Re: Dead stock 440 & 400 1/4 miles times?
[Re: 70Cuda383]
#2238201
01/21/17 12:12 AM
01/21/17 12:12 AM
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Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 4,715 Wichita
GY3
master
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master
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 4,715
Wichita
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Were factory tolerances that sloppy that ETs are that far apart? One B body ran low 13s while another ran mid 15s? Surely a Couple points of compression aren't worth 2.5 seconds Compression ratios between best and worst factory stuff ranged from 10:1 measured to 7.5:1 measured. 25-30HP? Weight is a huge factor. A 1/10th for every 100 lbs. The 906 heads also flow a bit better stock for stock vs. heads like a 452. 20 cfm best vs. worst is probably 40 hp? Magnum manifolds vs. log type will do 15-20 HP? Things tend to stack up for worst vs. best of all of these.
'63 Dodge 330 11.19 @ 121 mph Pump gas, n/a, through the mufflers on street tires with 3.54's. 3,600 lbs. 10.01 @ 133mph with a 250 shot of nitrous an a splash of race gas. 1.36 60 ft. 3,700 lbs.
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Re: Dead stock 440 & 400 1/4 miles times?
[Re: doba]
#2238225
01/21/17 12:48 AM
01/21/17 12:48 AM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,324 Prospect, PA
BSB67
master
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master
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,324
Prospect, PA
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I ran my 67 back in 1987. The short block was stock with 110,000 miles on it and was very tired. It was burning a lot of oil. I had the heads re-done the right way, new guides and valves and a competition valve grind hoping to cure the oil burning. It did not. Anyways, it ran 14.6s at 94 mph. That was with factory intake and carb and 2 1/4" compression bent exhaust with full body Midas mufflers. The car had air conditioning and weighed about 4300 w/o me in it. This was at Tri-State in early spring so the air was good. Factory single point distributor.
I rebuilt the short block put the same heads, cam and exhaust back on but with a six pack and no AC. Out of the box, it went 14.0 at 101. After tuning it went 13,4s at 103 and some change.
Before I rebuilt the motor, I researched all the old car magazines to see what 440 4bbl and 440 6bbls ran in road tests. I found like ten articles and wrote down car/weight/et/mph/track and date. I converted the data to horsepower. The short of it all (I still have the list) is, with the exception of a couple of outliers, they ran between 94 and 97 mph and about the same hp. Et was a bit more variable, but that was just a function of traction more than anything.
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Re: Dead stock 440 & 400 1/4 miles times?
[Re: doba]
#2239733
01/23/17 12:56 PM
01/23/17 12:56 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 5,160 Texas
dannysbee
master
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master
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 5,160
Texas
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1969 six pack bee. Auto, 1 3/4 no name headers. 12.80-12.90 105-108. Through the mufflers.
Last edited by dannysbee; 01/23/17 12:58 PM.
Getting old just means you were smarter than some and luckier than others.
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Re: Dead stock 440 & 400 1/4 miles times?
[Re: doba]
#2239771
01/23/17 01:54 PM
01/23/17 01:54 PM
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 20,720 in a cattle trailer down by th...
Guitar Jones
Paddle faster! I hear banjo music!
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Paddle faster! I hear banjo music!
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 20,720
in a cattle trailer down by th...
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My 73 Charger with a bone stock 440 ran 15.25 at 4200 pounds and 3.23's. I eventually got the car down to 11.40's but it was still over 3800 pounds at that point.
"Follow me the wise man said, but he walked behind"
'92 D250 Club Cab CTD, 47RH conversion, pump tweaks, injectors, rear disc and hydroboost conversion. '74 W200 Crew Cab 360, NV4500, D44, D60 and NP205 divorced transfer case. Rear disc and hydroboost conversion. 2019 1500 Long Horn Crew Cab 4WD, 5.7 Hemi.
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Re: Dead stock 440 & 400 1/4 miles times?
[Re: doba]
#2239791
01/23/17 02:21 PM
01/23/17 02:21 PM
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,400 Trumbauersville PA
ric3xrt
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,400
Trumbauersville PA
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I had posted this back in the Truck section back in 05-06 My dad and My grandfather took delivery of their trucks on a Tuesday in May back in 78, my Dad had a Midnite express truck, and Grandfather had a Lil Red ,that Sunday they ran both trucks at the old McGuire air force base in Nj, The Midnite truck went a best of 14.41(don't remember Mph the Lil red went 14.60 @98. back in 87 @Atco my 75 D100 step side bone stock 440 no air cleaner with the 727 & 3.90s(not stock) and a set of mccreary tires went 13.96@98 same combo with the A833 Non overdrive went 13.88 @100 Truck with my 160lbs but(at the time) weighed in at 3800.
