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anyone use a air powered sander to color sand ? anyone have a "Power" option ?

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I didn't try an air powered sander... but I did try it with an ultra cheap Black & Decker. Sadly wet sanding ends up killing the electrical motor - and hence you use some cheapo model.

Make sure that the cheapo model does not have those air uptake vents in it that are designed ( under normal circumstances ) to draw the dust up from the sanding surface and vent it into a bag. Instead you want the cheapest model where debris from the sanding surface is not being vented up.

The next thing to keep in mind if you go with the 'electrical' solution...is that electricity and water don't mix . So it doesn't pay to have a hose going in one hand and the electrical sander in the other hand. In a worse case scenario the water and hose provide an electrical ground... and you really don't want 120 volts going in one arm ( from the sander ) - through your chest - and then out your other arm ( to the water hose ).

I found that a nice spritzer bottle bottle provided me with enough water on the fly to do my wet sanding. Then when I had reach a point in the sanding that I was comfortable with, I would put the sander away - a safe distance away - and then take a hose and cloth and do a final washdown of all the debris on the car.

This works best on cooler days or in the shade, because you really don't want any of the debris drying out on the 'worked' area.

One funny thing.... I killed the cheapo sander during the course of this wet sanding. Fortunately I had bought it just 14 days earlier at Walmart. So I packed the unit up and trotted back to Walmart with it. I explained to the customer service clerk that the thing had just died. She gave me an exchange for a brand new unit. I took it home and successfully killed it after 10 days ( but I was able to finish all my web sanding ). The clerk again gleefully exchanged the dead sander for a new one. That unit now sits on my shelf untouched.

Tee hee... yeah I know... I am a stinker and the reason why Walmart's profits are so low and their prices are so high hehhehheh...

But in reality... I only resorted to the 'electrical' solution... because my orange peel was noticable and I wanted to QUICKLY reduce it.

Normally a good 'hand sanding' is all you need during the wet sanding stage...

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Fantastic thread guys.

Has anyone attempted to paint brightside onto aluminum yet? Any compatibility problems? Is primer required?

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The orange peel on the hood, roof, & trunk is getting more pronounced with time.
I haven't done a final colorsand/buff with 1500 yet but it's to the point that I wonder if 1500 will be enough to knock it down.
It's shiny
I don't want to lose that trying to get it flat.
Do I need to sand it flat & paint another THIN coat or will wetsand/compound/buff/wax bring it back to this level?

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You have a choice to make. If you keep putting paint on it without sanding it smooth the orange peel and those waves and ripples you see in the picture are going to keep getting more pronounced, as you have noticed. It is possible to get a very wavy and orange peely surface that is shiny. If that is what you want just keep painting. If you are happy with it now, just stop.

I know it is tempting to want to hold on to the shine, even when the surface is clearly not flat enough for a really nice job. At least it was for me, as well. However, the shine will come back each time you add a new coat to a smoothed surface, or after you wet sand then polish.

With my my tests I think 2-4 coats of Rustoleum without sanding the final coat look almost as good as a cheap Maaco paint job, if not better. They don't however look like a mirror until you do the proper sanding work.

Are you thinning your paint enough? I found that when I put my on too thick I ended up with the ripples you are seeing. I think I agree with you that you are probably not ready for 1500 until you get those ripples out, but I am only judging from the picture.

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I may have pinpointed the cause

Smyrna previously posted

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IF you apply 'another' coat before the previous coat has adequately dried, you will find orange peel occuring.

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I was hoping to be done with the rollers but in my haste I believe I may have applied the last coat prematurely. 8 coats with wetsanding between every other, sometimes thru the previous paint around the bondo/fill patch edges, so really more like 6?.
The last applied coat aggravated the lower level imperfections & even tho the flaws were minor they multiplied the problem. If I understand it, the topcoat lifted the previous layer that was not completely set thereby magnifying underlying minor imperfections. Like those Russian nesting dolls each additional level increases differences by an order of magnitude, "times 2", not just by "+ 1 more". If that makes any semblance of sanity & I'm not totally out to lunch (about THIS anyway)

So..
I'll wetsand it down & try to rub out a test space/wax on/wax off & see if I'm not yet a retired painter but still just a tired 1. I will post more pictures of my progress later. I will also gladly accept & listen to any thoughts &/or advice.

But not now, there's some expensive commercials about to come on the idiotbox interrupted now & then by some football.

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Well... my first thought is that Brightside 'should' be quite compatible with aluminum - because Brightside is a marine paint and it normally is put on aluminum, fiberglass and wood.

BUT as for surface preparation... I would suspect you would have to go to the Interlux web site and see what 'their' recommendations are for surface preparation.

You also might want to scout out some of the message forums for the fly boys.. and see what the airplane owners have to say about painting aluminum... as there are quite a few do it yourselfers who are painting their own planes. They might have an even better insight into surface preparation.

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So Marq...

I'm leaning more towards the Brightside, but it's got me wondering.

If it covers with less coats... and it doesn't have to be "cut" to make it pliable. Why is everyone still going with the Rust-oleum? Why not just use the Brightside instead?

Is it cost only or stubborness maybe?

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Interlux's website didn't say anything specific to aluminum. The hood is already painted, just needs some bondo work, primer, etc. I guess I'll give them a call when I get around to it. Thanks

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As the other contributor noted... aluminum is more of a pain for surface preparation - and probably double so for aluminum aircraft surfaces.

