So, I took a look at the underhood of the car for the first time since my last post. There doesn't seem to be an easy way of removing the water pump belt as there's no idler/tension pulley. I can't get an allen into my water pump pulley. It doesn't seem like I'll be able to remove the water pump without removing the radiator.
So, I think my plan of attack is probably going to be the falling: 1) Remove the starter to inspect the flywheel. 2) Empty fluids and remove radiator. 3) Replace water pump. 4) Inspect to see if things are fixed...
Re: MuuMuu's 68 Dart... It's a Learning Process...
[Re: MuuMuu101]
#2522991 07/17/1809:33 AM07/17/1809:33 AM
Loosen the two bolts attaching the alternator to the upper and lower alternator mounting brackets (visible in your first picture) and push alternator towards the water pump. Water pump belt should be able to be removed. Belt tensioners are typically for more modern serpentine type belts which your Dart doesn't have. Remove left cooling fan to allow removal of water pump.
Loosen the two bolts attaching the alternator to the upper and lower alternator mounting brackets (visible in your first picture) and push alternator towards the water pump. Water pump belt should be able to be removed. Belt tensioners are typically for more modern serpentine type belts which your Dart doesn't have. Remove left cooling fan to allow removal of water pump.
Just an observation but that rubber plug for the heater hose nipple is cracking. It's under pressure. If it blows and you are standing over the motor you are going to get a face full of hot coolant. Not to mention that you are probably not wearing safety glasses. 2nd degree burns on the face and possible blindness is not worth it. Pull the pump and weld up those hose nipples.
Just an observation but that rubber plug for the heater hose nipple is cracking. It's under pressure. If it blows and you are standing over the motor you are going to get a face full of hot coolant. Not to mention that you are probably not wearing safety glasses. 2nd degree burns on the face and possible blindness is not worth it. Pull the pump and weld up those hose nipples.
I prefer to tap them an plug them. Please listen to Dart4forte he's a nipple expert!
56 Plaza 63 D100 step side 67 Coronet, 68 Roadrunner, 69 Super Bees, 69 Coronet 500 convertible, 70 Roadrunner Post, 79 D150 360, and a severe case of Mopar a,d,d
Re: MuuMuu's 68 Dart... It's a Learning Process...
[Re: moparpollack]
#2523408 07/18/1812:41 AM07/18/1812:41 AM
Just an observation but that rubber plug for the heater hose nipple is cracking. It's under pressure. If it blows and you are standing over the motor you are going to get a face full of hot coolant. Not to mention that you are probably not wearing safety glasses. 2nd degree burns on the face and possible blindness is not worth it. Pull the pump and weld up those hose nipples.
I prefer to tap them an plug them. Please listen to Dart4forte he's a nipple expert!
I don't have any taps. What size do you use for your nipples?
Re: MuuMuu's 68 Dart... It's a Learning Process...
[Re: MuuMuu101]
#2523409 07/18/1812:49 AM07/18/1812:49 AM
I pulled the water pump belt and I still here a knocking noise. When I started the car up, it only took one try and idling was super easy. I didn't even have to babysit the car as it idled.
When I later spun the water pump pulley san belt, it seemed to rotate smoothly. I didn't feel any crunchyness or radial play.
Re: MuuMuu's 68 Dart... It's a Learning Process...
[Re: moparpollack]
#2523547 07/18/1811:16 AM07/18/1811:16 AM
Just an observation but that rubber plug for the heater hose nipple is cracking. It's under pressure. If it blows and you are standing over the motor you are going to get a face full of hot coolant. Not to mention that you are probably not wearing safety glasses. 2nd degree burns on the face and possible blindness is not worth it. Pull the pump and weld up those hose nipples.
I prefer to tap them an plug them. Please listen to Dart4forte he's a nipple expert!
you are way too funny
“So if it’s on the internet it must be true”
Abe Lincoln
Re: MuuMuu's 68 Dart... It's a Learning Process...
