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Re: Installing an Engine and Trans from Underneath [Re: Big Bad Bee] #1708071
12/09/14 01:41 AM
12/09/14 01:41 AM
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 11,836
Florida
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mopar346 Offline
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Florida
Quote:

I just need to know what to do with the steering linkage and what the tricks are to getting it done without trouble. For example, I've seen guys do it with the rear axle on jack stands. Others do it on tires. is my 10' ceiling high enough?




I choose to leave my tie rods and control off but many assemble everything and have the rotors/drums support on roll carts of sorts and the upper just hanging or turned out until it is time to install them. Both ways work fine. I have my gear box, idler and draglink in place and hang they rest later. If you are asking about the steering column it goes in after everything is bolted up. I prefer mine on tires, it makes the pivot easier as the body moves up and down. 10 ft ceiling should be plenty as long as you are running a low profile dolly, mine don't generally exceed 7 or 8 ft at most. It really isn't difficult, best to have a friend with you and I will use long screw drivers to align the holes although I have though of using 2 or 3 inch bolts with the heads cut off. Take the car to a 45* angle or so and roll it under, lower a bit and recenter, lower it some more, recenter, lower it into place recentering and aligning the holes, install and tighten the bolts, lift off dolly and place on jack stands, swing upper control arms in place if they are attached and install tortion bars and whatever else I for got.


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Re: Installing an Engine and Trans from Underneath [Re: mopar346] #1708072
12/09/14 01:49 AM
12/09/14 01:49 AM
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 11,836
Florida
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mopar346 Offline
Let me tell ya about fat chicks!
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Florida
Not the best picture but you get the idea.

8356139-Resized2.JPG (201 downloads)

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Re: Installing an Engine and Trans from Underneath [Re: mopar346] #1708073
12/09/14 01:50 AM
12/09/14 01:50 AM
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Posts: 11,836
Florida
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mopar346 Offline
Let me tell ya about fat chicks!
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Posts: 11,836
Florida
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8356142-IMG_2136.JPG (423 downloads)

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Re: Installing an Engine and Trans from Underneath [Re: mopar346] #1708074
12/09/14 04:38 AM
12/09/14 04:38 AM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 10,938
Spokane Valley, WA
Big Bad Bee Offline OP
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Spokane Valley, WA
Kevin, really great info. Question. Does the steering column have to come out? I was just going to drive out the roll pin and slide back the coupling to drop the K member.

I really think unloading the torsion bars, disconnecting the steering column, pulling upper ball joints, removing the brake lines and dropping the K is way easier than pulling everything back off my engine at this point. I'm actually really looking forward to it.


I’m listening.
Re: Installing an Engine and Trans from Underneath [Re: Big Bad Bee] #1708075
12/09/14 10:13 AM
12/09/14 10:13 AM
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Posts: 11,836
Florida
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mopar346 Offline
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Florida
Thank you, I think there is enough clearance on most models to leave the column in place but I cant say that I know cause most any time I am working on the coupler, colmn or gear I just pull it out, it's pretty easy and them you have less to interfer with things. Even if it didn't completely clear you could manipulate it off while bring the K down, but again the 10 minutes to pull the column avoids a lot of agrevation in most cases so I just pop it out, but that's just me.


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Re: Installing an Engine and Trans from Underneath [Re: 469runner] #1708076
12/09/14 11:16 AM
12/09/14 11:16 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,420
Abilene, Texas
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fastmark Offline
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Abilene, Texas
If your hood is on perfectly, I would not remove it. However, I've done several through the shock towers and it does not hurt the car. Remember this. The car is made to withstand a lot of force from the shocks and upper control arms at that location so it is a pretty strong part of the car. Besides with the engine out, the front end of the car is very light. I would not attempt to lift it from the shock towers with a motor in place. With hood in place you will need to build a tool to lift it from the bumper mounts. I would take the steering column out. It is too easy to put in after the motor is in.

Re: Installing an Engine and Trans from Underneath [Re: fastmark] #1708077
12/09/14 01:53 PM
12/09/14 01:53 PM
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 11,836
Florida
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mopar346 Offline
Let me tell ya about fat chicks!
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Posts: 11,836
Florida
Quote:

Remember this. The car is made to withstand a lot of force from the shocks and upper control arms at that location so it is a pretty strong part of the car.




Good point.


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Re: Installing an Engine and Trans from Underneath [Re: fastmark] #1708078
12/09/14 01:58 PM
12/09/14 01:58 PM
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 15,134
Kelowna, B.C. Canada
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DPelletier Offline
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Kelowna, B.C. Canada
If I were you, I'd get a buddy or two and carefully remove the front bumber assy (I had to do that a couple times...don't ask) and then the rest is easy.



