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Re: XV level II front suspension. Who is using it?
[Re: BergmanAutoCraft]
#1770285
03/08/15 11:42 AM
03/08/15 11:42 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 18,632
jersey shore
flypaper
I hate Texas
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I hate Texas
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 18,632
jersey shore
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Quote:
I agree with Andy on this one. There is no suspension system available that offers any distinct handling advantage over a properly set up stock style suspension.
wow
to read this from you is a 
this is the same pete who personally attacked members here
when they said that about xv,
when it first came onto moparts...
pimping up that stuff with some claims that made no sense.
its funny how the tune changes now that
you are not a paid shill anymore! 
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Re: XV level II front suspension. Who is using it?
[Re: flypaper]
#1770286
03/08/15 11:56 AM
03/08/15 11:56 AM
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 15,126
85086
moparpollack
Lil Herman
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Lil Herman
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 15,126
85086
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Quote:
Quote:
I agree with Andy on this one. There is no suspension system available that offers any distinct handling advantage over a properly set up stock style suspension.
wow
to read this from you is a
this is the same pete who personally attacked members here
when they said that about xv,
when it first came onto moparts...
pimping up that stuff with some claims that made no sense.
its funny how the tune changes now that
you are not a paid shill anymore!
Fly, you've must of taken JohnRR's corispondence course on tact and diplomacy.
56 Plaza 63 D100 step side 67 Coronet, 68 Roadrunner, 69 Super Bees, 69 Coronet 500 convertible, 70 Roadrunner Post, 79 D150 360, and a severe case of Mopar a,d,d
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Re: XV level II front suspension. Who is using it?
[Re: Supercuda]
#1770290
03/09/15 01:23 AM
03/09/15 01:23 AM
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Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 68
USA MO
cdoublejj
member
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member
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 68
USA MO
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I wonder how this compares to the magnum force transformer.
EDIT: despite being in this section i still feel obliged to say that is in the context of cornering and street ability/ride.
Last edited by cdoublejj; 03/09/15 02:42 AM.
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Re: XV level II front suspension. Who is using it?
[Re: moparpollack]
#1770291
03/09/15 09:43 PM
03/09/15 09:43 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 18,632
jersey shore
flypaper
I hate Texas
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I hate Texas
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 18,632
jersey shore
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I agree with Andy on this one. There is no suspension system available that offers any distinct handling advantage over a properly set up stock style suspension.
wow
to read this from you is a
this is the same pete who personally attacked members here
when they said that about xv,
when it first came onto moparts...
pimping up that stuff with some claims that made no sense.
its funny how the tune changes now that
you are not a paid shill anymore!
Fly, you've must of taken JohnRR's corispondence course on tact and diplomacy.
graduated in 98,made the honor roll and the deans list.. 
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Re: XV level II front suspension. Who is using it?
[Re: flypaper]
#1770292
03/09/15 09:51 PM
03/09/15 09:51 PM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889
up yours
Supercuda
About to go away
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About to go away
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889
up yours
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Is there any good before and after tests on these aftermarket suspensions?
By good I mean a couple of things. Third party, same rims and tires and if possible same brakes?
Not interested in manufacturer's claims, seen too many shenanigan's over the years. Like running 305 heads on a 350 and claiming 40+hp gain over "stock" heads.
Almost not interested in magazine claims, seen too many shill for the sponsor shenanigans too, unless it was a three way head to head, like stock vs XV vs RMS vs Hotchkis type article, if it exists.
I have seen articles were an aftermarket suspension was put on a Mopar and showed improvement, but they serious upgraded the tires and rims too, so who knows what did what and that, in my book, is not a real test of the suspension swap.
They say there are no such thing as a stupid question.
They say there is always the exception that proves the rule.
Don't be the exception.
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Re: XV level II front suspension. Who is using it?
[Re: Supercuda]
#1770293
03/10/15 03:23 AM
03/10/15 03:23 AM
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Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 68
USA MO
cdoublejj
member
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member
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 68
USA MO
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Quote:
Is there any good before and after tests on these aftermarket suspensions?
By good I mean a couple of things. Third party, same rims and tires and if possible same brakes?
Not interested in manufacturer's claims, seen too many shenanigan's over the years. Like running 305 heads on a 350 and claiming 40+hp gain over "stock" heads.
Almost not interested in magazine claims, seen too many shill for the sponsor shenanigans too, unless it was a three way head to head, like stock vs XV vs RMS vs Hotchkis type article, if it exists.
I have seen articles were an aftermarket suspension was put on a Mopar and showed improvement, but they serious upgraded the tires and rims too, so who knows what did what and that, in my book, is not a real test of the suspension swap.
well.... one of us would probably have to do it. I'm automatically out since the car has not been together running since before i was born.
I do the next best and thing and look at the setup and or technology,suspension style and see what other kinds of cars use it. same with the chassis.
like if it is an Independent front suspension we already know it allows for better articulation since the movement of one wheel doesn't disturb the other thusly improving the contact patch with the tire.
The best i have ever seen is with tires but, not suspension.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kASM04zuHlo
....well i guess there is this,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ufEpb_WIR0
not much. just basic Hotchkis bolt ons for a stock suspension.
at the very LEAST, i like videos like THIS:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g7pfNBrrP88
^these^ videos at least show SOME sort of evidence of change or improvement.
