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Re: Gen III Hemi- Carb or EFI? Which one is better?
[Re: AlexP]
#1697252
11/13/14 04:41 PM
11/13/14 04:41 PM
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
72Swinger
master
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master
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
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The SRV intake is a simple rpm switch deal, not overly sophisticated. I know there are a handful of people have converted 6.1 cars over to the SRV 6.4 intake.
Mopar to the bone!!!
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Re: Gen III Hemi- Carb or EFI? Which one is better?
[Re: AlexP]
#1697253
11/13/14 06:28 PM
11/13/14 06:28 PM
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 305
5th and plum
redmist
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 305
5th and plum
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Quote:
Mega squirt isn't confirmed yet. I've heard it can work with the 6.4 but I bet locking the cam out and putting a normal intake on is what you would have to do.
Dave webber at modern muscle can get the factory stuff to work but it's way more money.
Megasquirt 1.3.0 release supports the VVT function on Hemi's.
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Re: Gen III Hemi- Carb or EFI? Which one is better?
[Re: AlexP]
#1697255
11/13/14 09:59 PM
11/13/14 09:59 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,943
Melbourne.....Oz-land
Moparmal
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,943
Melbourne.....Oz-land
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Quote:
You're just running an srt max? 219/227
I've got the same specs on a 112. My PTV is fine. Look at how big the Arrington sr2b and st3a are. 220/230ish and they work in a stock shortblock
Alex - my 'beef' isnt with the p-v ...even though most are pretty tight on the intake side......it's HOW they achieve the clearance they get.
I xan handle running an SRTMAX with .068th....or an ST3-A with even less!..... But thats not the real issue.
The issue is that the quoted grind ICL is NOT where these things install at.
Inertia uses Crower to grind their cams - the Crower card says install
4 degrees advanced at 106 degrees!!!
BUT........Inertia says it goes in at 114 ICL which is what it did (we degreed it)
Thats 8 degrees retarded from Crowers recommendation.
That kind of install line aint gonna help low end tq in a carbed motor....Im sure you agree!!
At least Inertia is honest about the install ICL - I suspect some companies thar quote 111+2 ICL are not being straight about where the cam actually goes in.
Funny thing is.......everyone says these are great top end cams.....Well hello!!!!!..........of course they are - at 8 degrees frickin retarded!!!
And most of these cams all install retarded according to Chris from Modern Muscle.....its how they avoid p-v issues to begin with.
Mostly EFI guys wont care...the chip and the induction compensates a lot......but that late ICL really puts the hurt on carb induction.
Only way to beat it is relieved slugs and an adjustable timing set. 
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Re: Gen III Hemi- Carb or EFI? Which one is better?
[Re: Moparmal]
#1697256
11/14/14 07:36 PM
11/14/14 07:36 PM
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Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 5
Kentucky
uncledon
member
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member
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 5
Kentucky
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chiming in here a little...and with a question or twooo
I am putting a 5.7 hemi carb'd engine in my 67 coronet. Modman indy intake, tti headers...other than that mostly stock for now.
im researching cams, and well...everything I see is for fuel injection. shouldn't I need a different cam for a carbed set up? anyone recommend who to call or talk to on that? comp? crane? Arrington? etc...
anyone researched this?
67 Dodge Coronet 500 (Hemi 5.7 swap)
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Re: Gen III Hemi- Carb or EFI? Which one is better?
[Re: uncledon]
#1697257
11/14/14 08:49 PM
11/14/14 08:49 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,943
Melbourne.....Oz-land
Moparmal
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,943
Melbourne.....Oz-land
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Lets assume you are not going to run steep gears or a big converter....because they can cover up some serious sins.....
I would seriously re-think running the modman...at least with a single carb....unless you run a double pumper and gears.
Theres no question the large plenum creates bottom end torque issues.
Trouble is...these issues are made worse by cams that dont "favor" low end power production.
The factory 6.1 cam has a pretty small duration and would no doubt make better low end than the bigger off the shelf stuff.....but you'll lose top end....its a pretty mild cam
If your not chasing 1/4 mile times...Id look at one of the smaller Comp grinds....maybe get Modern Muscle or Comp to grind it on a 110 lsa...that way you'll have a sharp responding cam which hopefully wont be too bad down low.
Basically the less the duration, the less problems down low.
Be prepared to run a lot of initial timing also - as cylinder pressure wont be great with the modman.
I started at 10deg initial and ended up at 21 deg initial going to 25 at 3000 rpm with no detonation issues or kickback against the starter.
67 RO23 clone with 6.1 SRT Hemi and dual quads. Soon to have Drag Pak induction and Throttle body.
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Re: Gen III Hemi- Carb or EFI? Which one is better?
[Re: Moparmal]
#1697258
11/14/14 09:28 PM
11/14/14 09:28 PM
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 833
MN
hemidup
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 833
MN
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Post your cam card if you can. I'm sure we'd all like to see the valve timing events.
Jerry Williams.
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Re: Gen III Hemi- Carb or EFI? Which one is better?
[Re: Moparmal]
#1697259
11/15/14 01:43 AM
11/15/14 01:43 AM
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Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 5
Kentucky
uncledon
member
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member
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 5
Kentucky
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Quote:
Lets assume you are not going to run steep gears or a big converter....because they can cover up some serious sins.....
I would seriously re-think running the modman...at least with a single carb....unless you run a double pumper and gears.
