Re: so much info on EFI. What to choose
[Re: Pyper70]
#3089783
10/27/22 11:23 PM
10/27/22 11:23 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,355 Someplace you aren't
SomeCarGuy
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,355
Someplace you aren't
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Just an opinion but I would prefer carbs over dual throttle body injection.
I went to Holley EFI/Multi-port but only because I wanted to run it on E85. I am trying to get the most out of my weekend bruiser. My fuel has consistently been over $7 a gallon here in Greece. This last weekend I killed a battery cranking for 30 minutes, removing fuel inlet pipes and filling fuel bowls with a syringe. Using starter fluid and constant cranking. I finally caught a lucky break and she kicked over....In the winter she can sit for a month and I can giver her 2 pumps and turn the key and she fires right up but the Summer was very hot here and even in my garage, the fuel evaporate after a weeks time. They are forcing me to go from Hoistorical plates to State plates and my registration goes from $40 a year to $1800 a year. So I might as well make use of the State plates and travel more with my car, get some better fuel numbers I had a Holley analog setup decades ago and it worked well, until it didn’t. I liked it and get why you’d want one. That said, if starting after sitting is a big driver for spending the money, I’d rather just dump the gas in the carbs and go on. I’m not getting taking the fuel lines loose or just filling the bowls. Gas down the throat will do it. You can buy a lot of gas for what this will cost. A lot. If saving money is the goal, add up how much gain you’d expect and how long the payback is. Be realistic as to how much you will drive. I’ve used classic big block mopars as three season drivers this century. Gas cost wasn’t as big of a deal as it might seem.
I want my fair share
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Re: so much info on EFI. What to choose
[Re: SomeCarGuy]
#3089784
10/27/22 11:39 PM
10/27/22 11:39 PM
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Joined: May 2019
Posts: 725 Lake Villa Il
INTMD8
super stock
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super stock
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 725
Lake Villa Il
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Just an opinion but I would prefer carbs over dual throttle body injection.
I went to Holley EFI/Multi-port but only because I wanted to run it on E85. I am trying to get the most out of my weekend bruiser. My fuel has consistently been over $7 a gallon here in Greece. This last weekend I killed a battery cranking for 30 minutes, removing fuel inlet pipes and filling fuel bowls with a syringe. Using starter fluid and constant cranking. I finally caught a lucky break and she kicked over....In the winter she can sit for a month and I can giver her 2 pumps and turn the key and she fires right up but the Summer was very hot here and even in my garage, the fuel evaporate after a weeks time. They are forcing me to go from Hoistorical plates to State plates and my registration goes from $40 a year to $1800 a year. So I might as well make use of the State plates and travel more with my car, get some better fuel numbers I had a Holley analog setup decades ago and it worked well, until it didn’t. I liked it and get why you’d want one. That said, if starting after sitting is a big driver for spending the money, I’d rather just dump the gas in the carbs and go on. I’m not getting taking the fuel lines loose or just filling the bowls. Gas down the throat will do it. You can buy a lot of gas for what this will cost. A lot. If saving money is the goal, add up how much gain you’d expect and how long the payback is. Be realistic as to how much you will drive. I’ve used classic big block mopars as three season drivers this century. Gas cost wasn’t as big of a deal as it might seem. Agreed on consideration if cost is the driving factor. Regardless of climate, if you're killing batteries, cranking for 30 minutes, removing fuel lines and using starter fluid.......... you have other problems that EFI will not solve. Even if 120+deg ambient, you shouldn't need to do the above.
