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Re: Ideas for a stout stock stroke 340 build. [Re: cudadoug] #1673992
09/20/14 04:49 AM
09/20/14 04:49 AM
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Park Forest, IL
slantzilla Online content
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The guys in Stock are well into the 10's with a stock stroke, stock heads, stock intake and carb, and stock lift. They are pretty close to your weight too.

Yes, I know that it's comparing apples and oranges, but a lot of their power comes from meticulous assembly and lots of little tricks.

I would think with the same care and better induction, heads, and camshaft you should be able to get close to the power they make without being ragged edge.


"Everybody funny, now you funny too."
Re: Ideas for a stout stock stroke 340 build. [Re: slantzilla] #1673993
09/20/14 10:43 AM
09/20/14 10:43 AM
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Quote:

The guys in Stock are well into the 10's with a stock stroke, stock heads, stock intake and carb, and stock lift. They are pretty close to your weight too.

Yes, I know that it's comparing apples and oranges, but a lot of their power comes from meticulous assembly and lots of little tricks.

I would think with the same care and better induction, heads, and camshaft you should be able to get close to the power they make without being ragged edge.


and hundreds of hours testing and swapping parts, very expensive not to mention rpms they have to spin them

Re: Ideas for a stout stock stroke 340 build. [Re: Quicktree] #1673994
09/20/14 10:56 AM
09/20/14 10:56 AM
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Portage,michigan
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Stock eliminator build, while trick, is still very limited head and induction wise, the two areas where not having such limits are helpful.
I am pretty positive what I want to do isn't that hard. 550 or so isn't that much steam with good heads and combination, even at 340 something inches. I don't want to spin this thing much past 7k either. Shouldn't have to either.

Maybe some skipped my reference couple of posts up to that 340/w9 build that broke 600 horse@ 7000 rpm. Dyno's are dyno's and would love to see what that motor ran in a car..... Buts the heads were supposedly barely touched and only went 280.
The heads I would use I think would likely be just as good, if not better.


69 Dart GTS A4 Silver All steel, flat factory hood, 3360race weight
418 BPE factory replacement headed stroker, 565 lift solid cam
Best so far, 10.40 @127 1/4
1.41 best 60 foot
6.60 at 103.90 1/8

Re: Ideas for a stout stock stroke 340 build. [Re: B3422W5] #1673995
09/20/14 12:01 PM
09/20/14 12:01 PM
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Quote:

Stock eliminator build, while trick, is still very limited head and induction wise, the two areas where not having such limits are helpful.
I am pretty positive what I want to do isn't that hard. 550 or so isn't that much steam with good heads and combination, even at 340 something inches. I don't want to spin this thing much past 7k either. Shouldn't have to either.

Maybe some skipped my reference couple of posts up to that 340/w9 build that broke 600 horse@ 7000 rpm. Dyno's are dyno's and would love to see what that motor ran in a car..... Buts the heads were supposedly barely touched and only went 280.
The heads I would use I think would likely be just as good, if not better.




i have seen that W9 article more than once and its a build that seems like a fun one for sure.
however i doubt a procomp head will get even close to what that W9 does,better sparklplugglocation,better chamber and most scertainly those raised ports will do things to power that a flowbench probably never will tell you about.

i think you are going to need 7500rpm shiftpoints and a fairly temperamental cam to make 550Hp and get solidly into the 10īs with any stock replacement type heads, i think with the stock stroke a better head would make these goals alot easier on parts and a nicer running engine with a wider usable range with lower shiftpoints.

Re: Ideas for a stout stock stroke 340 build. [Re: 1Fast340] #1673996
09/20/14 12:33 PM
09/20/14 12:33 PM
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St. Paul , Mn.
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The down side to a W-9 deal is headers , intake and cooling system.
You need to be creative with two and lucky with the other.
I'd look at a Super Commando / Indybrock / Procomp kind of deal if you need aluminum or a W-2 if not.
10's is awfully ambitious , but not impossible.

Re: Ideas for a stout stock stroke 340 build. [Re: tubtar] #1673997
09/20/14 12:38 PM
09/20/14 12:38 PM
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ohio
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put some pistons in your 318 and add a turbo

Re: Ideas for a stout stock stroke 340 build. [Re: tubtar] #1673998
09/20/14 12:54 PM
09/20/14 12:54 PM
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Portage,michigan
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Quote:

The down side to a W-9 deal is headers , intake and cooling system.
You need to be creative with two and lucky with the other.
I'd look at a Super Commando / Indybrock / Procomp kind of deal if you need aluminum or a W-2 if not.
10's is awfully ambitious , but not impossible.




