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Re: RB hydraulic roller cam [Re: 65 Hemi] #2499954
05/24/18 12:10 PM
05/24/18 12:10 PM
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So. Burlington, Vt.
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fast68plymouth Offline
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For 10-12k a year, it would get something pretty tame...... And the power would just be whatever it is.

IMO, the overall combo would be better off with std port heads.


68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123
Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
Re: RB hydraulic roller cam [Re: 65 Hemi] #2499981
05/24/18 01:13 PM
05/24/18 01:13 PM
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Bend,OR USA
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Originally Posted By 65 Hemi
I would think it should be possible to make 600hp out of a 500” motor and be very reliable.
iagree up Been there done that with big valve ported 906 heads on many stock stroke 440 shruggy
My pump gas Duster motor last configuration was a 400 block with a 4.300 stroke crank and 4.375 bore with 10.7 to 1 compression, Indy M.W. port SR heads, 400-3 intake with a Holley #9375 non HP 1050 CFM dominator,Custm ground Comp Cams solid roller cam, it made 727 HP the last time it was on a engine dyno on pump gas boogie
I did swap the heads on it from the iron heads to a set of CNC ported Eddy RPM and then to set to CNC ported 440-1, the motor made 775 HP with them and the last set was the SR that made 727 HP work
Every time I fed that motor more air and fuel it went faster and made more power on the engine dyno and chassis dyno work
I drove it on the street some, 3000+ miles in 7 years, I raced it more than driving it on the street though, it was not my daily driver shruggy
On your deal I'm sure you will make more than 650 HP with no sweat up work
My Duster weighed 3450 Lb. with me in it, it was a hoot to drive on the street devil boogie


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: RB hydraulic roller cam [Re: JAKE68] #2500019
05/24/18 02:35 PM
05/24/18 02:35 PM
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Virginia Beach, VA
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Old School Offline
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Originally Posted By JAKE68
I have a problem with understanding why someone needs a 650 hp motor that is only going to be street driven and never raced and wants to be reliable???? That is a lot of strain on parts to make that much power to be pounded on at low speeds for bragging rights. lie!!! and leave it stock. That's my .02. Don't get me wrong I like a lot of hp but i use it for what intended.


Don't try to understand it! People do it everyday. It's called Hot Rodding.

You will really like mine then. 588" 960 horsepower 100% Streetcar. Has nothing to do with bragging rights. It has to do with the right to do what you want to do with your car.......

Last edited by Old School; 05/24/18 02:36 PM.

68 cuda formula S 588" bb 5sp
70 CUDA CONVERT 500" 5SP (SUBLIME)
70 CUDA CONVERT 500" 5SP (PLUMCRAZY):TOO MUCH HORSEPOWER, IS ALMOST ENOUGH!
Re: RB hydraulic roller cam [Re: Old School] #2500037
05/24/18 03:12 PM
05/24/18 03:12 PM
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fredericksburg,va
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Originally Posted By Old School
Originally Posted By JAKE68
I have a problem with understanding why someone needs a 650 hp motor that is only going to be street driven and never raced and wants to be reliable???? That is a lot of strain on parts to make that much power to be pounded on at low speeds for bragging rights. lie!!! and leave it stock. That's my .02. Don't get me wrong I like a lot of hp but i use it for what intended.


Don't try to understand it! People do it everyday. It's called Hot Rodding.

You will really like mine then. 588" 960 horsepower 100% Streetcar. Has nothing to do with bragging rights. It has to do with the right to do what you want to do with your car.......

So, what cam are you using?

Re: RB hydraulic roller cam [Re: 65 Hemi] #2500045
05/24/18 03:33 PM
05/24/18 03:33 PM
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Shelby mi.
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Looking at the cam you have I would keep that maybe put bushed roller lifters in.


JAKES AUTOMOTIVE
Re: RB hydraulic roller cam [Re: cudaman1969] #2500046
05/24/18 03:37 PM
05/24/18 03:37 PM
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Virginia Beach, VA
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Originally Posted By cudaman1969
Originally Posted By Old School
Originally Posted By JAKE68
I have a problem with understanding why someone needs a 650 hp motor that is only going to be street driven and never raced and wants to be reliable???? That is a lot of strain on parts to make that much power to be pounded on at low speeds for bragging rights. lie!!! and leave it stock. That's my .02. Don't get me wrong I like a lot of hp but i use it for what intended.