[Re: MuuMuu101]
#2526726 07/25/1812:59 AM07/25/1812:59 AM
Back story on my life this year. Lots of good things going on, don't get me wrong. But life is pretty crazy. So, in February, I proposed to my gf and she said yes. That's right, I'm engaged. April, I left my old job as a design engineer in Aerospace because I just wasn't happy and am now working as a Process Engineer for a large medical company. I'm super happy with that as I get to be really hands on and am working on some cool technology. In June, I graduated with my master's degree in Mechanical Engineering and am so thankful for that. Unfortunately, due to stress, school took a tole on my body and energy and now I'm working at getting healthy again by working out 1.5+ hours a day (5 days a week), eating healthy, and trying to get at least 7 hours of sleep a night. And now I'm planning a wedding for next February while trying to buy a home in Southern California this winter.
So, as you can see, I'm pretty busy. Usually when I get home, I'm pretty drained and don't have much time or energy to do anything but prepare for the next day. And the Dart being down is really a pain in my butt because it just adds stress instead of relieving it. Don't get me wrong, I want to work on it (to relieve stress) and have been inspiring myself by watching Youtube shows like Mighty Car Mods and Roadkill. I'd like the car to be running and reliable before I move, because when I move, I'll likely be in a condo which means there will be a lot less room for me to work, if my HOA even allows me to work on the car. Not only that, it sucks I worked hard and sold a bunch of parts to purchase all of my EFI components, but now I can't install it, because I'm having trouble making the car reliable first. If I could convince my fiance to bring the car to the wedding, I think that would be a cool and memorable moment, but it's not looking likely with the car in a constant cycle of breaking down for 3 months and running for a month.
On to today. I finally had the time and energy to work on the car. The plan was to pull the spark plugs and the starter, turn the crank and ensure all the teeth are on the flywheel. So, I pull the spark plugs, jack the car up, and remove the starter. No problems. Go to turn the crank with my breaker bar and, it was probably the fact that I was trying to turn the crank from underneath the car, but the car moved a little and freaked me out. I was only able to see about a 1/4 of the teeth and they seemed ok. So, me being freaked out, I said, "F it! The teeth are good, let's just put the starter back on!" I got to put the starter on and the small connector (I'm assuming for grounding) snapped off when I was tightening it. As I was unbolting everything (for the millionth time), the starter falls out of my hand and bashed into my teeth. Luckily, I brush twice a day, so my teeth seem to be fine, but I cut a little bit of my lip. So, now I have to replace this wire (I hate electrical work) and the shop who built the car has this really nice wire wrapping around it that will all have to be removed to replace the wire. I'm so over everything breaking whenever I touch this car.
So, that's where I'm at right now. My per-marital counseling pastor took real interest into my car this past Sunday and gave me a contact to a really good guy who works on classic cars not too far away. The guy has 5 stars on Yelp. Now that's tempting me to ship the car off again, which sucks because I feel like I am a quitter every time I do that. But, I'm trying to buy a house, so I may not have the funds to do that. I wish I wasn't so busy.
Back story on my life this year. Lots of good things going on, don't get me wrong. But life is pretty crazy. So, in February, I proposed to my gf and she said yes. That's right, I'm engaged. April, I left my old job as a design engineer in Aerospace because I just wasn't happy and am now working as a Process Engineer for a large medical company. I'm super happy with that as I get to be really hands on and am working on some cool technology. In June, I graduated with my master's degree in Mechanical Engineering and am so thankful for that. Unfortunately, due to stress, school took a tole on my body and energy and now I'm working at getting healthy again by working out 1.5+ hours a day (5 days a week), eating healthy, and trying to get at least 7 hours of sleep a night. And now I'm planning a wedding for next February while trying to buy a home in Southern California this winter.
So, as you can see, I'm pretty busy. Usually when I get home, I'm pretty drained and don't have much time or energy to do anything but prepare for the next day. And the Dart being down is really a pain in my butt because it just adds stress instead of relieving it. Don't get me wrong, I want to work on it (to relieve stress) and have been inspiring myself by watching Youtube shows like Mighty Car Mods and Roadkill. I'd like the car to be running and reliable before I move, because when I move, I'll likely be in a condo which means there will be a lot less room for me to work, if my HOA even allows me to work on the car. Not only that, it sucks I worked hard and sold a bunch of parts to purchase all of my EFI components, but now I can't install it, because I'm having trouble making the car reliable first. If I could convince my fiance to bring the car to the wedding, I think that would be a cool and memorable moment, but it's not looking likely with the car in a constant cycle of breaking down for 3 months and running for a month.