69 Charger. 438ci Gen2 hemi. Flex fuel. Holley HP efi. 650rwhp @7250 510rwtq @5700
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Re: so much info on EFI. What to choose
[Re: INTMD8]
#3089827
10/28/22 08:16 AM
10/28/22 08:16 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,923 Athens, Greece
Pyper70
OP
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OP
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,923
Athens, Greece
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she has zero problems otherwise, she handles temps fantastic, she can lay down rubber sideways through an intersection, and most of the time I am just driving with the front 500cfm carb, picture below is with just the front carb, 70mph, 180º water, uphill, and spinning that 440 1900rpm with the Gear Vendors kicked in. I have tinkered with the thought of running an external 7psi fuel pump but quickly been disparaged by reading people who went down the road before me and ended up with burned out fuel pumps due to excessive heat. I am not doing it for money savings, is it a perk..yes but not the sole benefit. If that was the case I would put my single 4bbl Performer RPM back on with an AFB. I want to evolve her, bring her more up to date with technology. There is a group here called SpeedSector who drive around Europe and participate in endurance races and I would like to be able to join that next year. They mainly allow super cars to enter but they seem like a good group of people who love to tour. I already upgraded my brakes to a Hydroboost and have the Stainless lines ready to go in this winter with a few other upgrades. When it costs $170 to fill up your tank (albeit 95 octane) You wanna maximize your fuel, especially in an endurance race. Now don't get me wrong...my ride isn't ProTouring....YET! I am looking at changing over the upper and lower control arms but I need to find a fabricator friend first over here..... They had the Gumball 3000 rolling through here to Mykonos in 2019 and I wanna jump on the bandwagon for the next time it comes through (I am accepting sponsors from now ) Right after the EFI install its on my list to install a Dakota Digital Dash and replace the factory console auto shifter with a custom console but thats a 2024 problem. Next question as I am watching Youtube videos about EFI installs. Do I have to replace the MSD 6AL box and the matching HEI distributor?
Last edited by Pyper70; 10/28/22 08:33 AM.
Family owned 1969 Charger R/T DualQuad 440/727/GVO/3.55s
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Re: so much info on EFI. What to choose
[Re: Pyper70]
#3090045
10/28/22 08:00 PM
10/28/22 08:00 PM
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 777 Southington Ct.
turbobitt
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 777
Southington Ct.
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Next question as I am watching Youtube videos about EFI installs. Do I have to replace the MSD 6AL box and the matching HEI distributor? I'm sure every system has its way of managing the ignition. I'm using a FAST XFI and can speak to how it works the ignition system. I chose this system because I already had experience with the system, because they are an older system they can be found cheaply(paid about $500 for mine used), and there is a strong knowledge base out there for support. So based on the FAST EFI system a stock or aftermarket distributer and MSD box will work in batch fire or unsynchronized sequential mode. Depending on how advanced you want to set up the system, a dual sync distributer(both cam and crank signals) or a modified stock or aftermarket distributer with a crank trigger will give the proper signals to work in a true sequential mode. The distributer can be lock down and the computer can manage the distributer advance. Just about any injector, throttle body, and sensors can be used with the system. If you have any wiring skills its not to hard to make your own harness. I had bought a custom unterminated long harness and mounted the FAST XFI above the glove box. I added a flex fuel sensor and used another stock hard fuel line run next to the primary line as a return. The fuel tank is a Tanks inc EFI compatible with an in-tank EFI specific Hellcat pump and proper in-tank baffling. The EFI can even PWM control the fuel pump and I also use it to control the gear vendors OD in place of the Gear vendors computer. In my case I had bought an Edelbrock intake that had the EFI injector holes already machined and a matching set of rails.
Last edited by turbobitt; 10/28/22 08:02 PM.
1970 Challenger w/572 Hemi street car and my pride and joy.
1986 T-Type with 272 Stage 2 Buick V6 engine - True 8 second street car. Just updated the engine and put down 928 HP @ 35# boost to the ground on chasis dyno.
1976 Cee Bee Avenger Jet Boat - 460 Ford powered.
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Re: so much info on EFI. What to choose
[Re: Pyper70]
#3090629
10/31/22 08:53 AM
10/31/22 08:53 AM
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Joined: May 2017
Posts: 73 WI
Brewzer67
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member
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Posts: 73
WI
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I have tinkered with the thought of running an external 7psi fuel pump but quickly been disparaged by reading people who went down the road before me and ended up with burned out fuel pumps due to excessive heat. I want to evolve her, bring her more up to date with technology. Based on your comments above I would maybe just look at flipping over to a Tanks Inc. fuel tank that features an internal electric pump and a return line system. This will fix all the issues you currently have, be totally reliable as the pumps they use are Walbro which is what most OEM's use now, and it will set you up for moving to fuel injection should you change your mind later. You can set it up, see if it meets your needs, and if not you would have had to take those steps anyways (if you wanted to do the fuel injection route correctly). Just a thought...
