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Re: Trick Flow heads [Re: fast68plymouth] #1962067
12/02/15 09:31 PM
12/02/15 09:31 PM
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Kalispell Mt.
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HotRodDave Offline
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MPH can be skewed by a lot of things un related to the engine also... aero dynamics, gearing, stall, chassis set up, driver... just to name a few. Dyno and flow bench are tools to help you get a better number at the track but if you don't know how to use them they are worthless just like a wrench if you don't know what to do with it.


I am not causing global warming, I am just trying to hold off a impending Ice Age!



Re: Trick Flow heads [Re: mcat4321] #1962259
12/03/15 03:52 AM
12/03/15 03:52 AM
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Posts: 3,250
Between a rock & a hard place
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Between a rock & a hard place
Originally Posted By mcat4321
i dont get excited about flowbench or dyno numbers..MPH answers my questions


This!! ^^^^^^^^^^

Re: Trick Flow heads [Re: AndyF] #1962283
12/03/15 09:05 AM
12/03/15 09:05 AM
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,057
The Great White North
RAMM Offline
super stock
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The Great White North
Originally Posted By AndyF
Originally Posted By fast68plymouth
On another topic, Andy.... Did you check the net lift with and without lash with the full sping load?
I'm wondering how much flex is in those rockers.


I haven't done that yet but I will try to remember to next time I'm over at the dyno shop. We're planning to do some more carb and intake manifold testing the end of this week. I'd love to hit 700 hp with this combo but I'm guessing that I need a little bigger cam in order to see that number.

Torque peak right now is at 5700 with peak HP at 6300. Cam is 271/.460 lobe single pattern. We'll try a lash cycle and maybe retard the cam a couple of degrees to see which way to go for more power.


Peak HP and TQ only occuring 600 rpm apart? Any chance of valvetrain instability? Peak power I would expect a minimum of 1000 rpm more than TQ = 6700. I doubt it's the cam's duration. J.Rob


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Re: Trick Flow heads [Re: fast68plymouth] #1962360
12/03/15 12:25 PM
12/03/15 12:25 PM
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Posts: 31,274
Oregon
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Oregon
I don't think we have a valvetrain issue, at least I don't see or hear any signs of it. Torque peak is probably closer to 5300 than 5700. The last report I ran said 5700 but when I look at the numbers it looks like the peak is 5300 and then 5700 just had a little spike which might not be real.

Intake manifold vacuum starts to go back up over 6000 rpm so I think that is what I need to focus on first. Not sure if I'm running out of air or if the gauge is getting wacky on me.

Re: Trick Flow heads [Re: AndyF] #1964008
12/05/15 08:32 PM
12/05/15 08:32 PM
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 85
Washington PA
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69 plymouth rnr Offline
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Washington PA
Andy,can you please post as much info on that build as possible???
Looks very interesting???
Thank Nick

Re: Trick Flow heads [Re: fast68plymouth] #1964956
12/07/15 03:23 PM
12/07/15 03:23 PM
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Oregon
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Oregon
It is just a bracket motor type build with some upgraded parts. 10.5 shelf pistons from Diamond, 6.70 long Chevy rods, 3.91 crank (SCAT Superlight). I'll be running a big solid solid roller so I went with the Jesel front drive kit (belt drive and belt driven distributor). Trick Flow heads right out of the box, a Victor intake (or Mopar M1 4500) and a 850 DP carb.

The Superlight crank is a little higher end part than most guys use as is the Jesel front kit but neither of those items are "exotic". Just stuff that the typical bracket guy doesn't spend money on.

I haven't sorted out the camshaft yet. The first one I tried might be a bit too big for this engine so I'll try a smaller one next. The pump gas compression makes the cam choice a little more difficult.

Re: Trick Flow heads [Re: fast68plymouth] #1968764
12/13/15 01:12 AM
12/13/15 01:12 AM
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Oregon
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Oregon
Originally Posted By fast68plymouth
On another topic, Andy.... Did you check the net lift with and without lash with the full sping load?
I'm wondering how much flex is in those rockers.


I checked the net lift with the full spring load and there doesn't appear to be much flex. Gross lift is .690 but actual net lift with 0.015 cold lash is .680. So that tells me that the rocker arms are a touch more than the 1.50 adv ratio. With the checking spring and no lash I was getting around .694 so there doesn't appear to be much flex at all.

DSC_9241 (Large).JPG
Re: Trick Flow heads [Re: fast68plymouth] #1968783
12/13/15 02:17 AM
12/13/15 02:17 AM
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Posts: 707
st.louis,mo.
dart games Offline
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st.louis,mo.
andy f,so your saying the jesel belt drive is the best choice,dont the belt has to be changed every year

Re: Trick Flow heads [Re: fast68plymouth] #1968789
12/13/15 02:37 AM
12/13/15 02:37 AM
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Posts: 14,545
So. Burlington, Vt.
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fast68plymouth Offline OP
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Looks like those rockers are quite rigid. Be nice if they started making those again.


