Re: pros and cons of solid flat tappet vs solid roller
[Re: mopar dave]
#2062872
04/27/16 05:32 PM
04/27/16 05:32 PM
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Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 4,457 Washington
madscientist
master
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master
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 4,457
Washington
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It's 2016. 7k might as well be at idle.
Some day, it will occur dawn on some of us that RPM is just as important as torque, maybe more so.
If you can't spin a 511 7k may as well park it. Guys leave way too much on the table with tight converters, no gear and tow truck RPM.
Just because you think it won't make it true. Horsepower is KING. To dispute this is stupid. C. Alston
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Re: pros and cons of solid flat tappet vs solid roller
[Re: nss guy]
#2062895
04/27/16 06:03 PM
04/27/16 06:03 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,944 Weddington, N.C.
Streetwize
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,944
Weddington, N.C.
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@ Madscientist
Generally maybe but a lot heads today have the flow capabilities to push the Torque and HP peaks past where a lot of people feel safe pushing a stock block RB motor. Also not everybody runs MW heads on their 511's so the port flow/velocity is somewhat of an RPM "check valve" limiting the RPM no matter where the valvetrain could go.
and (opinions vary I guess but) many if not most 493-511's usually wind up dropping into heavy B and E bodies with automatics and mid 3 series carriers, so not everybody wants or needs to turn them much past 6200-6500 to have a fun and formidable torque monster. Ron's (383Man's) 63 B has a comparably mild Street driven 493 with ported EZ MW's and runs 10.70's through the muffs, not too shabby and he's not revving all that high. so I guess just because you can doesn't mean you should...or even need to.
Last edited by Streetwize; 04/27/16 06:05 PM.
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Re: pros and cons of solid flat tappet vs solid roller
[Re: Streetwize]
#2062900
04/27/16 06:13 PM
04/27/16 06:13 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,279 PA.
pittsburghracer
"Little"John
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"Little"John
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,279
PA.
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And your stock blocks will thank you for it by lasting a lot longer
1970 Duster Edelbrock headed 408 5.984@112.52 422 Indy headed small block 5.982@112.56 mph 9.38@138.67
Livin and lovin life one day at a time
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Re: pros and cons of solid flat tappet vs solid roller
[Re: DrCharles]
#2063110
04/27/16 11:14 PM
04/27/16 11:14 PM
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Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,845 Tampa
DusterDave
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,845
Tampa
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The big con with a flat tappet cam is, if your break-in procedure wasn't done perfectly, and/or you are not using the correct oil (which is getting harder to find locally anymore) I'm pretty sure those little bottles of ZDDP (zinc) are still available? you run the risk of some lobes going round, and really messing up your crank, bearings and piston skirts. It happened to me, and many, many others. I can see the wear particles from the cam & lifters being thrown into the cylinder bores by splash, but how would they get through the oil filter to the crank and bearings? Nobody's mentioned the old "Mini-Express" mushroom cam/lifters P3690588 (316 adv. @ 0.654) and there's a bigger one 328, 0.690. Lifters are a PITA to change but the few people who have run one have had good things to say about the performance. I think it's around 270 duration @.050. A lot cheaper than a roller setup... So, you say you can't afford one of them high dollar roller cam setups like the rich Ricky racers have? No problem, bro, just do what Joe Dirt did!
Gone to the dark side with an LS3 powered '57 Chevy 210
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Re: pros and cons of solid flat tappet vs solid roller
[Re: mopar dave]
#2063135
04/27/16 11:37 PM
04/27/16 11:37 PM
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 2,154 Its a TRAP!
DARTH V8Я
Oh No!! I just had a moron attack!
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Oh No!! I just had a moron attack!
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 2,154
Its a TRAP!
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Who said anything about revving it to 7 grand? The LS7 was just an example.
@ mad scientist, there literally millions of beehive springs in use (and some pretty high horsepower high revving engines) with an almost next to nothing failure rate. IF you broke so many springs.. something else is at foot.
When it takes more than a sweet mullet to prove you rule at the trailer park..