On to today. I finally had the time and energy to work on the car. The plan was to pull the spark plugs and the starter, turn the crank and ensure all the teeth are on the flywheel. So, I pull the spark plugs, jack the car up, and remove the starter. No problems. Go to turn the crank with my breaker bar and, it was probably the fact that I was trying to turn the crank from underneath the car, but the car moved a little and freaked me out. I was only able to see about a 1/4 of the teeth and they seemed ok. So, me being freaked out, I said, "F it! The teeth are good, let's just put the starter back on!" I got to put the starter on and the small connector (I'm assuming for grounding) snapped off when I was tightening it. As I was unbolting everything (for the millionth time), the starter falls out of my hand and bashed into my teeth. Luckily, I brush twice a day, so my teeth seem to be fine, but I cut a little bit of my lip. So, now I have to replace this wire (I hate electrical work) and the shop who built the car has this really nice wire wrapping around it that will all have to be removed to replace the wire. I'm so over everything breaking whenever I touch this car.
So, that's where I'm at right now. My per-marital counseling pastor took real interest into my car this past Sunday and gave me a contact to a really good guy who works on classic cars not too far away. The guy has 5 stars on Yelp. Now that's tempting me to ship the car off again, which sucks because I feel like I am a quitter every time I do that. But, I'm trying to buy a house, so I may not have the funds to do that. I wish I wasn't so busy.
Sorry for the vent...
Well, this is a first. Attacked by a starter!!!! In all seriousness it’s probably time to take a break from the car. Put it out of your mind and focus on your new family. If you can afford it yard the work out. No shame in that given that you want a car you can eventually enjoy.
A guy that can probably help you out is junior340(Andy)on the FABO site. He’s also on this site under a different name. Real good guy. Runs a shop in Pismo Beach that’s mechanically oriented toward muscle. He’s old school. May be worth trailering the car down and have him give it the once over.
Last edited by dart4forte; 07/25/1806:57 PM.
“So if it’s on the internet it must be true”
Abe Lincoln
Re: MuuMuu's 68 Dart... It's a Learning Process...
[Re: MuuMuu101]
#2527222 07/26/1801:01 AM07/26/1801:01 AM
I grabbed a #10 ring terminal and a crimping tool from work today. I bought my own on Amazon, but that won't come for a few days. I also got a heat gun and a soldering iron kit, as I figured it would be inevitable I work with electronics in the future and they were cheap (~$20/each). I crimped the new ring terminal on (it was my first time so it wasn't pretty), and installed the starter. Prior to that, I made sure that all of the teeth were on the flywheel, and they were. When I went to go connect the battery, the battery sparked and the starter turned on. So, I had to go back, and remove the starter and make sure that the power chord wasn't touching the ground. I reinstalled the starter and I guess it didn't seat right because it made gear noises every time I hit the accelerator pedal. So now I have to go back and uninstall and reinstall the starter for the 10th time.
The starter is still free wheeling at start-up. But one thing I noticed is that it sounded the same as when the starter engaged when I had the shorting boo boo with the battery. So, now I'm wondering, could it be that I'm not getting enough fuel (just changed spark plugs, so spark should be good) to the cylinder and the engine is just free wheeling until it can finally detonate the fuel? Or do you still think it is a starter engagement problem?
Anywho, I probably won't be able to work on the car until Friday. I've been cutting out 15-30 mins of my workout the past couple days and that has been helping me a lot to get out and work on the car. It's almost like working on the car ends up being part of my workout, especially when it's super hot outside. I was sweating quite a bit and it was only 7 pm.
Re: MuuMuu's 68 Dart... It's a Learning Process...
[Re: dart4forte]
#2527223 07/26/1801:04 AM07/26/1801:04 AM
Well, this is a first. Attacked by a starter!!!! In all seriousness it’s probably time to take a break from the car. Put it out of your mind and focus on your new family. If you can afford it yard the work out. No shame in that given that you want a car you can eventually enjoy.
A guy that can probably help you out is junior340(Andy)on the FABO site. He’s also on this site under a different name. Real good guy. Runs a shop in Pismo Beach that’s mechanically oriented toward muscle. He’s old school. May be worth trailering the car down and have him give it the once over.
I'm a little determined to do this myself. I always say I'm a car guy but rarely work on my own stuff. I feel like with this car, I always take it 80% there and then give up at the end. I just want to kind of tell people, "Yeah, I did this on the car..." instead of someone else.