Good post!!

Remember Bondo just went 10.57 with the procomps( first outing) at 9.5 compression in a bench seat swinger. I know the 4 inch crank helps, but no more than3 or 4 tenths, with a relatively small head like that .And I wouldn't be at 9.5 compression either. so make up some power on that front.

Local racer( who sometimes posts on here) has a 340 with J heads and a flat tappet(3100 pound Duster) that has been 11.00's a number of times. His heads go I believe 251max. Ran teens at Norwalk. It's been together a few years now.

Last edited by B3422W5; 09/20/14 01:00 PM.
Re: Ideas for a stout stock stroke 340 build. [Re: B3422W5] #1673999
09/20/14 03:22 PM
09/20/14 03:22 PM
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Rescue CA.
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Ive been 11.50-11.60 with stock W heads smallish solid cam 3000 pound Duster I usually run 11.70 at 6000 rpm or turn up the rpm a little. I have w2 just haven't tried them to see what gains on my stock stroke 340.

Re: Ideas for a stout stock stroke 340 build. [Re: B3422W5] #1674000
09/20/14 03:31 PM
09/20/14 03:31 PM

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Quote:

Quote:

The down side to a W-9 deal is headers , intake and cooling system.
You need to be creative with two and lucky with the other.
I'd look at a Super Commando / Indybrock / Procomp kind of deal if you need aluminum or a W-2 if not.
10's is awfully ambitious , but not impossible.




Good post!!

Remember Bondo just went 10.57 with the procomps( first outing) at 9.5 compression in a bench seat swinger. I know the 4 inch crank helps, but no more than3 or 4 tenths, with a relatively small head like that .And I wouldn't be at 9.5 compression either. so make up some power on that front.

Local racer( who sometimes posts on here) has a 340 with J heads and a flat tappet(3100 pound Duster) that has been 11.00's a number of times. His heads go I believe 251max. Ran teens at Norwalk. It's been together a few years now.




Sounds like you had your mind made up and nobody is going to tell you any different. Not sure why you asked for input ??

If you can gain 3-4 tenths with a 5-$600 crank...and have it be more streetable...why wouldn't you ??

Re: Ideas for a stout stock stroke 340 build. [Re: ] #1674001
09/20/14 04:41 PM
09/20/14 04:41 PM
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Portage,michigan
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Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

The down side to a W-9 deal is headers , intake and cooling system.
You need to be creative with two and lucky with the other.
I'd look at a Super Commando / Indybrock / Procomp kind of deal if you need aluminum or a W-2 if not.
10's is awfully ambitious , but not impossible.




Good post!!

Remember Bondo just went 10.57 with the procomps( first outing) at 9.5 compression in a bench seat swinger. I know the 4 inch crank helps, but no more than3 or 4 tenths, with a relatively small head like that .And I wouldn't be at 9.5 compression either. so make up some power on that front.

Local racer( who sometimes posts on here) has a 340 with J heads and a flat tappet(3100 pound Duster) that has been 11.00's a number of times. His heads go I believe 251max. Ran teens at Norwalk. It's been together a few years now.




Sounds like you had your mind made up and nobody is going to tell you any different. Not sure why you asked for input ??

If you can gain 3-4 tenths with a 5-$600 crank...and have it be more streetable...why wouldn't you ??




Yes... I do have my mind made up. That's why the title of my post said" ideas on how to make a stout STOCK stroke 340".
Instead most everyone keeps saying why not build a stroker instead of stock stroke.
I have had a number of strokers. Just want to do something different this time.
Doesn't appear many have tried this, I am interested to give it a shot.



69 Dart GTS A4 Silver All steel, flat factory hood, 3360race weight
418 BPE factory replacement headed stroker, 565 lift solid cam
Best so far, 10.40 @127 1/4
1.41 best 60 foot
6.60 at 103.90 1/8

Re: Ideas for a stout stock stroke 340 build. [Re: B3422W5] #1674002
09/20/14 05:03 PM
09/20/14 05:03 PM
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Doesn't the whole concept of stock imply that it is not different as in every car came that way.

Re: Ideas for a stout stock stroke 340 build. [Re: B3422W5] #1674003
09/20/14 06:13 PM
09/20/14 06:13 PM
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Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

The down side to a W-9 deal is headers , intake and cooling system.
You need to be creative with two and lucky with the other.
I'd look at a Super Commando / Indybrock / Procomp kind of deal if you need aluminum or a W-2 if not.
10's is awfully ambitious , but not impossible.




Good post!!