68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123
Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
Re: Trick Flow heads [Re: fast68plymouth] #1968802
12/13/15 03:25 AM
12/13/15 03:25 AM
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Posts: 181
Maryland
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Maryland
Another steel rocker besides comp would be nice! I contacted ras a couple weeks ago and they said they will have another rocker out for us soon.

Re: Trick Flow heads [Re: AndyF] #1968971
12/13/15 02:41 PM
12/13/15 02:41 PM
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Posts: 576
Texas
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ChevyTS Offline
mopar
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Texas
Originally Posted By AndyF
Originally Posted By fast68plymouth
On another topic, Andy.... Did you check the net lift with and without lash with the full sping load?
I'm wondering how much flex is in those rockers.


I checked the net lift with the full spring load and there doesn't appear to be much flex. Gross lift is .690 but actual net lift with 0.015 cold lash is .680. So that tells me that the rocker arms are a touch more than the 1.50 adv ratio. With the checking spring and no lash I was getting around .694 so there doesn't appear to be much flex at all.
Nice indicator set-up!


T & K Performance
Re: Trick Flow heads [Re: twayne24365] #1968974
12/13/15 02:47 PM
12/13/15 02:47 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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Originally Posted By twayne24365
Another steel rocker besides comp would be nice! I contacted ras a couple weeks ago and they said they will have another rocker out for us soon.


From what I have heard.. I dont know for fact.. but
TD is making steel rockers also.. I dont know what
they fit or if they are making for BB or SB
wave

Re: Trick Flow heads [Re: HotRodDave] #1968976
12/13/15 02:54 PM
12/13/15 02:54 PM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 10,061
MI, usa
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MI, usa
Originally Posted By HotRodDave
MPH can be skewed by a lot of things un related to the engine also... aero dynamics, gearing, stall, chassis set up, driver... just to name a few. Dyno and flow bench are tools to help you get a better number at the track but if you don't know how to use them they are worthless just like a wrench if you don't know what to do with it.

MPH will never be calibrated beyond what it is. Factors causing it to be low yes, but not high.
Doug

Re: Trick Flow heads [Re: dart games] #1969024
12/13/15 04:05 PM
12/13/15 04:05 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 31,274
Oregon
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Oregon
Originally Posted By 440outlawdart
andy f,so your saying the jesel belt drive is the best choice,dont the belt has to be changed every year


I like to use a belt drive when using a big solid roller. The belt drive provides a solid thrust adjustment, it works well with the crank trigger, it provides a simple way to mount a belt driven distributor and it makes it easy to adjust/change the camshaft.

DSC_9217 (Large).JPG
Re: Trick Flow heads [Re: fast68plymouth] #1969053
12/13/15 05:06 PM
12/13/15 05:06 PM
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 207
warren, mich.
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dwayne welder Offline
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warren, mich.
Andy; what rockers do you have on those haeds? I see that you have mopar valve covers? Thanks

Re: Trick Flow heads [Re: dwayne welder] #1969074
12/13/15 05:55 PM
12/13/15 05:55 PM
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Posts: 31,274
Oregon
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AndyF Offline
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Oregon
Originally Posted By dwayne welder
Andy; what rockers do you have on those haeds? I see that you have mopar valve covers? Thanks


Rocker arms are from RAS. Yes, I have MP covers but I don't really like them. I'm going to make my own covers since I'm tired of messing around with stuff that doesn't fit right.

DSC_9170 (Large).JPG
Re: Trick Flow heads [Re: fast68plymouth] #1969109
12/13/15 06:58 PM
12/13/15 06:58 PM
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 207
warren, mich.
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dwayne welder Offline
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warren, mich.
Do you think Andy that with T&D rockers those rocker arm covers will work? Thanks

Re: Trick Flow heads [Re: fast68plymouth] #1969148
12/13/15 08:50 PM
12/13/15 08:50 PM
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 506
Utah, USA
1
1964superstock Offline
mopar
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Posts: 506
Utah, USA
What brand and size of studs are those for the valve covers? Are those Moroso Gaskets?

Re: Trick Flow heads [Re: fast68plymouth] #1969211
12/13/15 10:45 PM
12/13/15 10:45 PM
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Posts: 1,096
Australia
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ozymaxwedge Offline
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Australia
I have a set of these heads coming to Australia for a mild 440 build.
Thanks for all the info Andy.


1963 Plymouth Max Wedge
1971 Barracuda
Re: Trick Flow heads [Re: 1964superstock] #1969216
12/13/15 10:51 PM
12/13/15 10:51 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 31,274
Oregon
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AndyF Offline
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Oregon
Originally Posted By 1964superstock
What brand and size of studs are those for the valve covers? Are those Moroso Gaskets?


ARP stainless steel valve cover studs. Moroso valve cover gaskets.

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