Truth has no agenda, but those with an agenda make their own truth. Some of us are so open minded they only see their View
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Re: Dead stock 440 & 400 1/4 miles times?
[Re: doba]
#2239840
01/23/17 03:55 PM
01/23/17 03:55 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,515 So. Burlington, Vt.
fast68plymouth
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,515
So. Burlington, Vt.
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In 1987(iirc), I re-ringed the original 69,000 mile 440 from my friends 1969 GTX. Had a valve job done, and installed a Crane 272/.454 hyd cam. Put an 11" converter in the car with 3.91's and he drove the car from S. Burlington, Vt to (as I recall) Quaker City dragway for the second of the Muscle Car Review magazine shootouts. Back then any DOT approved tire and wheel combo was allowed and he ran some sort of MT street stickies on the back(L60-15), with something pretty skinny up front, both mounted on Drag Lites(which came off his Challenger bracket car). I seem to remember it ran like 14.40's out at Quaker City.
When he got back be told me what some of the other guys were running for cams and such, and a few months later there were some articles in the magazine about some of the faster cars at that event, and there were some that had had a little head massaging done to them.
He was interested in going again the next year but wanted to run a bit better. I pulled the heads, did a little bowl porting and swapped the cam out for the bigger Summit cam. Put 4.10's in the rear, and got some repop G70-14's mounted on the OE magnum 500's....... Took it to the track here and ran 13.70's with it.
He never did go back to the shootout.
68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123 Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
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Re: Dead stock 440 & 400 1/4 miles times?
[Re: doba]
#2239853
01/23/17 04:21 PM
01/23/17 04:21 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,207 PA.
pittsburghracer
"Little"John
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"Little"John
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,207
PA.
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This post has sure wondered away from STOCK engines. LOL
1970 Duster Edelbrock headed 408 5.984@112.52 422 Indy headed small block 5.982@112.56 mph 9.42@138.27
Livin and lovin life one day at a time
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Re: Dead stock 440 & 400 1/4 miles times?
[Re: pittsburghracer]
#2239857
01/23/17 04:26 PM
01/23/17 04:26 PM
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,170 CT
GTX MATT
master
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master
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,170
CT
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This post has sure wondered away from STOCK engines. LOL Yeah real fast! I like to hear what people ran with what parts though so I'm not complaining...
Now I need to pin those needles, got to feel that heat Hear my motor screamin while I'm tearin up the street
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Re: Dead stock 440 & 400 1/4 miles times?
[Re: GTX MATT]
#2239860
01/23/17 04:31 PM
01/23/17 04:31 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,207 PA.
pittsburghracer
"Little"John
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"Little"John
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,207
PA.
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This post has sure wondered away from STOCK engines. LOL Yeah real fast! I like to hear what people ran with what parts though so I'm not complaining... 9.80's with a stock .030 over 440 block, TRW pistons, stock rods, stock crank, 906 heads.
1970 Duster Edelbrock headed 408 5.984@112.52 422 Indy headed small block 5.982@112.56 mph 9.42@138.27
Livin and lovin life one day at a time
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Re: Dead stock 440 & 400 1/4 miles times?
[Re: doba]
#2239887
01/23/17 05:32 PM
01/23/17 05:32 PM
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Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 570 UK
rb446
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 570
UK
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In 1989, stock 440-6 motor, Team G, 850DP, 2"hdrs, solid Cam....11.2@118 NA, 10.7@125 with just the addition of 2.14/1.81 906's.
Last edited by rb446; 01/23/17 05:33 PM.
1969 'Cuda 446ci, best 9.96@133.9 in 1990 1971 340 'Cuda, best 11.01@122.8 in 1987
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Re: Dead stock 440 & 400 1/4 miles times?
[Re: doba]
#2239890
01/23/17 05:35 PM
01/23/17 05:35 PM
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,170 CT
GTX MATT
master
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master
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,170
CT
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In what? With what converter/gears/weight
Now I need to pin those needles, got to feel that heat Hear my motor screamin while I'm tearin up the street
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Re: Dead stock 440 & 400 1/4 miles times?