Remember Bondo just went 10.57 with the procomps( first outing) at 9.5 compression in a bench seat swinger. I know the 4 inch crank helps, but no more than3 or 4 tenths, with a relatively small head like that .And I wouldn't be at 9.5 compression either. so make up some power on that front.

Local racer( who sometimes posts on here) has a 340 with J heads and a flat tappet(3100 pound Duster) that has been 11.00's a number of times. His heads go I believe 251max. Ran teens at Norwalk. It's been together a few years now.




Sounds like you had your mind made up and nobody is going to tell you any different. Not sure why you asked for input ??

If you can gain 3-4 tenths with a 5-$600 crank...and have it be more streetable...why wouldn't you ??




Yes... I do have my mind made up. That's why the title of my post said" ideas on how to make a stout STOCK stroke 340".
Instead most everyone keeps saying why not build a stroker instead of stock stroke.
I have had a number of strokers. Just want to do something different this time.
Doesn't appear many have tried this, I am interested to give it a shot.






i will repeat it,get some real good heads and you can do it, sawing money doing it with "stockstyle" heads is harder than needed and you will get a much better engine with better heads. look at any modern pushrod V8 and see how they make power,they do it with great heads and much milder cams than would be used in oldschool engines with heads that are crap by comparison and i dont care what cnc ported Procomps flow there is much better heads out there but they will cost you more in valvetrain

Re: Ideas for a stout stock stroke 340 build. [Re: B3422W5] #1674004
09/20/14 06:49 PM
09/20/14 06:49 PM
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Toronto
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Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

The down side to a W-9 deal is headers , intake and cooling system.
You need to be creative with two and lucky with the other.
I'd look at a Super Commando / Indybrock / Procomp kind of deal if you need aluminum or a W-2 if not.
10's is awfully ambitious , but not impossible.




Good post!!

Remember Bondo just went 10.57 with the procomps( first outing) at 9.5 compression in a bench seat swinger. I know the 4 inch crank helps, but no more than3 or 4 tenths, with a relatively small head like that .And I wouldn't be at 9.5 compression either. so make up some power on that front.

Local racer( who sometimes posts on here) has a 340 with J heads and a flat tappet(3100 pound Duster) that has been 11.00's a number of times. His heads go I believe 251max. Ran teens at Norwalk. It's been together a few years now.




Sounds like you had your mind made up and nobody is going to tell you any different. Not sure why you asked for input ??

If you can gain 3-4 tenths with a 5-$600 crank...and have it be more streetable...why wouldn't you ??




Yes... I do have my mind made up. That's why the title of my post said" ideas on how to make a stout STOCK stroke 340".
Instead most everyone keeps saying why not build a stroker instead of stock stroke.
I have had a number of strokers. Just want to do something different this time.
Doesn't appear many have tried this, I am interested to give it a shot.






Build it man! I still wish I kept my engine stock stroke, I love a small engine that can run hard!

Re: Ideas for a stout stock stroke 340 build. [Re: mshred] #1674005
09/21/14 02:02 PM
09/21/14 02:02 PM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,305
Lakewood, Colorado
herkamer Offline
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I'm building essentially the same thing with my 340. I wanted a mean, fairly streetable 340. This was before stroker cranks were so cheap and readily available. No sense changing plans now.

Stock stroke, full hydraulic roller with 11:1 compression, Indybrock heads going in a 69 Dart. A500 trans with 3000 stall, and 4.30 gears should motivate it pretty well and allow some highway jaunts. When I was planning, I ran it through Desktop Dyno and it estimated around 500HP. I have no clue exactly how close that will be to the final product. Back in the 90's I know my brother had a W2 head 340 in a 67 Barracuda race car that ran 11.2 here at 6000' in Denver. Apparently with a 4 speed the car previously ran 10.9 or 10.8. No doubt with the newer parts that could easily replicated and improved upon today.

I'm hoping to have mine going before too long, and get some dyno time also. I may put it in another 67 Barracuda to get some seat time with it.

Definitely interested in seeing how this thread goes. Perhaps I'll be inspired to get mine done soon!


Matt
69 Dart Swinger 340
83 W350, Megasquirted with 46RH
Old news: 72 Demon street/race mobile
Latest: 70 Duster backhalf car
and even more
Re: Ideas for a stout stock stroke 340 build. [Re: B3422W5] #1674006
09/21/14 06:17 PM
09/21/14 06:17 PM
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ohio
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hi don.all i run in my cuda is factory stock stroke 340's.one of my combos is ported w2's flat top's at 10:1 comp solid street roller .550 lift 242@.050.victor w2 intake 800 thermoquad.17/8 hedman headers.low gearset 904 trans w 5000 stall 8 inch converter.4.86 83/4 rearend @ 3100lbs went a best of 10.39@ 127 mph.that thing sounds like a stock 340 @ idle with lots of vacuum but has torque like you wouldn't believe from a 340.very streetable.

