Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2
Help me decide Holley 650 or 750 #178294
12/29/08 07:35 PM
12/29/08 07:35 PM
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 406
Houma, Louisiana
T
twister360 Offline OP
mopar
twister360  Offline OP
mopar
T

Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 406
Houma, Louisiana
Currently I have a built 360 Magnum motor in my 74 Duster. I have Magnum heads that have been mildly ported, a Comp Cam with 230* intake and 236* exhaust at .050 amd .544 lift on intake and .555 on exhaust,RPM air gap dual plane intake, with a Holley 3310 750 CFM vaccuum secondaries. The car has a 3200 stall converter in a 904 with TCI shift kit and a fresh rebuild of tranny,and 3.91 gears in a SG 8 1/4 rear end and Mickey Thompsons 275x60x15 ET street radials.

My problem is that the carb seems too rich. This combo was dynoed at 400 HP / 410 torque at the flywheel, but once installed in the car, there seemed to be too much fuel and has a strong smell of gas.

Is this too much carb for the motor? I have some that tell me to go to a Holley 4777 650 CFM, and the car will get better gas mileage and be faster at the track.

Which carb would you run and why? Thanks Moparts


My car 74 Duster mild 360/904/3.91 13.44/101.54 Son's car 75 Dart Sport 318/904/4.10 looking for a 360 or 408 2004 Dodge Ram 1500 Laramie 5.7 2010 Dodge Challenger R/T Classic B-5 6 speed 2010 Jeep SRT8 for the little wife
Re: Help me decide Holley 650 or 750 [Re: twister360] #178295
12/29/08 07:46 PM
12/29/08 07:46 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,826
las vegas
70AARcuda Offline
master
70AARcuda  Offline
master

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,826
las vegas
check your vacuum ...and then check your power valve in the holley...

also...adjust your idle mixture screws..

check your float levels too...

i have a similar cam in my 73 duster and it runs great with a 750 vacuum holley..

Last edited by 70AARcuda; 12/29/08 07:47 PM.

Tony

70 AARCuda Vitamin C
71 Dart Swinger 360 10.318 @ 128.22(10-04-14 Bakersfield)
71 Demon 360 10.666 @122.41 (01-29-17 @ Las Vegas)
71 Duster 408 (10.29 @ 127.86 3/16/19 Las Vegas)
Re: Help me decide Holley 650 or 750 [Re: twister360] #178296
12/29/08 07:50 PM
12/29/08 07:50 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,020
Andrews,In. U.S.of A.
6
67_Satellite Offline
super stock
67_Satellite  Offline
super stock
6

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,020
Andrews,In. U.S.of A.
Sounds like you have a carb. problem but it has nothing to do with the carb. size. Keep the 750 and fix/tune it.

Re: Help me decide Holley 650 or 750 [Re: 70AARcuda] #178297
12/29/08 08:19 PM
12/29/08 08:19 PM
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 406
Houma, Louisiana
T
twister360 Offline OP
mopar
twister360  Offline OP
mopar
T

Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 406
Houma, Louisiana
I have checked the power valve and it is okay. Where should the level be in the bowls? What should I look for when checking the vaccuum? Where is a good starting point on the mixture screws? Thanks for the info.


My car 74 Duster mild 360/904/3.91 13.44/101.54 Son's car 75 Dart Sport 318/904/4.10 looking for a 360 or 408 2004 Dodge Ram 1500 Laramie 5.7 2010 Dodge Challenger R/T Classic B-5 6 speed 2010 Jeep SRT8 for the little wife
Re: Help me decide Holley 650 or 750 [Re: twister360] #178298
12/29/08 08:25 PM
12/29/08 08:25 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,826
las vegas
70AARcuda Offline
master
70AARcuda  Offline
master

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,826
las vegas
Quote:

I have checked the power valve and it is okay. Where should the level be in the bowls? What should I look for when checking the vaccuum? Where is a good starting point on the mixture screws? Thanks for the info.





check the vacuum..where the power brakes or pvc on the carb is...

u want to compare that with the power valve..u dont want the power valve opening to early cause that dump extra gas into the carb..

float level should be at the lower edge of sight hole in side of bowl..