Don't try to understand it! People do it everyday. It's called Hot Rodding.

You will really like mine then. 588" 960 horsepower 100% Streetcar. Has nothing to do with bragging rights. It has to do with the right to do what you want to do with your car.......

So, what cam are you using?


A solid roller. .800" 290@.050. I also use the isky bushed roller lifters. I have found needle bearing roller lifters do not last on the street......


68 cuda formula S 588" bb 5sp
70 CUDA CONVERT 500" 5SP (SUBLIME)
70 CUDA CONVERT 500" 5SP (PLUMCRAZY):TOO MUCH HORSEPOWER, IS ALMOST ENOUGH!
Re: RB hydraulic roller cam [Re: 65 Hemi] #2500148
05/24/18 10:39 PM
05/24/18 10:39 PM
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Posts: 984
San Diego CA
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65 Hemi Offline OP
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I currently run the Comp cams 892 lifters. What are your experiences with these??? I cringe every time I drive the car 30-50 miles. I bet it has less than 3500 miles and feel in my gut that one is going to let go. Maybe I should just buy bushed roller lifters and a mellow Solid roller cam.


Doug

MOPAR or NO CAR!!!
1965 Dodge Coronet soon a 6.1 Hemi with a Magnson blower 810 hp on pump gas
1964 Dodge Polara 582" Indy alum Block 426-1RA heads,
1933 Plymouth PE all Steel, LT1 4L60E
1959 Plymouth Savoy 33,000 mile survivor
Old cars are never done. They are ongoing projects!
Re: RB hydraulic roller cam [Re: JAKE68] #2500184
05/25/18 01:33 AM
05/25/18 01:33 AM
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West Coast, USA
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Originally Posted By JAKE68
I have a problem with understanding why someone needs a 650 hp motor that is only going to be street driven and never raced and wants to be reliable???? That is a lot of strain on parts to make that much power to be pounded on at low speeds for bragging rights. lie!!! and leave it stock. That's my .02. Don't get me wrong I like a lot of hp but i use it for what intended.


Come on now, when people or some government agency try to tell me I don't need more than 650 or 700 hp in my car. I won't hang out with them anymore. Who needs that kind of negativity in their lives.

Modern aluminum heads, quality stroker bottom ends and good valve train choices make 650-700 hp seem pretty mild compared to what race engines put out at similar displacements.

Computer engine management, injection and turbo/blowers make 900+ hp reliable and reasonably tame when not building boost.

Look at Hellcats, Demons and the new Corvettes. Heck, I'm helping a buddy put together a 940 hp blown LSX in a 67 Chevelle with a 6 speed and a full Art Morrison Chassis. That should just be about right power to weight ratio for the street.


1970 Plymouth 'Cuda #'s 440-6(block in storage)currently 493" 6 pack, Shaker, 5 speed Passon, 4.10's
1968 Plymouth Barracuda Convertible 408 Magnum EFI with 4 speed automatic overdrive, 3800 stall lock-up converter and 4.30's (closest thing to an automatic 5 speed going)
Re: RB hydraulic roller cam [Re: jbc426] #2500214
05/25/18 08:31 AM
05/25/18 08:31 AM
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Shelby mi.
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Originally Posted By jbc426
Originally Posted By JAKE68
I have a problem with understanding why someone needs a 650 hp motor that is only going to be street driven and never raced and wants to be reliable???? That is a lot of strain on parts to make that much power to be pounded on at low speeds for bragging rights. lie!!! and leave it stock. That's my .02. Don't get me wrong I like a lot of hp but i use it for what intended.


Come on now, when people or some government agency try to tell me I don't need more than 650 or 700 hp in my car. I won't hang out with them anymore. Who needs that kind of negativity in their lives.

Modern aluminum heads, quality stroker bottom ends and good valve train choices make 650-700 hp seem pretty mild compared to what race engines put out at similar displacements.

