Re: Windage Trays...for big blocks
[Re: Brad_Haak]
#3097828
11/28/22 02:39 PM
11/28/22 02:39 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 7,615 Minnesota
Hemi_Joel
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 7,615
Minnesota
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I've used that plastic Summit windage tray. What I like about it is that is has an integral gasket. I didn't think it had enuff louvers, so I made more with a torch and a knife. I have not heard of any dyno testing on the Summit tray, so who knows if it's any good? A little windage tray trivia: (non-Mopar, so the faint of heart better hit the back button now) By the late 1920's the Duesenberg brothers had 15 years of successful racing experience. Their cars/engines had won the Indy 500 3 times, and they were the only American car manufacturer to ever win the French Grand Prix at Lemans. So they knew what they were doing. Yet I was surprised when I pulled the oil pan off my '29 Duesenberg to find a windage tray. It had a shape formed on one side to gather the oil and send it down thru holes, thru a screen, into the pan. I wonder how long they had been using windage trays, and how much of an advantage it may have given them. Their most successful competitor was Miller, and I don't think that the barrel crankcase of a Miller (like an Offy) would allow for a windage tray. On the off chance that anyone is bored, here is my painfully long and poorly produced video of the oil pan windage tray removal. https://youtu.be/jpIxtB8zfC8
[img]http://i.imgur.com/boeexFms.jpg[/img]31 Plymouth Coupe, 392 Hemi, T56 magnum RS23J71 RS27J77 RP23J71 RO23J71 WM21J8A I don't regret the things I've done. I only regret the things I didn't do. "Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools because they have to say something. ~ Plato"
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Re: Windage Trays...for big blocks
[Re: Hemi_Joel]
#3097831
11/28/22 02:45 PM
11/28/22 02:45 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,130 MN
JERICOGTX
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,130
MN
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On the off chance that anyone is bored, here is my painfully long and poorly produced video of the oil pan windage tray removal. https://youtu.be/jpIxtB8zfC8 That video is so old, I'm surprised it's not in Black and White. When will we ever see the oil pan go back on???
69 GTX
68 Road Runner
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Re: Windage Trays...for big blocks
[Re: JERICOGTX]
#3097842
11/28/22 03:34 PM
11/28/22 03:34 PM
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 20,742 north of coder
moparx
Buying your homeless and unwanted bolt on battery terminals
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Buying your homeless and unwanted bolt on battery terminals
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 20,742
north of coder
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On the off chance that anyone is bored, here is my painfully long and poorly produced video of the oil pan windage tray removal. https://youtu.be/jpIxtB8zfC8 That video is so old, I'm surprised it's not in Black and White. When will we ever see the oil pan go back on??? i did grow a "slight" beard watching that video.............. however, it was interesting, because i have never seen inside one of those engines.
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Re: Windage Trays...for big blocks
[Re: JERICOGTX]
#3097865
11/28/22 04:57 PM
11/28/22 04:57 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,022 A shed in England
Tig
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,022
A shed in England
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Those scrapers are nice. To bad I never received the one I ordered a year ago.
Hmm....I ordered one for a 5.00 stroke in 2016, no sign as yet despite repeated emails.
'74 Challenger..9.46 @ 145.9 1/4, 6.001 @ 118 1/8 so far. 4023lb !!! # N/A, Marsh performance 655ci, Indy Maxx, T/R, Indy 600-13 X's, Street legal, pump gas, full interior, Cal-Tracs, mufflers, 3:73's and real 10.5 radials. 9.51 @ 142.4 1/4, 6.003 @ 114 1/8 with our old mule KB, 572-13, 580 wedge. RHD '68 Barracuda Fastback 323ci street/strip. Best ET 13.88 @ 99.03
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Re: Windage Trays...for big blocks
[Re: Tig]
#3097907
11/28/22 06:55 PM
11/28/22 06:55 PM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 44,094 Bend,OR USA
Cab_Burge
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 44,094
Bend,OR USA
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Last edited by Cab_Burge; 11/28/22 06:58 PM.
Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
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Re: Windage Trays...for big blocks
[Re: Cab_Burge]
#3097918
11/28/22 07:20 PM
11/28/22 07:20 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,022 A shed in England
Tig
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,022
A shed in England
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I've thought about it, but I'm $550 in as I sent the money up front for "materials". I'm not sure if I'm being or have been scammed
'74 Challenger..9.46 @ 145.9 1/4, 6.001 @ 118 1/8 so far. 4023lb !!! # N/A, Marsh performance 655ci, Indy Maxx, T/R, Indy 600-13 X's, Street legal, pump gas, full interior, Cal-Tracs, mufflers, 3:73's and real 10.5 radials. 9.51 @ 142.4 1/4, 6.003 @ 114 1/8 with our old mule KB, 572-13, 580 wedge. RHD '68 Barracuda Fastback 323ci street/strip. Best ET 13.88 @ 99.03
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Re: Windage Trays...for big blocks
[Re: Hot 340]
#3097947
11/28/22 09:32 PM
11/28/22 09:32 PM
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Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,221 New York
polyspheric
master
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master
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,221
New York
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IMHO the tray's vertical position should be as far from the crank's rotation depth as practical (deeper with a deep pan, etc.), but enough above the (resting) oil level so that WOT acceleration & panic braking don't submerge one end of the tray. For 14 second cars this is overkill, but @ 11.0 or less (WAG) you need it. Vertical baffles in the pan floor can act as dams to remedy sloshing on both ends, remember to add vents at the pan-dam join to allow drainage.
Kevin is really smart, has done lots of work, makes a nice product.
Boffin Emeritus
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Re: Windage Trays...for big blocks
[Re: mopar dave]
#3097993
11/29/22 04:47 AM
11/29/22 04:47 AM
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 515 Temperance, MI
68 HEMI GTS
mopar
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mopar
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 515
Temperance, MI
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I’m also using a scraper, and a spacer for the tray and pan. And some drain returns I made for the hemi.
Last edited by 68 HEMI GTS; 11/29/22 04:48 AM.
68 Dart GTS "HEMI" 10.30 @ 131 pump gas street car 3780# 69 Roadrunner 511 six pack 10.92 drive to track street car
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Re: Windage Trays...for big blocks
[Re: mopar dave]
#3098067
11/29/22 11:42 AM
11/29/22 11:42 AM
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 515 Temperance, MI
68 HEMI GTS
mopar
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mopar
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 515
Temperance, MI
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Where did you get that scraper? I have been watching episodes of engine masters finding power in windage control. They found 8 hp in a windage tray, but found 22hp in a custom Moroso pan. The pan had kick outs close to the rail. The extra power is found over 5500rpm. I would be interested in a scraper for sure, the windage tray i will have to give that more thought as my 572 is not an all out max hp deal. http://www.crank-scrapers.com/This is also the same company people are saying they didn’t get their stuff. I know I ordered mine and it didn’t show up when he said. I called atleast once or maybe twice additionally before I got it.
68 Dart GTS "HEMI" 10.30 @ 131 pump gas street car 3780# 69 Roadrunner 511 six pack 10.92 drive to track street car
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Re: Windage Trays...for big blocks
[Re: HardcoreB]
#3098090
11/29/22 01:07 PM
11/29/22 01:07 PM
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 515 Temperance, MI
68 HEMI GTS
mopar
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mopar
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 515
Temperance, MI
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Of all i have seen, I really like the one DVW is using. I think it's A REAL GOOD IDEA on a wet sump application. Mine and Doug’s are the same brand.