1970 Super Bee 440 Six Pack 1974 'Cuda 2008 Ram 3500 Diesel 2006 Ram 3500 Diesel 2004.5 Ram 2500 Diesel 2003 Ram 3500 Diesel 2006 Durango Limited [url] http://1970superbee.piczo.com [/url]
Re: Installing an Engine and Trans from Underneath [Re: DPelletier] #1708079
12/09/14 02:01 PM
12/09/14 02:01 PM
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 15,134
Kelowna, B.C. Canada
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1970 Super Bee 440 Six Pack 1974 'Cuda 2008 Ram 3500 Diesel 2006 Ram 3500 Diesel 2004.5 Ram 2500 Diesel 2003 Ram 3500 Diesel 2006 Durango Limited [url] http://1970superbee.piczo.com [/url]
Re: Installing an Engine and Trans from Underneath [Re: DPelletier] #1708080
12/09/14 02:03 PM
12/09/14 02:03 PM
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 15,134
Kelowna, B.C. Canada
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1970 Super Bee 440 Six Pack 1974 'Cuda 2008 Ram 3500 Diesel 2006 Ram 3500 Diesel 2004.5 Ram 2500 Diesel 2003 Ram 3500 Diesel 2006 Durango Limited [url] http://1970superbee.piczo.com [/url]
Re: Installing an Engine and Trans from Underneath [Re: DPelletier] #1708081
12/09/14 02:05 PM
12/09/14 02:05 PM
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 15,134
Kelowna, B.C. Canada
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1970 Super Bee 440 Six Pack 1974 'Cuda 2008 Ram 3500 Diesel 2006 Ram 3500 Diesel 2004.5 Ram 2500 Diesel 2003 Ram 3500 Diesel 2006 Durango Limited [url] http://1970superbee.piczo.com [/url]
Re: Installing an Engine and Trans from Underneath [Re: Big Bad Bee] #1708082
12/09/14 02:53 PM
12/09/14 02:53 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,070
U.S.S.A.
JohnRR Offline
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Quote:

Kevin, really great info. Question. Does the steering column have to come out? I was just going to drive out the roll pin and slide back the coupling to drop the K member.

I really think unloading the torsion bars, disconnecting the steering column, pulling upper ball joints, removing the brake lines and dropping the K is way easier than pulling everything back off my engine at this point. I'm actually really looking forward to it.




I would pull the steering column back , it's just going to add a degree of difficulty to the task , same with the suspension, just because the factory installed it as one piece doesn't mean it's required .... unless you are in a race or paying yourself by the hour to do the job , and again adding another degree of difficulty unless there is going to be 10 people involved in the install ...

Or your some narcissistic blowhard that conned your way into a TV show gig

Re: Installing an Engine and Trans from Underneath [Re: JohnRR] #1708083
12/09/14 03:03 PM
12/09/14 03:03 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 28,312
Cincinnati, Ohio
Challenger 1 Offline
Too Many Posts
Challenger 1  Offline
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Posts: 28,312
Cincinnati, Ohio
Quote:

Quote:

Kevin, really great info. Question. Does the steering column have to come out? I was just going to drive out the roll pin and slide back the coupling to drop the K member.

I really think unloading the torsion bars, disconnecting the steering column, pulling upper ball joints, removing the brake lines and dropping the K is way easier than pulling everything back off my engine at this point. I'm actually really looking forward to it.




I would pull the steering column back , it's just going to add a degree of difficulty to the task , same with the suspension, just because the factory installed it as one piece doesn't mean it's required .... unless you are in a race or paying yourself by the hour to do the job , and again adding another degree of difficulty unless there is going to be 10 people involved in the install ...

Or your some narcissistic blowhard that conned your way into a TV show gig




Yup no reason to have all the heavy junk hanging from the lower control arms. I installed my lower control arms after the K was bolted up and then the spindle, rotor ETC. My garage has 8' high ceilings and it was no problem. I did the motor and trans install from the bottom by myself.

I used a spare set of bumper brackets to lift the car, I figured they would bend but they didn't and the second time I did it the car was almost complete with all glass and interior and much heavier than the trial run. I also used my engine lifter spreader bar, it was built to lift a brad anderson hemi with a PSI blower and injector on top(really heavy). It worked perfect for this job.

Should always use a spreader bar so the chains is in up and down tension and not in a V shape. In V shape put's pressure where it don't need to be(I'm not talking about lifting a engine which is fine when with the chain setup pictured above that locks in the links so it can't slide to the side is used) and v shaped chains try's to squeeze your frame rails together, imo.

The lifting hook on the crane should be secured to the chain so the chain can't slide to the side. Never just slide the chain through the hook and lift. I own 2 crane trucks and have 20 years experience with them. This picture is a trial run, I took it back out this day.


Here it is sitting on plain wood dolly right before the final install, no lower control arms needed and they are easy to bolt up afterwards.

Lastly I would have the rear end installed and the tires bolted on, just in case. The first time I left the rear tires on the ground, the second time I put the rear end on jack stands under the rear axle and which lifted the tires off the ground about 4" with the tires bolted on for just in case.
First and trial run, I used a homemade creeper to set the motor and trans on! The creeper was a little too low to do it comfortably. So I used this flat wood furniture dolly which is about 2" higher than a creeper. Today I have 2 short blocks being stored on top of it.