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Re: pros and cons of solid flat tappet vs solid roller
[Re: mopar dave]
#2063210
04/28/16 04:05 AM
04/28/16 04:05 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,421 Balt. Md
383man
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,421
Balt. Md
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Im glad to see a few flat tappet users out there having good results. I'm really not too worried about the amount of power loss with a flat tappet at this point as this will be 90% street driven. Just a pain to break in. The roller worries would be with the valve spring and lift rebuilds. I used to have mine rebuilt every 3yrs which was about 2000miles and maybe 50 passes. I dont think I said that I do use the Comp EDM lifters and as said i have had great results with no problems so far in the almost 5 years my eng has been together. Ron
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Re: pros and cons of solid flat tappet vs solid roller
[Re: B3422W5]
#2063211
04/28/16 04:12 AM
04/28/16 04:12 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,421 Balt. Md
383man
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,421
Balt. Md
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I will give you great advice. Call Dwayne Porter, go with his suggestion, and have him order you a cam. He knows 100% what he is doing and that takes the guesswork out of it. I have personal experience using his help, and the cams worked perfect. That is great advice as its what I did. I was considering a roller but after talking to Dwayne and telling him how much I plan to drive on the street he recomended that I would most likely be happier with a solid flat tappet which I am. He speced my custom grind solid flat tappet and I could not be happier with the results and great service it has given me. Dwayne is a Pro who does this every day and knows what he is doing and I would say he is as good as anyone out there. Heck I have been an auto tech all my life and been around hotrods and muscle cars most of my life and feel I know cams pretty well. But I dont do it (Performance cams and heads) for a living every day and I dont run my engines on dyno's like he does when he builds them so he gets to see what has worked best and he can test his work which helps him know what works good and best. You cant go wrong calling Dwayne and talking to him. Good luck with your build which ever cam you decide on. Ron
Last edited by 383man; 04/28/16 06:57 PM.
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Re: pros and cons of solid flat tappet vs solid roller
[Re: Streetwize]
#2063212
04/28/16 04:17 AM
04/28/16 04:17 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,421 Balt. Md
383man
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,421
Balt. Md
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@ Madscientist
Generally maybe but a lot heads today have the flow capabilities to push the Torque and HP peaks past where a lot of people feel safe pushing a stock block RB motor. Also not everybody runs MW heads on their 511's so the port flow/velocity is somewhat of an RPM "check valve" limiting the RPM no matter where the valvetrain could go.
and (opinions vary I guess but) many if not most 493-511's usually wind up dropping into heavy B and E bodies with automatics and mid 3 series carriers, so not everybody wants or needs to turn them much past 6200-6500 to have a fun and formidable torque monster. Ron's (383Man's) 63 B has a comparably mild Street driven 493 with ported EZ MW's and runs 10.70's through the muffs, not too shabby and he's not revving all that high. so I guess just because you can doesn't mean you should...or even need to. Thank you for the kind words Wize. I foot brake to about 2k on the line and shift about 6200 and trap around 6400. Thats when I look at the tach because I wont lie most of the time I shift when it feels right but its about 6200. Ron
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Re: pros and cons of solid flat tappet vs solid roller
[Re: mopar dave]
#2063374
04/28/16 01:01 PM
04/28/16 01:01 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,530 Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,530
Marion, South Carolina [><]
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CHIP '70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60 '69 road runner, 440-6, 4 speed, Dana 60 '71 Demon 340, no drivetrain, on blocks behind the barn '73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75 '90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt '06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
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Re: pros and cons of solid flat tappet vs solid roller
[Re: Airwoofer]
#2063435
04/28/16 02:37 PM
04/28/16 02:37 PM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,890 North Alabama
Monte_Smith
master
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master
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,890
North Alabama
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As for the beehive springs, I saw the springs on the Burick Monte works on one day at the track. They are really thin bee hives which blew me away as that thing probably has about an inch of valve lift.
Say what? Don't know what you thought you saw, but it was no bee hive spring. What you saw was a Pac triple spring with 450lbs of seat pressure. And the cam is about 1.200 on the lift
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