The main thing about the hydraulics has already been mentioned. It's not that it is THAT hard to bend mild steel.........it's just a pain in the balls to do it by hand. First, the bender has to be mounted and mounted VERY well, with a LOT of room around it. How much room? Enough to swing a 15ft stick of tubing to bend a main hoop. So how big is your shop and where are you going to permanently mount this bender that has enough room to bend a main hoop. Secondly, on the hand side you also need a bit of room, because the handle you pull is pretty long. Point is you need a big open area for a manual bender

Can not disagree with you on the space part Monte. I forget my work shop is 30x46 and only has one car in it. Main hoops do take up plenty of real estate when bending them. For me I can't justify spending the $600-700 to convert my bender to Hydraulic when all my stuff is bent.

But the OP is starting from scratch. So it's $395 vs $795. So yes that's a $400 dollar difference, but in the grand scheme of things is peanuts. Just one cage or bar for a buddy and it's paid for. Eat baloney for a month and buy the hydraulic the first time.

I understand budgets, I really do.........but lets be real here. You are getting ready to get started on a back half, big tire RACE car and $400 is a make or break deal?........maybe you should re-evaluate what you are getting ready to do.

I liken this to guys who build 40K motors and put steel rods in them, because they can't "afford" to put $1000 worth of alum rods in it every 150 runs or so.

For anything that needs to be bolted down securely but can't always be in the way, get some flush mount anchors. Many different sizes available, accept standard hardware and when you're done simply unbolt whatever it is and move it out of the way. Nothing sticks up above the slab. You can put plugs in 'em when not in use to keep crap out or just blow 'em out w/air

If you are going to build a simple, plain jane bar or cage that looks like one of the kits they sell and has few bends, then a manual machine will work - after you clear an area in the shop, drill holes in your floor, get the thing mounted and then unbolt it when you are done and throw it in the corner so you can use the space. But if you are going to do more than one, do it to make money, want to do something custom that fits the car nice and doesn't look like a kit and don't have people hanging around to help support the material in the machine and pull the lever around, spend the money.

I have an electric over hydraulic system with a controllable valve on mine that can be used to run the ram very slow to creep up on an angle on something where the fit is critical or run it wide open and pull a 90 in large diameter 4130 in a matter of seconds. It's worth WAY more to me than it cost.

Good sound advice there!
Plus what's your time worth to you?
Faster is not always better but being physically tired while trying to work can't be good either!
Matt

I would buy one in a heart beat if I had more cages to build, but instead I just borrow one in the meantime.

If you are going to build a simple, plain jane bar or cage that looks like one of the kits they sell and has few bends, then a manual machine will work - after you clear an area in the shop, drill holes in your floor, get the thing mounted and then unbolt it when you are done and throw it in the corner so you can use the space. But if you are going to do more than one, do it to make money, want to do something custom that fits the car nice and doesn't look like a kit and don't have people hanging around to help support the material in the machine and pull the lever around, spend the money.


So, only a hydraulic bender will make that custom cage huh, get real dude, I have a 10 X 15 ft area and my bender is clamped in the vise, with braces, on my custom heavy duty bench (made from a 3x10 piece of bowling alley) attached to wall, easy up and down to store in a small place, not a large contraption that needs to be rolled around taking up space. It was well thought out before I bent my first piece, from the space I needed to knowing the leverage I needed to bend comfortably. If you're tired out after one bend, find some other hobby or take it to someone, it's called "work"for a reason. My bender plus the one die cost $795 because I got the heavy duty one. I'm 67 and when I get so I can't pick up heads, blocks, bend pipe or work then I'll quit.

I really appreciate everyones input. And each one of you have extremely valid points. Here's my take. I've never bent up a cage before. The initial investment plus tubing won't cost much more than a preformed, off-the-shelf cage kit. Sorry, but yes, the money is starting to get a little tight. That doesn't mean that circumstances won't change down the road. A hydraulic conversion kit will still be available as an add on if I find it too difficult or time consuming to manually bend bars. It would be great if word gets out, and I get so busy that I have no choice but to buy a hydraulic kit. But I don't feel like I am in such a bad starting point with the quality of bender options available in todays market. I promise that I will keep everyone posted and give credit where it is due.