Tony

70 AARCuda Vitamin C
71 Dart Swinger 360 10.318 @ 128.22(10-04-14 Bakersfield)
71 Demon 360 10.666 @122.41 (01-29-17 @ Las Vegas)
71 Duster 408 (10.29 @ 127.86 3/16/19 Las Vegas)
Re: Help me decide Holley 650 or 750 [Re: 70AARcuda] #178299
12/29/08 08:30 PM
12/29/08 08:30 PM

A
Anonymous
Unregistered
Anonymous
Unregistered
A



adjust mixture screws 1/4 turn at a time for highest vacuum. then reset idle speed

Re: Help me decide Holley 650 or 750 [Re: twister360] #178300
12/29/08 08:33 PM
12/29/08 08:33 PM
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,629
wilmington,ohio
O
ohiodemon Offline
top fuel
ohiodemon  Offline
top fuel
O

Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,629
wilmington,ohio
what jets sizes are you running ?
check your float levels-with the engine idling gas should barely trickle out the bowl side screws

Re: Help me decide Holley 650 or 750 [Re: twister360] #178301
12/29/08 08:46 PM
12/29/08 08:46 PM
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 4,925
Tri-Cities, Washington
V
VITC_GTX Offline
master
VITC_GTX  Offline
master
V

Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 4,925
Tri-Cities, Washington
I have your twin...

I have a 360 Magnum in my '71 Demon. Stock bottom end with a 226/238 @ .050" with .520" lift. Eddy Air-gap intake, 727 with ~3500 converter and 3.91s. My best is 12.76 @ 104 mph. I am currently running an Eddy 650 right out of the box. I never even touched the idle screws. With that said, I am considering going to a 750.

Last edited by VITC_GTX; 12/29/08 08:46 PM.
Re: Help me decide Holley 650 or 750 [Re: twister360] #178302
12/29/08 08:49 PM
12/29/08 08:49 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,443
Indiana
Y
YO7_A66 Offline
master
YO7_A66  Offline
master
Y

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,443
Indiana
""I have checked the power valve and it is okay.""

What is your in-gear vacuum reading with your foot on the brake (like you are at a stop sign)?

What number is your power valve?


1970 YO7 A66 [Canadian Export] F8 Challenger
340 (Currently in shop for stroker assy.)
Re: Help me decide Holley 650 or 750 [Re: twister360] #178303
12/29/08 08:50 PM
12/29/08 08:50 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
Mr.Yuck Offline
Not enough dumb comments...yet
Mr.Yuck  Offline
Not enough dumb comments...yet

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
I ran a holley 750DP on a mild 340 (stock 340 cam) w/ zero problems. It had great throttle response and I got 17mpg hwy... I would think a 650 might be too small for your application. The 750 vacuum is ok but it will require tuning as does any holley. If it were my car I'd probably get a used 750 DP, rebuild it and start w/ 72/80's a 6.5PV and 28 squirters...
FWIW, My 72 swinger had an almost stock 340, headers, J-heads and a holley 750 DP. It ran 13.80's on street radials and 3.55 rear.

Re: Help me decide Holley 650 or 750 [Re: Mr.Yuck] #178304
12/29/08 09:43 PM
12/29/08 09:43 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,826
las vegas
70AARcuda Offline
master
70AARcuda  Offline
master

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,826
las vegas
the holley 3310 750 vacuum holley is an universal carb...it will need some tuning to make it work..and it will work great...

just need to check what number power valve u got...it needs to be something around a 6.5...and adjust the idle mixture...

the jetting will be close..


my 73 duster ran 3 tenth quicker will a 750 dp then the 750 vacuum...but driving every day i run the vacumm carb..


