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Re: 727 CO2 SHIFTER [Re: 440lebaron] #2535673
08/13/18 03:38 PM
08/13/18 03:38 PM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,563
S.E. Michigan
cl440 Offline
master
cl440  Offline
master

Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,563
S.E. Michigan
Well it happened again Sunday. Everything was working good up until 3rd round of eliminations. Trans went from first to third again! HAd him covered by .040 at the start but couldn't catch him at the finish line! Car loses a tenth when I don't have second gear!

We have had the valve body out and checked the detent ball and spring. Everything looks good there. Installed a brand new shifter and cable, Air shifter plunger, striker block and dowel. We have tried air pressure from as low as 70PSI upto 140PSI and everywhere in between.

It's totally random when it does it. It may work 3 to 5 times in a row and then start acting up. Then it may start working again later in the day?

I am shutting off the air and going to finish the season shifting manually (I think I remember how)

Re: 727 CO2 SHIFTER [Re: cl440] #2535720
08/13/18 05:00 PM
08/13/18 05:00 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,185
PA.
pittsburghracer Offline
"Little"John
pittsburghracer  Offline
"Little"John

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,185
PA.
I didn't read all the posts on this but many many years ago when I had a 727 three speed shifter I had to totally have my hand off the shifter and bang the shifter for each shift. If I had the slightest pressure on it the detent wouldn't work and it would go from 1st to 3rd resulting in a loss of .10


1970 Duster
Edelbrock headed 408
5.984@112.52
422 Indy headed small block
5.982@112.56 mph
9.42@138.27

Livin and lovin life one day at a time




Re: 727 CO2 SHIFTER [Re: cl440] #2535802
08/13/18 07:39 PM
08/13/18 07:39 PM
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,363
Cotati, CA
Dave Hall Offline
top fuel
Dave Hall  Offline
top fuel

Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,363
Cotati, CA
Damn that sucks! I had some of the same problems and kept an eye on the shifter to make sure the routine was right. I actually had the thing whiff and not shift at all before. I was bagging a tenth instead of losing it and broke out. I highly recommend a Powerglide or a PPP shifter. Here is me eyeballing my shifter at Fallon in 2014. Bob Johnson photo.

1a0374082_752415078144149_6647042333109028510_n.jpg
Re: 727 CO2 SHIFTER [Re: 440lebaron] #2535969
08/14/18 01:08 AM
08/14/18 01:08 AM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 11,611
Fulton County, PA
C
CMcAllister Offline
Mr. Helpful
CMcAllister  Offline
Mr. Helpful
C

Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 11,611
Fulton County, PA
Years ago when I ran a 3 speed, ATI made a CO2 shifter kit with cylinder mount for reverse VB Hurst Quarter Sticks. Mounted on the side and bumped the shifter into second. Then we used a shift light for third, at least for awhile until they outlawed it. Then you just use the tach or your ears. We could run 2 different shift points or shift 1-2 on time. Dead reliable and worked great. I really liked it. Still have it. Won't get rid of it since they haven't made them in years. I've thought about reproducing the thing.


If the results don't match the theory, change the theory.
Re: 727 CO2 SHIFTER [Re: 440lebaron] #2536001
08/14/18 02:58 AM
08/14/18 02:58 AM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 13,200
aZLiViN
J
J_BODY Offline
I Live Here
J_BODY  Offline
I Live Here
J

Joined: May 2003
Posts: 13,200
aZLiViN
Luckily for you there still seems to be a following for these shifters.... sell it and move on.

I really really really like my PPP....

Re: 727 CO2 SHIFTER [Re: cl440] #2536007
08/14/18 03:27 AM
08/14/18 03:27 AM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 349
Indiana
Gabby63 Offline
enthusiast
Gabby63  Offline
enthusiast

Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 349
Indiana
I have fought the same issue for many years , did not want to give up on the shifter . In my case it was shift cable adjustment . When ever I would change tranmissions to my back up trans it would go right to 3rd , difference in trans . I would remember to re-adjust the cable & all was good . I also never have under 120 psi on CO2 either . Hang in there , you will get it eventually . Gary

Re: 727 CO2 SHIFTER [Re: 440lebaron] #2536008
08/14/18 03:40 AM
08/14/18 03:40 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 20,185
Park Forest, IL
slantzilla Offline
Too Many Posts
slantzilla  Offline
Too Many Posts

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 20,185
Park Forest, IL
My Valiant has an SCS and air shifter in it. I've already taken out the air shift part, the rest will be replaced this winter.