And in the aircraft world, I would assume that surface preparation for a high speed - high altitude aircraft is more complicated than that for the slower, lower altitude personal aircrafts. So even in avionics there are differences. As a funny aside to this topic, I remember that the US P51 Mustang aircraft was sent to battle during the Second World War without camoflauge paint - and with its aluminum body in its natural shiny metallic look. They claimed they didn't need to paint the P51 because it was so faaaaaaaaassssssssssst that it didn't need to rely on stealth or camoflauge in battle. But maybe they also were encountering paint adhesion problems back then

My only experience with paint on aluminum is with a Jaguar XK140 C-Type roadster. The C-Type was the racing version and they used aluminum on the doors to light the car. When paint got chipped on that door... I was quite surprised by how shiny the underlying aluminum was. We would dab a little paint to mask the chipped paint... but it seemed that it just couldn't adhere securely to it for any length of time.

As you will have noted from that article contributed by the other user, the aircraft boys have to etch the aluminum surface in order for the paint or primer to adhere properly. As the article notes, they are using an acid to etch the surface.

I don't think the aircraft painter's route is the most appropriate for an automotive body. Paint on an airplane is subjected to a far more stressful environment then a car's paint job is.

So maybe the right answer on painting aluminum successfully would be found in the boater / marine forum discussions. The boaters have a pretty long history of 'do it yourself' painting of their aluminum bass boats etc. So you could probably pick up there how they are able to successfully get marine paint to adhere securely.

IF I had an aluminum bass boat sitting in my garage and I wanted to paint it red... I would probably remove the paint that was on there.. and then score the aluminum surface with something like a 160 grit sand paper. My theory or train of logic would be that that scoring by the sand paper would provide a more than adequate surface for the primer to adhere to. And I am pretty sure that I would tend to lean towards laying a primer layer and smooth sanding it, prior to moving on to the paint stages. The primer would have the ability to fill in the scoring or the aluminum, while giving me an initial surface to work smooth - to give a good subsurface for the paint to build on.

One thought that just struck me... is a warning about sanding aluminum... and that is to be sure to wear a mask when sanding that metal. There is a proven link between aluminum and Alzheimers... and so you really don't aluminum particles being sucked into your lungs.

I am not sure about the differences between automotive aluminum, marine aluminum and aviation aluminum. My gut instinct is that the aviation aluminum is probably the highest quality. And so it probably does have different attibutes for when you are doing a surface preparation prior to painting. The automotive and marine aluminum probably share a closer similarity to each other and probably do not need as complicated preparation as the aviation aluminum.

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i'm interested in painting my car this kind of colour (it looks a fair bit lighter in pictures of the car at events, or even the light yellow colour on citreon c2's is nice)

but dont belive i could mix up any colours to look like it from the pallet of colours avaible in australia, which for bright side are


any suggestions marq or anyone else? if only this stuff came in sample tins...

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The picture of that car did not display properly here.. but I was able to follow its link and check out the picture at :

http://www.cartype.com/images/page/lamborghini-miura_s1.jpg

I don't know what the Citroen color is, but from the picture you identified, my eyes tend to tell me that that is a YELLOW mixed with a lesser percentage of BROWN and a couple of drops of black to raise or lower the brightness or darkness of the mixture

The primary colors are red, blue and yellow. They combine to make green, orange and purple. All three primary colors together combine to make brown.

Ok... so to land on a color close to the one you identified in the Lamborghini picture, you could come at it from two angles...

a ) First make a 'brown' color using Brightside Black and Brightside Red. The two of them combined will give you a brownish color. The greater the percentage of black compared to the red will give you a darker brown ( which is what we would need for the second part of the mixing ).
Once you have created a fairly dark brown paint, you would make your leopard green/yellow color by using the Brightside Yellow mixed with a small amount of your custom mixed brown paint solution.

b ) the other way would be to create a custom Green color using Brightside Yellow with a lesser amount of blue. This would give you lime green color. Once you have created this 'green' color you would make your leopard green/yellow color by using the Brightside Yellow mixed with a small amount of your custom mixed green paint solution. You would be able to add drops of black to tint the combined solution up to the level of darkness that best rings your chimes

I had read somewhere that the folks at Interlux will do custom blends of paint for their customers. But the problem is that I don't know what the minimum number of cans you must order... or whether they charge an additional premium for the custom mixing.

But I think you should be able to hit on that color of the Lambo with a bit of patience and good natural light to examine the paint as you blend it ( ie don't try to judge this color when mixing under a florescent or normal type lighting ).

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I'm not sure brightside "has better gloss after wetsanding and polishing".

I'm certain brightside "has better gloss after wetsanding and polishing".

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So Marq...

I'm leaning more towards the Brightside, but it's got me wondering.

If it covers with less coats... and it doesn't have to be "cut" to make it pliable. Why is everyone still going with the Rust-oleum? Why not just use the Brightside instead?

Is it cost only or stubborness maybe?

It doesn't make sense to me. If the Brightside is the better quality.

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Well, I'd like to use something better than the Rustoleum Pro, but here's where I am.

4 Reasons for Rustoleum:

1) Charger has a proven process, he's painted several cars that have held up in some very difficult conditions over a very long period of time. This thread is just not that old, I'd like to see how Brightside holds up over time.

2) I'm not a painter but from what I understand is that if you want to repaint the car using the traditional spray method, there will not be a compatibility issue with the Rustoleum Pro.

3) I called Interlux and they said that the Brightside product was not meant to be color sanded and polished to a gloss. Appartently, the Teflon additive and other components in the mix rise to the surface and those parts are not supposed to be removed. (I wonder if this a function of the earlier post about the darker color ring from painting through different layers.)

4) If I ever move to Canada, I might be able to clear coat the Rustoleum Pro with the Tremclad product.


I bought and tested the Rustoleum. Since my car is a daily driver, I do not mind spending a little extra to get better and faster results.

Also, about 10 years ago, I built a sailboat and when it came time to paint it, I did mounds of research, my impression was that Brightside was just a cheap option, not a durable one.

I guess I am going to have to try the Brightside on a test piece...