Are you building a full tube chassis or just
a cage.. were you thinking of a funny car cage
and is it going to be mild or moly... good luck
either way

OK, we get it, your a he-man and like to show off your muscles and work hard for no reason. What if the OP doesn't have a heavy enough bench and a vice to anchor his bender down. He is going to have to build one, or drill holes in the floor to anchor the stand, that will also have to buy to mount the bender to. Either of these will take time and money, as he will likely have to buy materials to build a bench or maybe buy a large vice. My TIME is worth a lot to me and I chose to work smarter, not harder.

I have built a many a car with a hand bender, but it ain't no damn fun. Plus you nearly always need help or fab up some stuff to help you hold the tubing level while you step over and start pulling the lever and moving the pin. Can you do it.......sure can. Can also cut a 8" tree with an ax.....I choose to use a chainsaw

Mr P: Planning on putting a 12 point C/M cage on top of my frame. Will probably add a funny car cage to cert to 7.50's. By then, I hope to have the hydraulic setup.
Monte: I appreciate the concerns and inputs. Yes, I'm starting smalltime, but plan on growing as my desires and demands increase. I can't honestly say how hard or easy this is going to be. But I'm not afraid to try and I will figure it out soon enough. I've built engines in my bedroom, transmissions on the kitchen table. I backhalved my car while still on the trailer. I built the whole frame and set up the body to be bolt on with no physical help at all. You just got done saying you've built plenty of cars with a hand bender. Let me have this experience, I'm sure I will enjoy it, regardless of effort needed.

If that works for you, that's great. I thought my machine out too. It takes up a 26"x26" footprint on the floor, everything. Plug it into 220, flip the switch and bend pipe. It helps me to make nice things without struggling, just like everything else in the shop that I plug into an electrical outlet or an air hose. Although I enjoy it, it's not really a hobby. There has to be some efficiency to the process. I just thought someone might benefit from my opinions, experiences and recommendations. They can do what they like with that information, dude.

You can always add hydraulics to it later. Get the bender and get to it. I know the road your headed down, it's fun and more rewarding knowing you built it from the ground up.

To Monte and CMcALLISTER, opinions are like butts everyone has one. Just because you do something one way don't make it right, so excuse me if I don't follow your dumb a$$ advice. sgcuda do it your way and to he!! with these self righteous know it alls, you're on the right track.

That's a little harsh on the call outs, and really didn't need to be said, valid or not. I think we all here are capable of coming to any of that conclusion on own.

I intentionally did not quote to facilitate you possibly rethinking the wording, if you are open to taking a hint.

Maybe to harsh, but I'm getting tired of the put down from some of these self-proclaimed "expert" members where they have to be right and you're wrong. The only reason I put my two cents in is to help the newer guys with the real-life experiences I've learned over the years.

Cuda.......The point you kept making was you were less than a man if you couldn't pull a manual bender, were out of shape, or lazy and I believe the word you used was "wimps". Also said the suggestion of a hydraulic is dumbazz advice. So YOU started the back and forth........ So some of us were passing along OUR experience. As stated, I bent a many cage with a manual bender......BUT as I also stated, it has to be VERY well mounted, you need a good bit of room, usually need help, it's slow, not as accurate and a bunch of other things, that make it not the BEST way to do it. If the OP has never bent tubing, he doesn't know any of that. Our first shop was so small, we had to push the car out, or mount the bender outside, as there wasn't room for both. That's rough when cold or raining. I didn't know that would be the case and I wished somebody had told ME before I bought my first bender and would have saved and got the hydraulic the first time. But I didn't have the option of getting on the net and asking others, had to figure it out

Question for you............do you cut your tubing with a chop saw or a hacksaw? If you have a chop saw, why? Can't it be just as well done with a hacksaw, only requiring more "work" which you seem to be such a fan of. Do you use "power" tools at all? If so, why?...........does this seem silly? Same as your arguments against us for suggesting hydraulic. Anything can be done manually, but why is suggesting the easier way bad or dumba$$ advice?.......Willie Rells used to fill tubing with sand, heat with a torch and hand bend between posts welded on a table. That's the way he built Pro-Stocks............maybe the OP should do it that way

Yeah, I bought a manual jd bender in the 90s. I bent my hoop with it, then adapted a porta power. That worked only slightly better.
The bender evolved over the years and is now portable, and almost automated. It has adjustable limit switches with electric over hydraulic controls, and can repeat dead nuts on.
I would not want to use the manual version anymore, and didn't after one hoop.

Dude is excited to get building, that is the biggest thing that matters. Who cares how he gets there but that he is. He might become Johnny Atlas in the process. Having a mobile hydro bender might be where he ends up,but that just means he is streamlining his operation, not a sissy.