Fighting the mopar battle in a real class, other than PS is never going to pay off. IT is fun to experiment though.

The 5.3 bs motors are so far ahead it's like comparing a small block to a big block. Run a brad, and you'd better not get hot lapped, but you can buy ready to install parts for anything you could ever break.

Mopar is wait for this, wait for that, personalities to be dealt with all the way.

Also as for indy being greedy. Given how few predator buyers there are, I'm surprised they're as cheap as they are.

sorry just saw this post and hopefully this will give an idea on potential in a small tire heavy car application…. We are still working out the bugs on my 610 Predator but are very please with the progress… We were at 3150lbs on 275s in Memphis last month and went 1.101 sixty 4.566 @155.90 mph… we had hurt the motor GA and only had time to patch up so put head gaskets and was a little down on compression on 2 cyl so we pulled the plug after 1st qual… My engine made 1210 on a tight dyno and I know that is only a number… we are spraying a hefty dose but only one kit..can't wait to get back out

We have been running our 496 predator headed engine for over 5 years very little problems in a 2850# car with driver 7.68 at 178 with a 727 coming out in 2nd. gear.
This year we up graded to a RJ car with Andy McCoy duster pro-mod body same engine combo 2240# with driver and a glide.
Going testing in 2 weeks.

I finally got mine out, and it's not up to par yet. It's a 572 Predator, and it took lots-o-money to finish and get going. I ran a best of 7.66@166 on the brakes during eliminations. It only 60's in the 1.14-1.17 zone because the converter is Way too tight for this combo. It make max torque at 6500 and HP at 7700, so it can't flash the converter and is very lazy out of the hole. If I had NOS, it would run lot's better, but I don't. I have a new converter on order, and will be heading down to sea level next week. Oh...I forgot to mention, our track was 8000ft corrected altitude.

I'm hoping to get my car in the mid 7's so I can run A/Gas 7.60 index

596 Predator/Glide and the car should be 2450lbs on the starting line.

So what would a set of these make in street trim at 605 cubes on pump gas? Would they be too much for a street strip combo?

Does anyone other than Indy make header flanges for Predator heads?

I'm sure any machine shop would make flanges if you
give them some numbers.. I make all my own flanges

Currently, I run a B1 Original Mopar Engine here in Colorado. We run in a small tire heads up class, and are the only Mopar running these classes in Colorado.

We were the fastest car at the entire Mopar Show by a full second! In a 3440 lbs, stock suspension (Cal-Tracs), 28x10.5 tired Plymouth Duster.

Best Et 9.09 and best mph of 149.

I might have been middle of the pack at the Chevy Show.

I have owned and raced nothing but Mopar for 17 years, but am finally to the point of switching brands. Happy to keep Mopar as my street car, but it just doesn't make sense when trying to make big power.

I agree with Monte on all of this. I will always love Mopar, but with the cost involved in a Predator engine, you would be way ahead (money and power) by being willing to run "non-mopar" style of engine.

I give it up for the guys that are willig to drop all that coin and still be behind the curve though.

I still think an opportunity is being missed here…A good splay valve, symmetrical head (predator concept….ok….big chief ) and someone can make 1200 pretty easy and spray your way into 1500 if/when needed without a sweat. That range of power will cover the masses that want to run mopar stuff in fast bracket, top dragster, top sportsman….4.50 classes and so on.

I honestly believe this would do well, providing blocks can be had to support this….I know another topic.

FWIW….I also don’t buy into that negativity about being too expensive or the ratio of development cost and demand vs ROI. Now that the market is getting saturated with GM stuff, a manufacture could do the mopar, keep it priced right and still win the same share of margin ($$$ percentage) that’s the bottom line in financial gain. That does not mean price it the same, I would expect to pay a little more.

This shyt of marking it up like it currently is, is why it doesn’t sell and thus the very reason it wont grow.

Ran good over weekend in the 1/8 mile

.997 60ft.
2.825 330ft.
4.354 1/8
161.38 MPH

Going out this Sunday last race for us.

Again this is a 496 cu.in. engine.

If I didn't already have a KB block etc I might have gone chevy just because it would cost half as much.