68 Dart GTS "HEMI" 10.30 @ 131 pump gas street car 3780# 69 Roadrunner 511 six pack 10.92 drive to track street car
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Re: Windage Trays...for big blocks
[Re: 68 HEMI GTS]
#3098119
11/29/22 02:27 PM
11/29/22 02:27 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,022 A shed in England
Tig
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,022
A shed in England
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Where did you get that scraper? I have been watching episodes of engine masters finding power in windage control. They found 8 hp in a windage tray, but found 22hp in a custom Moroso pan. The pan had kick outs close to the rail. The extra power is found over 5500rpm. I would be interested in a scraper for sure, the windage tray i will have to give that more thought as my 572 is not an all out max hp deal. http://www.crank-scrapers.com/This is also the same company people are saying they didn’t get their stuff. I know I ordered mine and it didn’t show up when he said. I called atleast once or maybe twice additionally before I got it. I ordered mine in 2016 I'm regularly in contact via email, sometimes I get a reply, sometimes I don't. I haven't been able to catch him on the phone but have spoke to his wife who said he would return my call..... it didn't happen.
'74 Challenger..9.46 @ 145.9 1/4, 6.001 @ 118 1/8 so far. 4023lb !!! # N/A, Marsh performance 655ci, Indy Maxx, T/R, Indy 600-13 X's, Street legal, pump gas, full interior, Cal-Tracs, mufflers, 3:73's and real 10.5 radials. 9.51 @ 142.4 1/4, 6.003 @ 114 1/8 with our old mule KB, 572-13, 580 wedge. RHD '68 Barracuda Fastback 323ci street/strip. Best ET 13.88 @ 99.03
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Re: Windage Trays...for big blocks
[Re: Tig]
#3098138
11/29/22 03:14 PM
11/29/22 03:14 PM
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 515 Temperance, MI
68 HEMI GTS
mopar
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mopar
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 515
Temperance, MI
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Where did you get that scraper? I have been watching episodes of engine masters finding power in windage control. They found 8 hp in a windage tray, but found 22hp in a custom Moroso pan. The pan had kick outs close to the rail. The extra power is found over 5500rpm. I would be interested in a scraper for sure, the windage tray i will have to give that more thought as my 572 is not an all out max hp deal. http://www.crank-scrapers.com/This is also the same company people are saying they didn’t get their stuff. I know I ordered mine and it didn’t show up when he said. I called atleast once or maybe twice additionally before I got it. I ordered mine in 2016 I'm regularly in contact via email, sometimes I get a reply, sometimes I don't. I haven't been able to catch him on the phone but have spoke to his wife who said he would return my call..... it didn't happen. That really sucks. It’s a shame someone has a company that can provide an awesome product if they ran their business correctly. Makes me afraid to order anything else from them.
68 Dart GTS "HEMI" 10.30 @ 131 pump gas street car 3780# 69 Roadrunner 511 six pack 10.92 drive to track street car
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Re: Windage Trays...for big blocks
[Re: 68 HEMI GTS]
#3098164
11/29/22 04:37 PM
11/29/22 04:37 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 7,615 Minnesota
Hemi_Joel
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 7,615
Minnesota
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They do have a great product. And the guy knows his stuff and is nice to talk to on the phone, very informative. But slower than a sloth in a coma. I first attempted to contact them in march of 2014 about a 392 hemi with a 5/8 stroker for which he did not have a pattern. By April of 2016, he had sent me a test pattern, I dialed it in on the engine, and sent it back. About April of 2017 I had the scraper. By that time, the engine was apart for the 2nd time, so I final fitted and installed the scraper. Plan WAY ahead!
[img]http://i.imgur.com/boeexFms.jpg[/img]31 Plymouth Coupe, 392 Hemi, T56 magnum RS23J71 RS27J77 RP23J71 RO23J71 WM21J8A I don't regret the things I've done. I only regret the things I didn't do. "Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools because they have to say something. ~ Plato"
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Re: Windage Trays...for big blocks
[Re: mopar dave]
#3098579
12/01/22 05:55 AM
12/01/22 05:55 AM
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 292 PA
Harry's Taxi 2
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 292
PA
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I've used 2 of these.
https://bobmazzoliniracing.com/store/#!/Big-Block-Crank-Scraper/p/81474464/category=4301789
'86 Maple Grove KOS Mopar low qualifier......true street legal with no power adders.
NOS-used when losing since 1940.
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