[Re: doba]
#2240005
01/23/17 08:53 PM
01/23/17 08:53 PM
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Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 570 UK
rb446
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 570
UK
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'69 Cuda, A1 4800, 3000lb, 4.88's, 14x32's...would've gone quicker with a smaller cam than the...290@.050 and if we ran more than the 4psi in the slicks back then!...would've thrown those Gabriel 90/10's away as well, would've done things a lot different today, reckon there was a 10.5 in that car as it was though, only ran it 1 time at 10.7 then hit with spray.
Last edited by rb446; 01/23/17 09:11 PM.
1969 'Cuda 446ci, best 9.96@133.9 in 1990 1971 340 'Cuda, best 11.01@122.8 in 1987
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Re: Dead stock 440 & 400 1/4 miles times?
[Re: doba]
#2240028
01/23/17 09:28 PM
01/23/17 09:28 PM
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Joined: May 2004
Posts: 3,210 robin hood country
deaks
master
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master
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 3,210
robin hood country
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Plymouth Scamp,full interior, bench seat, column shift, full weight car plus 6 point roll bar, chassis connectors, cast crank 440, stock low comp pistons, stock heads, purple shaft .474 cam, torker int 750 vs holley, 1"-3/4 headers, points distributor recurved by me, 3.91 s.grip, stock converter, on very thin street tyres walking it out 13.4 at 104 mph. Fitted an 11" tci converter and 9" slicks ran 12.8 at 107mph.
69 Dart GTS 440 mopar .590 cam, Edelbrock heads, 3200# best et 6.45, 106.78, 10.14, 132.88 mph, 1.47 60ft best 60ft 1.36
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Re: Dead stock 440 & 400 1/4 miles times?
[Re: pittsburghracer]
#2240333
01/24/17 11:57 AM
01/24/17 11:57 AM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 8,779 Mt.Gilead, Ohio
OhioMopar
master
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master
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 8,779
Mt.Gilead, Ohio
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This post has sure wondered away from STOCK engines. LOL Did any actually post a stock engine? Lol. Well, it's just like people touting the "Pure Stock" drags. With a compression bump and bigger exhaust... Still cool stuff to read.
1969 Dart GTS 340 1969 Super Bee X9 N-96 1969 Coronet R/T X9 N-96 2015 Dodge Dart GT 2019 Ram 2500 Big Horn. Looking for the original block for my Bee. The last 4 are 7449
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Re: Dead stock 440 & 400 1/4 miles times?
[Re: Tempest]
#2240362
01/24/17 01:00 PM
01/24/17 01:00 PM
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,170 CT
GTX MATT
master
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master
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,170
CT
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This is in line with what I think of performance wise for a "stock" 440 HP car. Of course there were some slower, but low-mid 14s and 99/100 MPH seems to have been a pretty common ET and MPH for these cars new when the magazines tested them. There was one somewhere for a '69 GTX, 440 4 barrel 4 speed 4.10 Super Track Pack car that was 13.6 @ 104. Here is the follow up to that test, pretty cool reading as they take the car to not stock. http://wildaboutcarsonline.com/members/A..._Pt_Two_1-4.pdf
Last edited by GTX MATT; 01/24/17 01:23 PM.
Now I need to pin those needles, got to feel that heat Hear my motor screamin while I'm tearin up the street
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Re: Dead stock 440 & 400 1/4 miles times?
[Re: OhioMopar]
#2240677
01/24/17 10:20 PM
01/24/17 10:20 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,324 Prospect, PA
BSB67
master
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master
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,324
Prospect, PA
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This post has sure wondered away from STOCK engines. LOL Did any actually post a stock engine? Lol. Well, it's just like people touting the "Pure Stock" drags. With a compression bump and bigger exhaust... Still cool stuff to read. I think mine was awful darn close. It is a little hard to fined someone with proof positive evidence that a car was stock, and have et and mph records (verses memory) to go with that. Plus they would need to be members on here too. The cars were "stock" 50 years ago, their production numbers wee not that large, and by 40 years ago, most of them were no longer stock. So, what are we left with? Taking peoples real experience and data for close to stock like cars, and attempting to extrapolate what they probably did 50 years ago stock.
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