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Re: so much info on EFI. What to choose
[Re: turbobitt]
#3090712
10/31/22 01:06 PM
10/31/22 01:06 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,923 Athens, Greece
Pyper70
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Athens, Greece
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Thats a beautiful setup...I wish Edelbrock made a CH28 with fuel rails already machined into it. I would probably have gone that direction. Thank you for the explanation on the work you did. Truly a masterwork.
I still think the selling point for the ProFlo over the competition is the location of the ECU. I want to mount it behind the dash next to the MSD box and have it far and away from heat and moisture. Maybe if I had a ram air induction it would sway my decision. Why couldn't the Sniper have an optional removable ECU with a dummy cover for the TBI and wiring for remote placement. They should look into that
Family owned 1969 Charger R/T DualQuad 440/727/GVO/3.55s
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Re: so much info on EFI. What to choose
[Re: Pyper70]
#3090718
10/31/22 01:17 PM
10/31/22 01:17 PM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,900 Bend,OR USA
Cab_Burge
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,900
Bend,OR USA
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I used a Holley throttle body Sniper kit for one of my customers 350 Chevy stroker pump gas motor for his 1972 Chevy 3/4 ton standard cab 4x4 with an automatic with power brakes. I used a small set ( not a big racing set) of the Trick Flow heads and increase the stroke to make the motor have 383 C.I. with the block bored to 4.030, nothing exotic at all. I installed the Sniper kit on the engine dyno and everything hook up easily, that motor made 425 HP at 6000 RPM on the third pull using Oregon pump swill . I didn't flog the heck out of the tune up on the engine dyno due to it having open headers and fresh air blowing into the dyno room. I will finish the final tune up in the truck. I will recommend and buy those kits again: up: IHTHs
Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
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Re: so much info on EFI. What to choose
[Re: Pyper70]
#3090743
10/31/22 01:57 PM
10/31/22 01:57 PM
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 20,506 north of coder
moparx
"Butt Crack Bob"
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"Butt Crack Bob"
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 20,506
north of coder
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Thats a beautiful setup...I wish Edelbrock made a CH28 with fuel rails already machined into it. I would probably have gone that direction. Thank you for the explanation on the work you did. Truly a masterwork.
I still think the selling point for the ProFlo over the competition is the location of the ECU. I want to mount it behind the dash next to the MSD box and have it far and away from heat and moisture. Maybe if I had a ram air induction it would sway my decision. Why couldn't the Sniper have an optional removable ECU with a dummy cover for the TBI and wiring for remote placement. They should look into that i would think mounting the ECU next to the MSD would create a bunch of electrical interference ? but then, i couldn't tell you how far away from each other they should be.... please correct me if i'm wrong !
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Re: so much info on EFI. What to choose
[Re: Pyper70]
#3091003
11/01/22 06:31 PM
11/01/22 06:31 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,245 Plymouth, MI
Blusmbl
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Posts: 8,245
Plymouth, MI
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Why couldn't the Sniper have an optional removable ECU with a dummy cover for the TBI and wiring for remote placement. They should look into that They do, the Terminator X Stealth systems have an external ECU that you can mount in the car and still have the look of a conventional carburetor/Sniper system.
Last edited by Blusmbl; 11/01/22 06:54 PM.
'18 Ford Raptor, random motorcycles, 1968 Plymouth Fury III - 11.37 @ 118
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Re: so much info on EFI. What to choose
[Re: Blusmbl]
#3091070
11/02/22 06:14 AM
11/02/22 06:14 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,103 Tulsa OK
Bad340fish
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Posts: 8,103
Tulsa OK
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Why couldn't the Sniper have an optional removable ECU with a dummy cover for the TBI and wiring for remote placement. They should look into that They do, the Terminator X Stealth systems have an external ECU that you can mount in the car and still have the look of a conventional carburetor/Sniper system. In his application I don't know how well they would work since they have the footprint of a 4150 Double pumper so they take up alot more room than the regular sniper that is more like a edelbrock carb in shape. They look really good though, if the install is clean its hard to tell at first glance especially from the drivers side where there is no wiring. The lack of accelerator pump gives them away pretty quick once you spot that. This is one on a Pontiac engine I saw on drag week.
Last edited by Bad340fish; 11/02/22 06:19 AM.
68 Barracuda Formula S 340
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