That looks nice, what color is that? Is that standard rustoleum?

standard rustoleum,"sand" color,it has quite a gloss to it.

Ok guys...i need more advice! Check out the following pictures:

And a bit closer:

...the best i can describe it is, that "orange peel" reminds me of wood that has been infested with termites. When I try to wet sand, this stuff is impossible to sand out (it's so deep in the finish). When I try to use the polishing compound, the cavities that you see shine brighter because it is paint that hasn't been sanded at all (it's so much further down level-wise than the rest of the paint).

I think I may have the solution, but I want you guys opinion:

1.) I think I may have had the paint too thick on each of the six layers. The bubbles seemed to stay longer than what I gathered from others postings and although the paint did settle some, it tended to get "tacky" with a considerable amount of "orange peel" still in it.

2.) I did not sand the "orange peel" completely out between coats...should I? I basically just sounded it down a bit and went with another coat thinking the final wet-sanding would probably take care of the rest. Again, should I take out ALL of the "orange peel" between coats??

I have sanded the trunk lid down and basically started again. Believe it or not, it took getting most of the paint off to finally get all of the "orange peel"...ridiculous!!

I just about gave it up today, but I am gonna give it some more time. It seems to be working so well for some of you guys. Hope you can help me...thanks in advance, Chuck

Hi Chuck, I've seen those in my paint too, and I agree the paint you're putting on is probably too thick. On the standard rustoleum test area I did, when the paint dried it was nice and smooth and glossy, there shouldn't be much of any orange peel. So go a little thinner, and when you wetsand make sure there are no low spots like in your picture.

You could wetsand at this point with something agressive like 400-600 grit to get the surface smooth again and get rid of those pits, then probably 4 more thin coats would do it, sanding with 800 then 1500 and water.

The thing to remember is it's a Alkyd enamel. Which means it's a very slow drying paint. Thats the main reason why it was fazed from auto use. Sure it feels dry to the touch over night but it has a long way to go. The thicker you put it on. The longer it will be soft. I painted a old furd pick up once with it. I got 8 qt's of Ditzler (b4 the PPG name change)for 10 bucks. Took better then 2 months for the stuff to dry good. I will be spraying my 74 Sat with Rustoleum (3 parts orange 1 part yellow )But I will be spraying over a red primer to keep it thin.

I did some more buffing out on my test panels today (see Project Beer Fridge) and feel confident enough to make a few observations. I think the important point to remember in all this is that your are trying to accomplish an auto paint job on a budget. Atomized paint is going to go on better (less orange peel tecture) than anything rollered on. Period. If this were not the case, auto manufacturers would still be rollering on paint. The trade off for low cost is elbow grease. The bumps you're seeing in your paint job need to be sanded out if you expect to get a mirror finish. End of story. Yes, it's gonna take more coats than you expected. It's also going to take way more time than you expected. The results CAN be glass smooth in the end but you've got to be willing to put the time in to make it so. That means a significant amount of time sanding, painting, sanding, painting, sanding, painting... see what I mean. The alternative is sending the car to the body shop and opening up your wallet. Remember, this whole thread started (basically) as a discussion on how to paint your car with $50. If you're going to factor in your time in $ amounts, then it's an entirely different story.

If you are looking for a smoother surface, I would suggest sanding down again until you're satisfied with the surface, then perhaps thinning the paint a little more before giving it another coat. Be warned, you will still need to sand it again if in the end you want a "mirror" type finish. The areas that I was willing to do the same, came out very nice - glass smooth. The areas that I chose not to sand so aggressively came out with a reasonable orange peel texture. It was only my beer fridge after all, but it was also a test bed of sorts. I can definitely see where if you wanted to do an entire car, and expect to get a superior paint job in the end, you are going to need to invest quite a bit of time. To some, time is cheap, to others time is expensive. That's for you to decide.

JMHO

Rick

can/does that paint come in petty blue?

I guess the thing to understand is, the pictures you are seeing are very minimal "orange peel" compared to when I started buffing this morning. The "orange peel" was terrible and very unexceptable. To remove it, I had to be extemely aggressive with the sanding and sandpaper...800/1000 grit would not begin to touch this stuff. I continually sanded and eventually went to 80 grit to get rid of it and what you are seeing is after the 80 grit...yes after!! You can just imagine what it was like before...terrible.

As far as drying, this was a weeks worth of layering and this stuff was hard as a rock. No worries about dry time...

Unless i'm just missing something, Exit1965 is getting exceptional results...I mean, i'm not looking for perfection. I'm willing to sacrifice. I've had $5000 paint jobs that look like glass and I know that is not what i'm gonna get with this, but I do expect something at least presentable and as good as everyone else. I have friends locally that use enamel regularly with good results (although it is sprayed).