Theres no question the large plenum creates bottom end torque issues.
Trouble is...these issues are made worse by cams that dont "favor" low end power production.
The factory 6.1 cam has a pretty small duration and would no doubt make better low end than the bigger off the shelf stuff.....but you'll lose top end....its a pretty mild cam
If your not chasing 1/4 mile times...Id look at one of the smaller Comp grinds....maybe get Modern Muscle or Comp to grind it on a 110 lsa...that way you'll have a sharp responding cam which hopefully wont be too bad down low.
Basically the less the duration, the less problems down low.
Be prepared to run a lot of initial timing also - as cylinder pressure wont be great with the modman.
I started at 10deg initial and ended up at 21 deg initial going to 25 at 3000 rpm with no detonation issues or kickback against the starter.
let me add a few things...and I appreciate the feedback.
this is more of a cruiser, drive to church on sundays, drive on a 2-3 hour trip on weekends etc... and ever once in awhile if get the itch I will take it to the track and run it for fun. id like to have a 11 sec quarter mile car....
this is what im using...904 trans, 5.7 hemi from Durango, 40k miles, modman intake, single carb, tti ceramic headers, 355 gears, car weighs about 3500 without me in it... so with a cam swap and springs I would hope for 425 hp maybe? flywheel....
so at this point do I need to worry about fuel, intake runners, hp and torque in a mostly street car? will it be that noticeable driving normal...and have decent power? I don't want to put this in and be totally disappointed either...but it is replacing the factory 273 lol... so can only go up from here ha.
67 Dodge Coronet 500 (Hemi 5.7 swap)
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Re: Gen III Hemi- Carb or EFI? Which one is better?
[Re: hemidup]
#1697261
11/15/14 04:32 AM
11/15/14 04:32 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,943
Melbourne.....Oz-land
Moparmal
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,943
Melbourne.....Oz-land
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Uncledon - sorry but I've opened up a bit of a can of worms...and your question has created a debate that may be more challenging than you realise. On the topic of it being a "simple choice" - I'll just say this.... I'm not so sure ANYONE on this board would run this stick on a carb set up given a choice. This stick went in at 114 ICL - as indicated it would by the supplier. However, suggesting people run a cam that's 4 deg retarded from straight up...and 8 deg off from the recommended ICL...??? Well if you asked the W2 flat tappet boys to do that..they'd fall over themselves laughing. Trouble is...there is no choice if you are going to run factory slugs on a G3 Hemi. 
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Re: Gen III Hemi- Carb or EFI? Which one is better?
[Re: Moparmal]
#1697265
11/15/14 09:50 PM
11/15/14 09:50 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,225
Charleston
sixpackgut
Drag Week Mod Champion
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Drag Week Mod Champion
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,225
Charleston
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A carb i can have running in 5 minutes. EFI depends on how long the migrane headache and violent shaking lasts
Gen 3 power 6.22@110, 9.85@135
Follow @g3hemiswap on instagram
performance only racing, CRT, ultimate converter, superior design concepts, ThumperCarbs
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Re: Gen III Hemi- Carb or EFI? Which one is better?
[Re: sixpackgut]
#1697266
11/15/14 10:55 PM
11/15/14 10:55 PM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
GoodysGotaCuda
5.7L Hemi, 6spd
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5.7L Hemi, 6spd
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
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Quote:
A carb i can have running in 5 minutes. EFI depends on how long the migrane headache and violent shaking lasts
5 minutes starting from what? My very first standalone EFI car fired, ran to 12,000rpm and idled within it's first start. Wiring from scratch, tune from scratch in a tube chassis race car. 
Migraine? Violent shaking?.....Fear of change sounds pretty alive and well here. 
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Re: Gen III Hemi- Carb or EFI? Which one is better?
[Re: sixpackgut]
#1697267
11/15/14 10:57 PM
11/15/14 10:57 PM
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Joined: May 2004
Posts: 12,493
Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY
Dragula
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 12,493
Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY
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I have run both efi and carb on the same engine, actually a couple of engines now, and achieved similar results in the 1/4.....Neither set-up instantly and need some tuning.
What most fail to understand, is efi, just like a carb needs porting and the same kind of air distribution considerations to have good even plugs. You can cover it up, but to truly perform, it does need some considerations.
What I like about the newer after market efi systems is the self learning feature...Plug in the target A/F and just drive it. But there is that frustration that comes with getting it going...
Last edited by Dragula; 11/15/14 11:00 PM.
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Re: Gen III Hemi- Carb or EFI? Which one is better?
[Re: GoodysGotaCuda]
#1697268
11/16/14 10:44 AM
11/16/14 10:44 AM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,225
Charleston
sixpackgut
Drag Week Mod Champion
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Drag Week Mod Champion
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,225
Charleston
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Quote:
Quote:
A carb i can have running in 5 minutes. EFI depends on how long the migrane headache and violent shaking lasts
5 minutes starting from what? My very first standalone EFI car fired, ran to 12,000rpm and idled within it's first start. Wiring from scratch, tune from scratch in a tube chassis race car.
Migraine? Violent shaking?.....Fear of change sounds pretty alive and well here.
Yes, Im one of the more stupider guys on here
Gen 3 power 6.22@110, 9.85@135
Follow @g3hemiswap on instagram
performance only racing, CRT, ultimate converter, superior design concepts, ThumperCarbs
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