally Posted by poorboy
[quote=Dcuda69]My wife drives 2 miles/day. Should be the ideal setup for an EV...right? But....my kids live a couple hundred miles away...so that makes the EV less desirable. Of course we could take my 15 mpg truck to see my kids but that defeats the purpose of the EV...right? I could buy a 3rd car with an ICE but that also defeats the purpose of the EV. The little fuel the wife burns in her commute is nothing but yet that's where the EV shines. So what's the purpose of the EV again?????


the purpose of an EV?
An EV has to very important purposes.
1) EVs are designed to transfer funds. From your hand to the government as taxes and the EV manufacturer to purchase the product. From the Federal Government to the EV companies as tax incentives and environment credits. From the EV manufacturers to the government in the form of donations for government funded programs and campaign funding.

2) To allow the government more control over your life by limiting the number of miles you can travel, the conditions you travel in, and the frequency in which you can travel in the form of battery charge limitations and charging time. Then once you have your personal transportation limited the an EV and its travel limitations, you give the government the ability to limit the amount of electricity you can use the charge your EV through the power grid limitation and the control of how much electric you can use during a given time..Not only have you given the government control over how far you can travel, but also how frequently you can travel, and when you can travel, you have also given the government the chance to monitor where you travel, and how long you stay there.


..........These are the real reasons, he gets it.

Re: An honest eval from an EV owner 1 year in [Re: Jeff_383] #3141943
05/02/23 10:17 AM
05/02/23 10:17 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 11,500
delivering your oil
nutso suave Offline
I Live Here
nutso suave  Offline
I Live Here

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Posts: 11,500
delivering your oil
I feel like there is a parallel to the early 70s here...I was not born yet, but my understanding is that the government mandated emissions/mpg and safety regulations that were not possible to meet with the technology of the time. The result was 10 years of crappy cars but it forced manufacturers to develop modern style fuel injection, better brake technology, more efficient engines, safer cars, etc. The manufacturers are being forced to develop these EVs right now and they are kind of like those forgettable econoboxes (remember the chevy chevette!) from the 70s. I would shy away from buying one until they get the bugs worked out - the fact that they can't drive in freezing weather, battery life is question, charge rates are variable and inconsistent, etc. I think once battery technology levels out and battery reconditioning/rebuilding becomes affordable and more universal EV ownership will be more practical.

Re: An honest eval from an EV owner 1 year in [Re: nutso suave] #3141947
05/02/23 10:33 AM
05/02/23 10:33 AM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,918
Calgary, Alberta Canada
a12rag Offline
master
a12rag  Offline
master

Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,918
Calgary, Alberta Canada
Last week I flew into Vancouver, BC for meetings . . .rented a car - Hertz rental had a "Tesla 3" for rent . . .uhh, nope . . . I have NO IDEA where the damn charging sites are . . . and, do I have to bring it back "fully charged" ??? . . . just easier to rent a "regular" vehicle

Re: An honest eval from an EV owner 1 year in [Re: nutso suave] #3141978
05/02/23 12:21 PM
05/02/23 12:21 PM
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 19,421
north of coder
moparx Offline
"Butt Crack Bob"
moparx  Offline
"Butt Crack Bob"

Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 19,421
north of coder
ah, the ol' chevy "shove it"........ laugh2
beer

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