I'm currently trying it considerably thinner with what seems to be better results so far...I guess we'll see. Thanks, Chuck

My OPINION first of all is, good ain't cheap,cheap ain't good!But moving on,I heard the idea of using heat to help CURE the finish,I have'nt heard anyone mention AIRFLOW.Solvents are what is used to help atomize it through the gun onto to the surface being sprayed.After being applicated,these solvents evaporate leaving the more solid material,(paint),behind,also aiding in curing.Ya gotta have the airflow to dry the paint.It's that simple.Extra time in between coats will help but don't exceed manufacturer's recs.Usually heat and airflow work together,but some kinds of paint tend to stay or become soft with heat and start to harden as they cool.For the most part,be above 65*F and have the airflow.When wiping for final prep,regardless what you use be sure you wipe it completly BEFORE it dries,otherwise a film will be left behind altering adhesion.As for buffing,you're better off waiting until the paint is hard or close to it.The friction from the pad will help soften the paint and will help with smoothing out the scratches and bringing to a shine.Good luck!

cheap CAN be good,and good CAN be cheap.

i think we could stop on and on about spraying paint. it's been done like a million times in this thread and i've allways said if you have the skill, time and $, then do it. if you have this tequnique down pat, the process is very simple and does'nt require alot of work. if you apply the paint properly, wetsanding does not take long. i can wetsand the car after 2 coats in about 1-2 hours. i've had $5000 paint jobs, usualy that does'nt involve stripping the car of all chrome, rubber, door handles, ect....to get that done it costs mega $. this method of painting is ment for the average joe, who has a sweet ride in their garage, and all it needs is paint. granted, the job will look as good as the time and effort you put into it. following the whole process on a test peice will let you determine if you have what it takes to do it or not, if not your out a few $ and you can then fork out the $ to someone and have them do it for you. no matter what, if you want it done right, do it yourself, even at $5000, i'm not happy with the job done, but i'm picky, nobody will pay as much attention to detail on YOUR car as YOU will. i've done it all, sprayed my own cars, had it done, and rollered my cars. the outcome is allways the same, because i take the time to do it right. having done both methods myself, i can say it is much eaiser to roller on paint than spray, theres no mess, it's much less stressfull, and you can take your time doing it. as far as the comments on heating the paint to accelerate cureing, the air flow comment is the best way to cure paint. i've mentioned before that it's a good idea to put some fans on the car to accelerate drying. however i find with the rust paint that you can wetsand and polish it the next day unlike sprayed single stage paint jobs, where it's better to wait a few months before you do it. some people have trouble using this method, and some people have very good results, you must take into account the skill of the person, if it is the first time you're painting expect a long learning curve.

I have been following this thread with great interest, but have a couple of questions. I have read that hard to reach places can be difficult to cover. Is there a technique for this? Does anyone think that underneath the hood or trunk needs to be buffed out or just left as is after final sanding? Also, what about water spots on the paint after it is all said and done, wax and all. I live in a rainy area and am worried about water spots forming before the paint has cured. Thanks again for all the input from everyone. This thing is spreading like wildfire!!

Thanks 69Charger. Great stuff here. I am a VW, Porsche guy and saw this on another forumn also. I plan on painting my 68 bug soon so I will let you guys know how it is coming. Thanks again!

Well I've got some results I'm very happy with. This morning I applied the final coat of professional rustoleum (not the 6th coat, since I screwed up a few times), then about 8 hours later, wetsanded with 1500. Immediately after that, I polished with a cheap random orbital sander and cheap turtle wax polish.

here is a picture where I put a grinder case to show the nice reflection..



The shine on this area is definately as good, maybe a bit better, than with the standard rustoleum (the area I just finished was done with Professional rustoleum from Lowes). For those who have not been reading all of this thread, I found in my case that I could scratch the standard Rustoleum and not scratch the professional rustoleum in my previous test areas. On my last professional test area, the surface was in such crappy shape that there was no way to compare it to the standard rustoleum area which was fairly straight, so I straightened out the area in the pic above, and started rollering the professional stuff.

one more pic;


I'm really happy with how it turned out, and when I roll my Dart (1-2 months from now, I hope) I'll be using the Professional rustoleum.

regarding scratches, maybe it's a california thing - but I can use my nail to scratch off the paint on the standard rustoleum can (which has had about 5-6 weeks of drying), but cannot do the same to the professional rustoleum can (4 weeks of drying) so I'm definately going to use the prof. stuff, the price difference is maybe a dollar a quart so there is no reason not to.

I made an album on Flikr to make it easier to upload photos, and there are some other pics I took along with the 2 above. As well as one of my dart which will be coated in this stuff 2 months from now.

here it is:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/xit1965/

you can click any picture then click the little "all sizes" button to see a bigger version or see the full size version (which isn't too big anyways).

Thanks again 69Chargeryeeha

ok heres a question. i only found rustoleum professional in the quart cans. how many cans will it take to paint a whole car? i plan on doing black. now if i need to buy quart cans should i mix all of them together first to make sure the pigment is even? i know on jambs and trunks and engine compartment it won't matter but for the surface it might. if i did one panel at a time. whats the opinion on this? also is there a base rustomleum professional that can be tinted or do you have to use the colors available? if it can be tinted i might go with something other than black.

What does the professional can look like?

All I can find around here is small white quart cans and big silver gallon cans (I only used a quart to paint my whole Z.

There is no way I'm going to sand this whole thing off to repaint it, but I wouldn't mind doing another 2 coats over the top with professional if it will help.