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Doug's Headers Don't fit my car. Am I unreasonable? #1585845 03/01/14 12:04 AM 03/01/14 12:04 AM
Joined: Sep 2008 Posts: 201 Rome, Ga S sbhpcb OP enthusiast
sbhpcb OP enthusiast S Joined: Sep 2008 Posts: 201 Rome, Ga	I bought a set of Doug's headers for my 71 cuda 5.7 hemi swap back in January. The Headers do not fit, not even close, the power steering box is 2" from head and the headers stick out 3". I called Doug's tech Guy after a few calls I get Him, He says he does not know anything about these that they are "New" ( started production in Oct 2013) But he will call the R&D guys and Find out. Mean while I send a Ebay email to the seller ( who turns out to be the Manufacturer ) to let them know that the headers do not fit and I have contacted Doug's. The seller emails back that I needed to use S&P's Motor mounts as recommended on Doug's Website. ( Website say's These Headers will work with most motor mounts on the Market ). I try several times with no answer or returned call from the Tech Guy at Doug's. I email several times to the seller, they say the tech guy will call today. After 3 1/2 weeks I ask for the return info, no reply so then I ask for the return info 4 days later. I Get a RMA number and ship the headers back to the Seller/Manufacture. It cost over $77.00 the UPS lady lets me know Doug's gets a discount and it would have been around $50.00 for them to pay the return shipping. I call Pertronix (Doug's) and I ask for reimburstment for My shipping cost. the Manager calls me back to let me know that they will check the headers, if they fit there Fixture then it is obviously something wrong with my car, not the headers. Am I un reasonable to expect that Doug's Headers ( Pertronix ) Pay me back for the return shipping? I have been Patient for there non existent Tech help or Customer service. The product DOES NOT even come close to fitting my car Which the ad and website Clearly state it will. Blast me and tell me where I went wrong if you think I need it or tell I Have done what a resonible person would do and expect.

Re: Doug's Headers Don't fit my car. Am I unreasonable? [Re: sbhpcb] #1585846 03/01/14 12:21 AM 03/01/14 12:21 AM
Joined: Jul 2007 Posts: 11,836 Florida M mopar346 Let me tell ya about fat chicks!
mopar346 Let me tell ya about fat chicks! M Joined: Jul 2007 Posts: 11,836 Florida	If they advertised they would fit and they don't then they are liable. I am of course assuming everything is right on your end and you read the ad correctly. Too many vendors that aren't held accountable for bad products and poor service. I can say I have never really heard anything bad about Doug's, but I haven't dealt with them personally. Careful, your character's showing!

Re: Doug's Headers Don't fit my car. Am I unreasonable? [Re: sbhpcb] #1585847 03/01/14 12:27 AM 03/01/14 12:27 AM
Joined: Dec 2004 Posts: 10,645 Rittman Ohio fourgearsavoy I Live Here
fourgearsavoy I Live Here Joined: Dec 2004 Posts: 10,645 Rittman Ohio	Well you would be the first I have ever heard that didn't love the fit and finish on their new Doug's headers Does anybody else make headers to fit your combo? I never had to deal with Doug's on a customer service level because my headers fit like a glove. Did you do a search to find out if anybody else had fitment issues with your combo? Gus 8056841-frontveiwsavoy.jpg (106 downloads) 64 Plymouth Savoy 493 Indy EZ's by Nick at Compu-Flow 5-Speed Richmond faceplate Liberty box Dana 60

Re: Doug's Headers Don't fit my car. Am I unreasonable? [Re: sbhpcb] #1585848 03/01/14 12:32 AM 03/01/14 12:32 AM
Joined: Nov 2003 Posts: 36,041 Lincoln Nebraska R RapidRobert Circle Track
RapidRobert Circle Track R Joined: Nov 2003 Posts: 36,041 Lincoln Nebraska	I hope you can get some resolution but you might have to sue em. I just went thru this with that clown Ben Gorman of Promax in Indianapolis who sold me some chinese heads claiming they were EQ's. All he did was dance & evade. he's outa state so unless I go after him legally it's a dead deal. I'm almost tempted to just for the principle live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth

Re: Doug's Headers Don't fit my car. Am I unreasonable? [Re: RapidRobert] #1585849 03/01/14 12:49 AM 03/01/14 12:49 AM
Joined: Sep 2008 Posts: 201 Rome, Ga S sbhpcb OP enthusiast
sbhpcb OP enthusiast S Joined: Sep 2008 Posts: 201 Rome, Ga	The headers are "New" been out since Oct 2013 I did not find any body that had tested the fit back on a E body in January when this Mess started. As for If every thing is right on My end? I called several times to check with the tech Guy. He did not Know anything about these Headers, said he would research it 3 1/2 weeks later I still can not get a return call. Yet there is a clock ticking on the return timeline. It had been 6 weeks since the charge was made on my card.