Tony

70 AARCuda Vitamin C
71 Dart Swinger 360 10.318 @ 128.22(10-04-14 Bakersfield)
71 Demon 360 10.666 @122.41 (01-29-17 @ Las Vegas)
71 Duster 408 (10.29 @ 127.86 3/16/19 Las Vegas)
Re: Help me decide Holley 650 or 750 [Re: 70AARcuda] #178305
12/29/08 10:15 PM
12/29/08 10:15 PM
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 406
Houma, Louisiana
T
twister360 Offline OP
mopar
twister360  Offline OP
mopar
T

Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 406
Houma, Louisiana
The power valve is 6.5. If the vac drops below 6.5 will this cause the PV to open? Where would I find step by step directions for setting this carb? Thanks


My car 74 Duster mild 360/904/3.91 13.44/101.54 Son's car 75 Dart Sport 318/904/4.10 looking for a 360 or 408 2004 Dodge Ram 1500 Laramie 5.7 2010 Dodge Challenger R/T Classic B-5 6 speed 2010 Jeep SRT8 for the little wife
Re: Help me decide Holley 650 or 750 [Re: twister360] #178306
12/29/08 10:17 PM
12/29/08 10:17 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
Mr.Yuck Offline
Not enough dumb comments...yet
Mr.Yuck  Offline
Not enough dumb comments...yet

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
Quote:

The power valve is 6.5. If the vac drops below 6.5 will this cause the PV to open? Where would I find step by step directions for setting this carb? Thanks



try holley's web site. I'm sure they have step by step instructions.

Re: Help me decide Holley 650 or 750 [Re: twister360] #178307
12/29/08 10:18 PM
12/29/08 10:18 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 5,048
Atlanta Indiana
D
Dave Watt Offline
master
Dave Watt  Offline
master
D

Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 5,048
Atlanta Indiana
It sounds like the same problem I used to have with my Holley. If it has front and rear mixture screws, adjust them in all the way, then adjust out one full turn. Start the car and see how it idles and if there is still a rich gas smell. Make small adjustments to each one until the idle speed increases which means you are leaning out the mixture.

Re: Help me decide Holley 650 or 750 [Re: Dave Watt] #178308
12/29/08 10:38 PM
12/29/08 10:38 PM
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 406
Houma, Louisiana
T
twister360 Offline OP
mopar
twister360  Offline OP
mopar
T

Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 406
Houma, Louisiana
Thanks for all the help. What is the purpose of the PV and how does it operate? If manifold pressure drops to a certain point, will the PV open? The last time I checked my manifold pressure it was above 10 inches at idle. Don't know what it would be at WOT or part throttle.


My car 74 Duster mild 360/904/3.91 13.44/101.54 Son's car 75 Dart Sport 318/904/4.10 looking for a 360 or 408 2004 Dodge Ram 1500 Laramie 5.7 2010 Dodge Challenger R/T Classic B-5 6 speed 2010 Jeep SRT8 for the little wife
Re: Help me decide Holley 650 or 750 [Re: twister360] #178309
12/29/08 10:43 PM
12/29/08 10:43 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
Mr.Yuck Offline
Not enough dumb comments...yet
Mr.Yuck  Offline
Not enough dumb comments...yet

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
Quote:

Thanks for all the help. What is the purpose of the PV and how does it operate? If manifold pressure drops to a certain point, will the PV open? The last time I checked my manifold pressure it was above 10 inches at idle. Don't know what it would be at WOT or part throttle.




AT WOT it should be ZERO... usually you set your PV from idle vacuum.

Re: Help me decide Holley 650 or 750 [Re: Mr.Yuck] #178310
12/29/08 10:52 PM
12/29/08 10:52 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,826
las vegas
70AARcuda Offline
master
70AARcuda  Offline
master

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,826
las vegas
behind the power valve is two small passages that provide additional fuel as a power enrichment circuit...

if u floor the gas....vacuum drops to zero...power valve opens and provides additional gas...

most holleys with two metering block in them ...the primaries will be about 8 to 10 jets leaner then the secondaies.

the pvrc provides that additional fuel....so u can cruise on a leaner mixture...then get more gas went u floor it...


Tony

70 AARCuda Vitamin C
71 Dart Swinger 360 10.318 @ 128.22(10-04-14 Bakersfield)
71 Demon 360 10.666 @122.41 (01-29-17 @ Las Vegas)
71 Duster 408 (10.29 @ 127.86 3/16/19 Las Vegas)
Re: Help me decide Holley 650 or 750 [Re: 70AARcuda] #178311
12/29/08 10:53 PM
12/29/08 10:53 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,826
las vegas
70AARcuda Offline
master
70AARcuda  Offline
master

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,826
las vegas
http://www.mortec.com/carbtip1.htm

scroll down the page...has info on power valves.