As for Andy, I've met him quite a few times. I sold him a pair of Bilstein front shocks about 3 years ago for his Dart and then he stopped by to say high this past Spring Fling. Good guy! I always comment on his Junior340 thread on FABO.
Re: MuuMuu's 68 Dart... It's a Learning Process...
[Re: MuuMuu101]
#2527255 07/26/1807:56 AM07/26/1807:56 AM
Congratulations on the upcoming wedding. The small terminal is for the solenoid. It gets 12v when you turn the key. You probably had the 12v supply for the starter touching the solenoid stud when it started spinning over. Hopefully you find the source of your noise soon.
Tim
'71 Charger 383/727 '17 Challenger SXT (Wifeys car )
Re: MuuMuu's 68 Dart... It's a Learning Process...
[Re: MuuMuu101]
#2529376 07/31/1812:06 AM07/31/1812:06 AM
I just reset the starter and it felt like the teeth were engaged when I installed it. It still had problems with starting up. Usually, I'd have to give the car quite a bit of gas before it would engage and start. Today was the opposite. Giving gas first did nothing but free-spin. I actually turned the key without putting my foot on the pedal and barely gave it a little gas before the car started up. So, now I feel more confident it is a starter issue. I was just thinking about getting this starter from Autozone: https://www.autozone.com/batteries-start...odel=&year=
I let the car idle, and it seemed to idle fine. I let it idle for about 15 mins and let it get up to temp. I couldn't really hear the extra noise from the engine compartment, only from underneath the car on the driver's side. So, I'm thinking it's coming from my trans? Now that I think about it, it kinda just sounds like gear noise. So, maybe it's just gear noise vibrating between the concrete floor and the unibody. You can't hear anything standing up next to the car. I only hear it when lying on the ground. Idk, what are your thoughts?
Re: MuuMuu's 68 Dart... It's a Learning Process...
[Re: MuuMuu101]
#2529803 08/01/1812:25 AM08/01/1812:25 AM
Good news: Got the new starter. It is physically smaller than the old one, looks to be built well, weighs 1.8 lbs less, and has a partition for the power and 12V cables so no shorts.
Bad news: I need a larger terminal for the 12V cable as this one is a little larger.
Good news: I'll pick up a terminal at work tomorrow.
On a side note: I did notice that the old starter had slop in the gear shaft whereas the new starter was tight. So my guess is the solenoid was going out.
Re: MuuMuu's 68 Dart... It's a Learning Process...
[Re: MuuMuu101]
#2529935 08/01/1811:34 AM08/01/1811:34 AM
Good news: Got the new starter. It is physically smaller than the old one, looks to be built well, weighs 1.8 lbs less, and has a partition for the power and 12V cables so no shorts.
Bad news: I need a larger terminal for the 12V cable as this one is a little larger.
Good news: I'll pick up a terminal at work tomorrow.
On a side note: I did notice that the old starter had slop in the gear shaft whereas the new starter was tight. So my guess is the solenoid was going out.
That plastic terminal block usually gets in the way and is removable, that's how your old one is. Also look at the bolt holes and if one is larger than the other you'll need to make up a bushing to center it properly for mounting. Ron
That plastic terminal block usually gets in the way and is removable, that's how your old one is. Also look at the bolt holes and if one is larger than the other you'll need to make up a bushing to center it properly for mounting. Ron
So, I checked the clearance between the starter and the headers, and I have about 2.5 fingers of room between the header and the closest stud. When the shop installed my engine, they installed it quite a bit forward, plus I have TTi shorty headers. Also, regarding the hole that is larger than the 7/16" bolt (9/16" hole to be exact), I took some measurements and found a $1.14 bushing from McMaster to fit in the starter and prevent slop (McMaster P/N 9368T143 9/16" OD, 7/16" ID, 0.5" Long - https://www.mcmaster.com/#9368t143/=1dz33ls). I also got some terminals from work, so that should work out well.
So, I installed my starter and the car started right up! The oil was also a little low so I added 3/4 a quart. I still feel like I'm hearing noises, but maybe I'm crazy.
you are way too funny
)
Now that I think about it, it kinda just sounds like gear noise. So, maybe it's just gear noise vibrating between the concrete floor and the unibody. You can't hear anything standing up next to the car. I only hear it when lying on the ground. Idk, what are your thoughts?