Re: Ideas for a stout stock stroke 340 build. [Re: prochamp] #1674007
09/21/14 07:49 PM
09/21/14 07:49 PM
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Portage,michigan
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hi don.all i run in my cuda is factory stock stroke 340's.one of my combos is ported w2's flat top's at 10:1 comp solid street roller .550 lift [Email]242@.050.victor[/Email] w2 intake 800 thermoquad.17/8 hedman headers.low gearset 904 trans w 5000 stall 8 inch converter.4.86 83/4 rearend @ 3100lbs went a best of 10.39@ 127 mph.that thing sounds like a stock 340 @ idle with lots of vacuum but has torque like you wouldn't believe from a 340.very streetable.




Wow mighty impressive combo. didn't know all your stuff was stock stroke, Rob.
What do you shift and trap at with that combo? How tall a tire?
Missed seeing you at Norwalk


69 Dart GTS A4 Silver All steel, flat factory hood, 3360race weight
418 BPE factory replacement headed stroker, 565 lift solid cam
Best so far, 10.40 @127 1/4
1.41 best 60 foot
6.60 at 103.90 1/8

Re: Ideas for a stout stock stroke 340 build. [Re: B3422W5] #1674008
09/21/14 09:38 PM
09/21/14 09:38 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
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Mt.Vernon ,Ohio
VernMotor Offline
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Put a big Block in it !

Re: Ideas for a stout stock stroke 340 build. [Re: VernMotor] #1674009
09/21/14 09:53 PM
09/21/14 09:53 PM
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Portage,michigan
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Quote:

Put a big Block in it !








69 Dart GTS A4 Silver All steel, flat factory hood, 3360race weight
418 BPE factory replacement headed stroker, 565 lift solid cam
Best so far, 10.40 @127 1/4
1.41 best 60 foot
6.60 at 103.90 1/8

Re: Ideas for a stout stock stroke 340 build. [Re: B3422W5] #1674010
09/21/14 11:40 PM
09/21/14 11:40 PM
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You can use the cnc-d pro comps as a start and put either 2.055 or 2.08s and with work you can get a good flowing/good running real 220+ cc runner without moving the pinch or even putting tubes in them.

The dealers can get killer deals on the cnc castings or Craig H at procomp will give you a dealers price if you buy in sets of 3.

I had a local hack try to upcharge me $600 on a set long ago so I simply called pro comp direct just like anyone else can.

The company who does the cnc work is just down the road from procomp and can check and cut the seats to your likes for, it was either $75 or $75 per head but I think it was a straight $75.

I don't recall the company who does the cnc work for procomp but when I had questions he could not answer he gave me the contact number of the guys doing them. No smoke and mirrors from pro comp, they simply want to sell a product.

If you do it yourself for 1300-1400 you can have a better head the the airpuppy heads that no one wants to talk about but you got to go high and low on the port to hit the real csa some claim to.

I feel the ferrea 6000s and comp springs and comp tit. retainers are better quality parts then the airpuppy heads at over 3k for results less advertised for 1/2 the cost.

It semi ironic looking back so many said the procomps were junk and no heli-coils and powdered seats and that's not been the case.

Some of the biggest anti pro comp builders are now pushing them and getting very good results.

I know one is working on the offset pinch aspect and that's a good thing imo at to get 220+runners I think really high spring pressures might be a issue on the right and left of center rocker stands.

But with the bare castings its a clean slate and no one says you have to goto 220 cc, you could possibly meet your goals by going less.

The 220 runners need a lot of plenum volume where I try to get the PV to equal the cubic inch of the build or at least 90%. And there are ways slow things down and get good carb signals, as close to efi response as ive ever seen in a carbed setup.

You can also improve the cnc-ed chamber a decent bit with more deshrouding if your bore size will take it and wiseco makes a nice gas ported sprayable piston with a 8cc dome so you can make up for the chamber work and still have a decent quench pad.

Re: Ideas for a stout stock stroke 340 build. [Re: B3422W5] #1674011
09/23/14 01:08 AM
09/23/14 01:08 AM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 205
ohio
prochamp Offline
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ohio
don that one was with a 30 inch tire shifting at 6800 traps at 7000.like i said lots of torque...ran better than i thought it would too....

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