Tony

70 AARCuda Vitamin C
71 Dart Swinger 360 10.318 @ 128.22(10-04-14 Bakersfield)
71 Demon 360 10.666 @122.41 (01-29-17 @ Las Vegas)
71 Duster 408 (10.29 @ 127.86 3/16/19 Las Vegas)
Re: Help me decide Holley 650 or 750 [Re: 70AARcuda] #178312
12/29/08 10:56 PM
12/29/08 10:56 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,826
las vegas
70AARcuda Offline
master
70AARcuda  Offline
master

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,826
las vegas

Last edited by 70AARcuda; 12/29/08 11:05 PM.

Tony

70 AARCuda Vitamin C
71 Dart Swinger 360 10.318 @ 128.22(10-04-14 Bakersfield)
71 Demon 360 10.666 @122.41 (01-29-17 @ Las Vegas)
71 Duster 408 (10.29 @ 127.86 3/16/19 Las Vegas)
Re: Help me decide Holley 650 or 750 [Re: twister360] #178313
12/30/08 07:30 AM
12/30/08 07:30 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,443
Indiana
Y
YO7_A66 Offline
master
YO7_A66  Offline
master
Y

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,443
Indiana
""The last time I checked my manifold pressure it was above 10 inches at idle.""

Was this in neutral or in gear idle?

If you have an automatic, you can tune the carb to get it close in N, but then you need to finish tuning it with the car in gear and a vacuum gage hooked up.


1970 YO7 A66 [Canadian Export] F8 Challenger
340 (Currently in shop for stroker assy.)
Re: Help me decide Holley 650 or 750 [Re: twister360] #178314
12/30/08 08:37 AM
12/30/08 08:37 AM
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 1,396
Mass
dgc333 Offline
pro stock
dgc333  Offline
pro stock

Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 1,396
Mass
The 750 will work fine but if the car is mostly a street car the 650 would be a better choice. I have a 360 with pretty much the same build (a little less cam) and have had 600, 670, 725 and 750 carbs on it. In order of preference its the 670, 600, 750 and 725.

Getting back to your rich mixture at idle. What is your initial timing? You should have between 15 and 20 degrees BTDC with the cam you are using. The magnum heads like less (32-34) total timing than open chamber heads.

With the overlap in the cam you are using the cylinders are not filling very efficiency at idle and you need to start the fire earlier to ensure all the mixture is burnt. Advance the initial timing in small increments until you get max manifold vacuum. You will then need to limit the timing in the distributor to keep the 32-34 number. If you have a MP distributor or an aftermarket one then you it will be easy.

Remember the first step in dialing in a carb is to get the timing right.


Dave Clement Pembroke, MA 03 PT Cruiser GT Turbo 99 Dakota SLT+ CC 4x4 68 Barracuda sport coupe http://home.comcast.net/~dgc333/
Re: Help me decide Holley 650 or 750 [Re: dgc333] #178315
12/30/08 12:29 PM
12/30/08 12:29 PM
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 406
Houma, Louisiana
T
twister360 Offline OP
mopar
twister360  Offline OP
mopar
T

Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 406
Houma, Louisiana
I think I'll stay with the 750 and try and fine tune it next week when I have some free time. Thanks for all the help.


My car 74 Duster mild 360/904/3.91 13.44/101.54 Son's car 75 Dart Sport 318/904/4.10 looking for a 360 or 408 2004 Dodge Ram 1500 Laramie 5.7 2010 Dodge Challenger R/T Classic B-5 6 speed 2010 Jeep SRT8 for the little wife
Re: Help me decide Holley 650 or 750 [Re: YO7_A66] #178316
12/30/08 01:05 PM
12/30/08 01:05 PM
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 531
SE Michigan
F
farmington Offline
mopar addict
farmington  Offline
mopar addict
F

Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 531
SE Michigan
If you buy a double pumper, go for the 650 because:
1 They're cheaper
2 they have the same baseplate as a 750
3 if you need more carb at a later date, buy the
new ported main body.

Page 1 of 2 1 2






Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.1