Computer engine management, injection and turbo/blowers make 900+ hp reliable and reasonably tame when not building boost.

Look at Hellcats, Demons and the new Corvettes. Heck, I'm helping a buddy put together a 940 hp blown LSX in a 67 Chevelle with a 6 speed and a full Art Morrison Chassis. That should just be about right power to weight ratio for the street.

You truly didn't understand my point. I build a lot of high horsepower street motors for my customers so I am not against or trying to take away some ones right for building a high horse power motor. But when the op wanted reliable 10-12000 mile daily driver I don't think 650 hp was in his best interest. as far as using a hyd roller cam I have build several max wedge motors using scotty brown cams and durell lifters with great result making 600+ hp.. Only thing I have found with hyd roller cams is that it seams I cant get them run as high rpm as flat tappet hyd cam can.

Last edited by JAKE68; 05/25/18 08:36 AM.

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Re: RB hydraulic roller cam [Re: 65 Hemi] #2500275
05/25/18 11:23 AM
05/25/18 11:23 AM
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Posts: 1,169
Virginia Beach, VA
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Originally Posted By 65 Hemi
I currently run the Comp cams 892 lifters. What are your experiences with these??? I cringe every time I drive the car 30-50 miles. I bet it has less than 3500 miles and feel in my gut that one is going to let go. Maybe I should just buy bushed roller lifters and a mellow Solid roller cam.


I used to run the comp 829s. All of my street cars had at least a 700" solid roller cam in them. The needle bearings in the lifters failed in them in short time.

I think it's all that idleing and low speed driving that does them in. They seem to last in drag Motors because there is a ton of oil being slung around in there.that doesn't happen when they're idling on the street. I switched to isky EZ roll Max bushed lifters a few years ago. I have had no problems ever since. I wish they could do something similar to needle bearing rocker arms. With my spring pressures and being street cars those take a beating as well.....


68 cuda formula S 588" bb 5sp
70 CUDA CONVERT 500" 5SP (SUBLIME)
70 CUDA CONVERT 500" 5SP (PLUMCRAZY):TOO MUCH HORSEPOWER, IS ALMOST ENOUGH!
Re: RB hydraulic roller cam [Re: JAKE68] #2500277
05/25/18 11:31 AM
05/25/18 11:31 AM
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West Coast, USA
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I apologize for using your post as a springboard to rant, Jake68. No disrespect intended.


1970 Plymouth 'Cuda #'s 440-6(block in storage)currently 493" 6 pack, Shaker, 5 speed Passon, 4.10's
1968 Plymouth Barracuda Convertible 408 Magnum EFI with 4 speed automatic overdrive, 3800 stall lock-up converter and 4.30's (closest thing to an automatic 5 speed going)
Re: RB hydraulic roller cam [Re: 65 Hemi] #2500279
05/25/18 11:33 AM
05/25/18 11:33 AM
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So. Burlington, Vt.
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When you're talking roller cams and street cars...... Depending on what the particular requirements are, will determine what the priority list looks like.

When the requirement is reliability suitable for 10-12k miles a year...... That gets moved right to the top of the list........ And as such, will dictate what most of the rest of the components will end up being.

For me, that would mean smooth lobe profiles with modest lift that will operate happily with moderate spring loads...... Along with top of the line lifters and premium endurance springs.


68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123
Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
Re: RB hydraulic roller cam [Re: 65 Hemi] #2500530
05/25/18 11:48 PM
05/25/18 11:48 PM
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Colorado
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I'm watching this thread since I also need to buy hdy. lifters but I want to rev the engine past 6,200


07 Porsche C2 997.1 6spd DD and SCCA Solo II SS
68 Plymouth GTX Convert. 493cu Hotkiss Wilwood Classic air, Building for Solo II Cam
65 Chrysler 300 Convert. project
57 Desoto 2dr. Firesweep 392 Hemi,Wilwood Project with son
2003 Dodge Dakota R/T "DEAD"
Re: RB hydraulic roller cam [Re: fast68plymouth] #2500588
05/26/18 08:25 AM
05/26/18 08:25 AM
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Prospect, PA
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Originally Posted By fast68plymouth
When you're talking roller cams and street cars...... Depending on what the particular requirements are, will determine what the priority list looks like.