"Everybody funny, now you funny too."
Re: 727 CO2 SHIFTER [Re: 440lebaron] #2536046
08/14/18 09:49 AM
08/14/18 09:49 AM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,563
S.E. Michigan
cl440 Offline
master
cl440  Offline
master

Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,563
S.E. Michigan
Damn thing is this. When we started the season this is the exact same setup we had in the Duster at the beginning of 2017 (Before I wrecked it) The new car has the same engine and trans and all shifting components transplanted from the Duster. It started giving us trouble from the first pass of 2018. We started adjusting and replacing components thinking that "This has got to fix it"! Every weekend it does it again! Frustrating to say the least.

Like I said manual shifting for the rest of the season and make some tough decisions over the winter. Possibly a 2 speed powerglide will be installed over the off season.

Sad thing is I have the best of the best parts in this 727 and more of those same parts in the back up trans. Straight cut gears, Billet drums, Spragless converters, Roller rear support, Billet servos and accumulators etc..... Literally thousands of dollars in top quality 727 parts!

Re: 727 CO2 SHIFTER [Re: Dave Hall] #2536049
08/14/18 09:52 AM
08/14/18 09:52 AM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,563
S.E. Michigan
cl440 Offline
master
cl440  Offline
master

Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,563
S.E. Michigan
Originally Posted By Dave Hall
Damn that sucks! I had some of the same problems and kept an eye on the shifter to make sure the routine was right. I actually had the thing whiff and not shift at all before. I was bagging a tenth instead of losing it and broke out. I highly recommend a Powerglide or a PPP shifter. Here is me eyeballing my shifter at Fallon in 2014. Bob Johnson photo.


Yep! That is me every round! Just waiting (Because I know its coming) for it to mess up! So frustrating when you know your good enough to go rounds but you cant trust the car!

Re: 727 CO2 SHIFTER [Re: 440lebaron] #2536075
08/14/18 11:07 AM
08/14/18 11:07 AM
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 667
IL
D
Dart451 Offline
mopar
Dart451  Offline
mopar
D

Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 667
IL
Have electric shiftnoid in car and it works great

http://www.shifnoid.com/products.html#electric_shifters

Controlled by
https://www.racedigitaldelay.com/rpm-1067-rpm.php

They had great service when I had a small problem

Re: 727 CO2 SHIFTER [Re: cl440] #2536335
08/14/18 06:44 PM
08/14/18 06:44 PM
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,363
Cotati, CA
Dave Hall Offline
top fuel
Dave Hall  Offline
top fuel

Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,363
Cotati, CA
I never knew consistency until I went to a Powerglide. The car is a tenth quicker with it as well! I have the same 727 with K's in great parts and it now resides in my street car. Super reliable but the thing would zerox 60' times then out of left field it would throw a 2-5 hundredths curve ball. The 3 spd. was inconsistent for Super Street as well and I was basically bagging a tenth and wheel racing for some wins. I never even calculated a throttle stop ratio until I changed to the Glide. So frustrating! Ironically I still use the SCS shifter for the glide. I had to replace the gate, drill and tap for a slap block and flip the solenoid bracket so that it bangs forward. ONCE! It works great. All C02 shifters require inspection and lubrication. It's just the nature of the beast when you are banging things with 120psi. If you are going to shift the SCS manually for the rest of the season don't GRAB the shifter when selecting 2nd. Slap it! Good luck with it!

Re: 727 CO2 SHIFTER [Re: Dave Hall] #2536624
08/15/18 10:00 AM
08/15/18 10:00 AM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,563
S.E. Michigan
cl440 Offline
master
cl440  Offline
master

Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,563
S.E. Michigan
Originally Posted By Dave Hall
I never knew consistency until I went to a Powerglide. The car is a tenth quicker with it as well! I have the same 727 with K's in great parts and it now resides in my street car. Super reliable but the thing would zerox 60' times then out of left field it would throw a 2-5 hundredths curve ball. The 3 spd. was inconsistent for Super Street as well and I was basically bagging a tenth and wheel racing for some wins. I never even calculated a throttle stop ratio until I changed to the Glide. So frustrating! Ironically I still use the SCS shifter for the glide. I had to replace the gate, drill and tap for a slap block and flip the solenoid bracket so that it bangs forward. ONCE! It works great. All C02 shifters require inspection and lubrication. It's just the nature of the beast when you are banging things with 120psi. If you are going to shift the SCS manually for the rest of the season don't GRAB the shifter when selecting 2nd. Slap it! Good luck with it!


Good read. Thanks for taking the time. A PG may be what we do but it wont be until the winter when we have time to make the switch. Installing the shift light tonight after work. I will be slapping gears for the remainder of the season! Thanks

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