A predator engine with 10-11 lbs makes 1650HP no problem and 2200ish on 20-21 without breaking a sweat. Haven't turned it upto 25-30 lbs but it hasn't hit a wall yet. Now who knows how long the head gaskets will hold in for.

N/A you can make 1000-1100 street engine without too much effort on engine, its all on cam selection and matching of parts.

As for reliability the valve train seems to be pretty bulletproof when pushrod oiling and keeping the heat in check.

If anyone is looking for a set of ARP 625+ 7/16" head studs to fit a seat of predators on a KB block I have a spare set.....

Man o man that's flying, and a great 60.

What, if you don't mind, did that 496 make NA, and how many kits? I'm asking for reference with what I'm trying to do. I have an RJ PS stratus that with the nitrous stuff, and me on board is 2450 pounds right now with a 588 hemi and one kit.

I'm building a 660 predator now with a tall deck hemi block and 2, or 3 kits for the car. I just finished a single 4 barrel 636 pred that made 1200 as an experiment with the heads, so I'm optimistic about their potential. Reading what your 496 can make,and take is way encouraging.

If there's a link, or more info about your car I'd love to look at it. The car is beautiful!

That seems to be what most are saying about them. I am an NA guy, always have been. And I was kinda thinking these would be right around 1000 NA in street/strip trim depending on cam and compression. Maybe even a tad north of 1k power. Most of the street/strip big cube Hemis are in the +800-900 range, and the Predator heads outflow most of them. Seems like a good valve train to take advantage of the higher ratios on too..I would like to build one of these some day for a drag week type car so its very interesting to see what you guys are able to do with them.

I see the gripes about the initial costs of these heads, but most people that go the Millennium head route won't tell you what that ended up costing them. Heck, there is no cast intake I know of that fits them. So when you consider an NA Millennium headed Hemi vs. a Predator headed engine of the same size, I bet the later is more cost effective in the end, proves more reliable, and makes a tad more power.

My next curiosity, what is the best trans to put behind a Predator engine? I bet everyone that runs one has something different based on their application, but I still like to know....You guys running a 2 speed or a 3 speed?

Engine is a KB block, deck 9.800, filled solid, 41/2" bore, 390 stroke, cool heads only, ported by Mike Duke, 1 carb 1250, w/.090 jets,home made intake & valve covers, 1 NX fogger spraying a 600 shot F.031/N.046 87/8fuel psi., NO-2 fuel, power glide 1.80, 4.11 gear, wet sump oil 8 qt. system,23/8 stepped into21/2" with 41/2" merged collectors, cam spec's. I.780/285 @.050 E.763/294 @.050, 114 center line, T&D 1.8 rockers, I.890 E.900 lift, shift at 7800 thru traps at 8200, car weight 2220# with driver, launch at 4000, 17x331/2x16 tires, we dump the air in shocks at .08 out, 110 springs now, need softer springs, single wheelie bar on rear

Converter is slipping 14% and running rich at 13.25/13.75 on O-2 sensors
Down track timing is 16* could go 17* maybe 18*
Ran 19* with 500 shot no problems for 5 years

Can see video's do web search Kucia racing

Have more info too.
Thinking about going to a Pro Charger later

Thanks

What are you looking for as your target AF ratio?

I complete Predator top end is $11,200 ish, that's complete cnc heads, riockers, intake, valve covers, heads studs, pretty much everything to bolt them on except for pushrods. For instance an SR20 BBC head is $8800ish that's CNC head and rockers. Still need valve covers intake etc. While the SR 20 has less flow than a Predator they can go on a 4.600 bore space deal which is not a luxury a Mopar guy can do. I honestly do not have a ton in my Predator deal, other than the block work we have done which was an additional 4K mainly to straighten up the pushrod. FWIW mine is a nitrous deal to although we do not plan to spray it this time around, hoping we can do ok NA with a nitrous cam and piston design.

2200 and change is light. Isn't Top Sportsman BB Nitrous weight 2450?? One of the reason we are staying NA is to stay at the 2200lb minimum, or as close as we can get anyway. We are thinking we will be able to go 7.teens NA

we would like to be at 12.5/12.75 AF

That would be richer, no?

Yes a fair amount