When the requirement is reliability suitable for 10-12k miles a year...... That gets moved right to the top of the list........ And as such, will dictate what most of the rest of the components will end up being.

For me, that would mean smooth lobe profiles with modest lift that will operate happily with moderate spring loads...... Along with top of the line lifters and premium endurance springs.


You make stuff so complicated.

Would you consider using something like a PAC 1232X beehive w/ a light retained on a street roller profile like the extreme energy? Say up to 6500 rpm.

Re: RB hydraulic roller cam [Re: JAKE68] #2500601
05/26/18 09:11 AM
05/26/18 09:11 AM
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San Diego CA
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65 Hemi Offline OP
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Please keep in mind this is a motor that I’ve been using in a car for a few year. I’m not looking to get a new motor but use most the parts I already have. Maybe I should have posted “What cam would people switch to so I can comfortable drive this car 10-12k miles per year?” I’m not really concerned about the HP#. Im really looking for low end torque to have some street fun when driving to and from work!


Doug

MOPAR or NO CAR!!!
1965 Dodge Coronet soon a 6.1 Hemi with a Magnson blower 810 hp on pump gas
1964 Dodge Polara 582" Indy alum Block 426-1RA heads,
1933 Plymouth PE all Steel, LT1 4L60E
1959 Plymouth Savoy 33,000 mile survivor
Old cars are never done. They are ongoing projects!
Re: RB hydraulic roller cam [Re: 65 Hemi] #2500667
05/26/18 12:15 PM
05/26/18 12:15 PM
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Oregon
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Originally Posted By 65 Hemi
Please keep in mind this is a motor that I’ve been using in a car for a few year. I’m not looking to get a new motor but use most the parts I already have. Maybe I should have posted “What cam would people switch to so I can comfortable drive this car 10-12k miles per year?” I’m not really concerned about the HP#. Im really looking for low end torque to have some street fun when driving to and from work!


Keep the cam small for a daily driver. Chevy uses a hyd roller cam in the 502 crate engine that is only 211/230 at 0.050. That is a baby cam but it works for a daily driver. The 502 HO makes a lot of torque with that small cam and those engines work great in a lot of cars. So think hard before you put a big cam in there.

Re: RB hydraulic roller cam [Re: 65 Hemi] #2500676
05/26/18 12:50 PM
05/26/18 12:50 PM
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Pattison Texas
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My 255,258 .610,.613 hydro roller works great in my 512, can cruise @ 1800 rpm,AC on with converter locked up & is smooth as glass. I have the comp beehive 155 seat

Last edited by csk; 05/26/18 12:52 PM.

1968 Charger COLD A/C Hilborn EFI
512ci 9.7 compression, Stealth heads, 4.10 gear A518 ODtrans 4100lb,10.93 full street car trim
2020 T/A 392 Stock 11.79 @ 114.5

Re: RB hydraulic roller cam [Re: 65 Hemi] #2500680
05/26/18 01:05 PM
05/26/18 01:05 PM
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Posts: 14,545
So. Burlington, Vt.
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fast68plymouth Offline
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Quote:
Would you consider using something like a PAC 1232X beehive w/ a light retained on a street roller profile like the extreme energy? Say up to 6500 rpm.


On a BBM with -1 heads that use heavy .800 offset intake rockers?

I don't know if those springs would provide enough spring load to get that package to 6500 without any signs of unhappiness.
Without testing that exact combo on the dyno...... No, I wouldn't use those springs.

Something like an Isky 9915 with tool steel retainers is more my preference.

Though it would be interesting to try some even slower/smoother lobe profiles and some of the new conical springs.

I'll add that if "it were up to me"....... It would get a solid flat tappet cam that didn't have real aggressive lobes along with EDM lifters.

I see way more horror stories around on various forums, for all kinds of different engine makes, discussing some sort of incurable hyd roller lifter problem than I see about solid flat tappet cams going bad(provided proper break in procedures were followed).


68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123
Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
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