THIS write up i think shows a before and after shot of suspension at work when cornering.
http://www.hotrod.com/how-to/chassis-suspension/hrdp-0712-irs-for-musclecars/
it's mustang and an IRS though, this is kind of stuff i look at since we don't have access to before and after videos which ultimately would king over all. Give me an idea on what kind of positive effect independent suspension, FRONT and rear can have on traction.
Last edited by cdoublejj; 03/10/15 04:16 AM.
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Re: XV level II front suspension. Who is using it?
[Re: Supercuda]
#1770294
03/10/15 11:13 AM
03/10/15 11:13 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,406
Pikes Peak Country
TC@HP2
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,406
Pikes Peak Country
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Quote:
Is there any good before and after tests on these aftermarket suspensions?
By good I mean a couple of things. Third party, same rims and tires and if possible same brakes?
Not interested in manufacturer's claims, seen too many shenanigan's over the years. Like running 305 heads on a 350 and claiming 40+hp gain over "stock" heads.
Almost not interested in magazine claims, seen too many shill for the sponsor shenanigans too, unless it was a three way head to head, like stock vs XV vs RMS vs Hotchkis type article, if it exists.
I have seen articles were an aftermarket suspension was put on a Mopar and showed improvement, but they serious upgraded the tires and rims too, so who knows what did what and that, in my book, is not a real test of the suspension swap.
Not that I've ever seen. FWIW, I've never seen anything similar done on any of the Brand C or Brand F suspension providers either, and they are much more prolific than the Mopar providers. Additionally, like you mention, the magazine articles on upgrades also tend to be worn original suspension with wheel/tire upgrades as part of the package, so it difficult to discern the exact amount of improvement the system provides. No one has taken an optimized stock layout against the aftermarket units either.
I still firmly believe that the biggest gain most aftermarket users see is in the balanced spring set ups and matched shock rates they receive from the provider that they do not feel they can achieve themselves from the stock style components. Yes, there is some refined geometry improvements, lighter weight, and easy spring and ride height changes to go along with it, but those are refinements, not the core of the package.
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Re: XV level II front suspension. Who is using it?
[Re: cdoublejj]
#1770295
03/10/15 11:16 AM
03/10/15 11:16 AM
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,443
NW Chicago suburban area
Mopar Mitch
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,443
NW Chicago suburban area
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The bigeest improvement and difference will always begin with the "nut-behind-the-wheel" (the driver). Next, is the tires, and work your way inwards... but it eventually becomes an overall package of changes that'll make the final differences. Physics is the final law.. so.. choose your base platform wisely to begin with and plan carefully looking into your future wants/needs, etc. In other words, just don't spend a ton of $$$ and expect the best... consider improving your driving skills (track time = time and $$, driver's schools, etc) as part of the overall plan. Excluding the variable club rules, I believe all of the XV setups were well designed for handling setups, especially their frame strengtheners (as their videos display). Personally, I don't have experience with the XV items... I prefer simple bolt-on type of mods. XV has kept some of their specs (TBs and leafspring rates) closed from anyone knowing what they are. 
Mopar Mitch
"Road racers and autocrossers go in deeper and come out harder!"... and rain never stops us from having fun with our cars... in fact, it makes us better drivers!
Check out MOPAR ACTION MAGAZINE, August 2006 issue for feature article and specs on my autocross T/A!
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Re: XV level II front suspension. Who is using it?
[Re: Mopar Mitch]
#1770296
03/10/15 12:07 PM
03/10/15 12:07 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 3,577
Long Island, NY USA
BergmanAutoCraft
master
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master
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 3,577
Long Island, NY USA
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The biggest plus with coil over suspensions is usually the ride. In the case of the XV stuff, as I'm the only one here with any real experience having worked on every car they ever sold, is they do ride really good but they have many drawbacks. At track speed they can perform well, but the tuning/springs rates as they were sold are far from optimized.
I know the bashing will start, but remember, just because I made a living at that place for almost 7 years, it doesn't mean I agreed with everything they did. I still had a boss to deal with.
IF (big IF) the product was further developed it could have been a truly world class solution for mopars. However, at this point, I feel there isn't enough of a market for this product which is why I never chose to pursue producing this type of product on my own.
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Re: XV level II front suspension. Who is using it?
[Re: BergmanAutoCraft]
#1770297
03/10/15 02:05 PM
03/10/15 02:05 PM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889
up yours
Supercuda
About to go away
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About to go away
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889
up yours
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One of the major mags, I want to say Car Craft, did a swap on a stock A body and showed numbers. Here it is. http://www.hotrod.com/how-to/chassis-sus...ymouth-valiant/Drag race oriented suspension to Hotchkis, note tire changes too. Not really a good comparison, like the 305 heads on a 350 one I mentioned. I wish they could have taken a regular MoPar suspension all scienced out then did the swap keeping tires and rims the same. More valid to me.
They say there are no such thing as a stupid question.
They say there is always the exception that proves the rule.
Don't be the exception.
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Re: XV level II front suspension. Who is using it?
[Re: Supercuda]
#1770298
03/10/15 04:19 PM
03/10/15 04:19 PM
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 3,712
Sacramento, Ca
Darius
master
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master
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 3,712
Sacramento, Ca
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You guys can argue this to death but I will say this, again, I am NOT a racer of any kind, there is absolutely NO WAY you could tune a stock suspension and get the level of handling I got on my 69 Dart when I installed a Hotchkiss TVS ! M
Driving modern convenience in classic beauty
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