Once the K is bolted tight, then your done with the crane, don't try to lift the whole thing with a crane. Got to use a floor jack under the K from that point on.

I forgot to mention, only the engine oil pan and the trans was supported by my wood dolly.
The K hung out in front by the rubber engine mounts and wiggled easily to start my K bolts. Then nothing was under my K so I could put my floor jack there, since I don't have a lift to lift the whole car when I was done.

Note also where my lifting hook is verses where my front wheels are. My crane is very stable because the load is spread between the front and back wheels better and the boom is low because of the rigging.

Look at the other cranes and the lifting hook is way out there by the front wheels and the boom is high in some cases. Makes them very unstable and be careful. Low is where you want your boom as much as possible and pull your boom in one notch if possible for lifting such a big and heavy load.

Re: Installing an Engine and Trans from Underneath [Re: Challenger 1] #1708084
12/09/14 05:47 PM
12/09/14 05:47 PM
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 15,134
Kelowna, B.C. Canada
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DPelletier Offline
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The site went down before I could finish but I agree with John on the column and wanted to warn you about the spreader bar thing too.


Dave


1970 Super Bee 440 Six Pack 1974 'Cuda 2008 Ram 3500 Diesel 2006 Ram 3500 Diesel 2004.5 Ram 2500 Diesel 2003 Ram 3500 Diesel 2006 Durango Limited [url] http://1970superbee.piczo.com [/url]
Re: Installing an Engine and Trans from Underneath [Re: Big Bad Bee] #1708085
12/09/14 06:22 PM
12/09/14 06:22 PM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 110
So. Illinois
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bronze69 Offline
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Posts: 110
So. Illinois
Quote:



I really think unloading the torsion bars, disconnecting the steering column, pulling upper ball joints, removing the brake lines and dropping the K is way easier than pulling everything back off my engine at this point. I'm actually really looking forward to it.




I actually just remove the bolts holding the spindle to the lower ball joint, which leaves the upper control arm, ball joint and spindle on the car. This leaves your front end alignment somewhat in place. (I still have it realigned)


68 Gold Met. 383-4spd Roadrunner 69 T5 Hemi 4-spd Roadrunner 70 Limelight 440-6 Auto Superbird
Re: Installing an Engine and Trans from Underneath [Re: Big Bad Bee] #1708086
12/10/14 11:27 AM
12/10/14 11:27 AM
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 5,110
Western Md.
skicker Offline
"The Champ"
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 5,110
Western Md.
I've put 3 in from the bottom. The first in a 70 B body, the 2nd in a 69 A body and the 3rd in a 72 E body. I use the same engine dolly for all 3 engine installs. Pics are from the A Body. I made a piece of 2x2 box tube that lays on the bottom of the frame rails ahead of where the K frame bolts in. The chain does up to the engine crane behind the radiator support. No need to ever remove the hood. Do yourself a favor and make everything as complete as possible. Install the headers, starter with wires and all of the small items that you don't want to lean over the fenders to complete.
My dolly is made that I can install the transmission mount and cross member on the transmission. As the car comes down that is the first thing I hook up with the 4 bolts through the transmission cross member. Then align the K frame and install those four bolts. From there it's just bolting everything else back up.

8357340-0420130945.jpg (147 downloads)

...FAFO...
Re: Installing an Engine and Trans from Underneath [Re: skicker] #1708087
12/10/14 11:29 AM
12/10/14 11:29 AM
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 5,110
Western Md.
skicker Offline
"The Champ"
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"The Champ"

Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 5,110
Western Md.
side view...

8357342-0420130957.jpg (251 downloads)

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Re: Installing an Engine and Trans from Underneath [Re: skicker] #1708088
12/10/14 11:32 AM
12/10/14 11:32 AM
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 5,110
Western Md.
skicker Offline
"The Champ"
skicker  Offline
"The Champ"

Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 5,110
Western Md.
440 in a Challenger. Cheated on this using a lift.

8357343-0608130001.jpg (155 downloads)

...FAFO...
Re: Installing an Engine and Trans from Underneath [Re: bronze69] #1708089
12/10/14 11:36 AM
12/10/14 11:36 AM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 8,828
Houston, Tx
hemi68charger Offline
master
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 8,828
Houston, Tx
Man, you guys without a beak have it so easy !!!

Last edited by hemi68charger; 12/10/14 01:04 PM.

Troy
Houston Mopar Connection Club
'69 Charger Daytona 440 - auto - 4.10 Dana (now with 426 hemi)
'69 Charger 500 440 - 4speed - 3.54 Dana
'70 Road Runner 383 - 4speed - a/c (now with 440)
Re: Installing an Engine and Trans from Underneath [Re: skicker] #1708090
12/10/14 11:39 AM
12/10/14 11:39 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,567
Ky
J
jt4406 Offline
pro stock
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pro stock
J

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,567
Ky
'nother 440 in 'nother challenger...



jess

8357351-IMG_3900.JPG (157 downloads)

Yeah, it's hopped up to over 160...
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