Re: Doug's Headers Don't fit my car. Am I unreasonable? [Re: sbhpcb] #1585850 03/01/14 12:57 AM 03/01/14 12:57 AM
Joined: Feb 2010 Posts: 18,493 Granite Bay CA Kern Dog Striving for excellence
Kern Dog Striving for excellence Joined: Feb 2010 Posts: 18,493 Granite Bay CA	I read the part where it was suggested to use a specific motor mount. I also read where you wrote that there is a ONE inch discrepancy between the head and steering box vs header standoff from the head. Come on, REALLY? Can there be that much variance between two different types of motor mounts? I really doubt that. Last year I changed the K member in my Charger. Before, I had a 1/4" of clearance between the headers and steering box. After the swap, the headers hit. I should also add that I replaced a broken RH motor mount. Still, even before with the RH mount being fine, it didn't hit. There are "tolerance stack-ups" but an inch? Thats not likely. I vote for incorrectly jigged headers.

Re: Doug's Headers Don't fit my car. Am I unreasonable? [Re: sbhpcb] #1585851 03/01/14 03:22 AM 03/01/14 03:22 AM
Joined: Aug 2006 Posts: 247 DuPont, Washington D DZJim enthusiast
DZJim enthusiast D Joined: Aug 2006 Posts: 247 DuPont, Washington	Quote: The headers are "New" been out since Oct 2013 I did not find any body that had tested the fit back on a E body in January when this Mess started. As for If every thing is right on My end? I called several times to check with the tech Guy. He did not Know anything about these Headers, said he would research it 3 1/2 weeks later I still can not get a return call. Yet there is a clock ticking on the return timeline. It had been 6 weeks since the charge was made on my card. I always use a VISA card for these transactions. Its been years, but I had a problem with some plug wires and same tapdance routine "we'll get back to you"...I contacted my bank and requested a "chargeback". I got my money back and I don't know what transpired between them and the bank. Gotta follow procedure and have you act together. I'm a very good customer so I wasn't surprised the bank took my side...

Re: Doug's Headers Don't fit my car. Am I unreasonable? [Re: DZJim] #1585852 03/01/14 04:11 AM 03/01/14 04:11 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 27,421 Balt. Md 3 383man Too Many Posts
383man Too Many Posts 3 Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 27,421 Balt. Md	They actually make a header for your combo of a 71 Cuda with a gen II 5.7 Hemi ? Not being smart but I never knew anyone made a header to fit that. Ron Last edited by 383man; 03/01/14 04:18 AM.

Re: Doug's Headers Don't fit my car. Am I unreasonable? [Re: DZJim] #1585853 03/01/14 08:01 AM 03/01/14 08:01 AM
Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 4,862 the frozen wastes... Pale_Roader Swears too much
Pale_Roader Swears too much Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 4,862 the frozen wastes...	Quote: I always use a VISA card for these transactions. Its been years, but I had a problem with some plug wires and same tapdance routine "we'll get back to you"...I contacted my bank and requested a "chargeback". I got my money back and I don't know what transpired between them and the bank. Gotta follow procedure and have you act together. I'm a very good customer so I wasn't surprised the bank took my side... Always wondered this too. I'm guessing that it doesn't work out well for the shady vendor... as if there is one unbending law ov the universe it is that no matter what, one way or another, BANKS DONT LOSE.

Re: Doug's Headers Don't fit my car. Am I unreasonable? [Re: Kern Dog] #1585854 03/01/14 12:02 PM 03/01/14 12:02 PM
Joined: Apr 2007 Posts: 905 SD Z zrxkawboy super stock
zrxkawboy super stock Z Joined: Apr 2007 Posts: 905 SD	Quote: There are "tolerance stack-ups" but an inch? Thats not likely. My thoughts, too. I don't see how the motor mounts could make that much difference. I hope they own up to their mistake. It's Swifty! Swifty, you toad sucker!

Re: Doug's Headers Don't fit my car. Am I unreasonable? [Re: zrxkawboy] #1585855 03/01/14 12:18 PM 03/01/14 12:18 PM
Joined: Jun 2008 Posts: 10,958 Oakdale CT gdonovan I Live Here
gdonovan I Live Here Joined: Jun 2008 Posts: 10,958 Oakdale CT	Quote: My thoughts, too. I don't see how the motor mounts could make that much difference. I hope they own up to their mistake. You are talking about an engine that was never used on that platform, who is to say what the "standard" is for engine location? I'm not surprised a bit. "I think its got a hemi"

Re: Doug's Headers Don't fit my car. Am I unreasonable? [Re: gdonovan] #1585856 03/01/14 03:47 PM 03/01/14 03:47 PM
Joined: Feb 2010 Posts: 18,493 Granite Bay CA Kern Dog Striving for excellence
Kern Dog Striving for excellence Joined: Feb 2010 Posts: 18,493 Granite Bay CA	I thought that TTI made an engine mount and header kit for E body 5.7 Hemi swaps.

Re: Doug's Headers Don't fit my car. Am I unreasonable? [Re: sbhpcb] #1585857 03/02/14 11:39 AM 03/02/14 11:39 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 8,589 Candler,NC / Myrtle Beach, SC JDMopar master
JDMopar master Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 8,589 Candler,NC / Myrtle Beach, SC	Check out the pics in this thread over on FABO. Dude put a 5.7 in an E-body Cuda with PS. He used the Dougs headers, and seems very happy with them. The one pic may give you a comparison to the fit that you had. http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=262598

Re: Doug's Headers Don't fit my car. Am I unreasonable? [Re: fourgearsavoy] #1585858 03/02/14 11:45 AM 03/02/14 11:45 AM
Joined: Jan 2004 Posts: 6,445 Missouri 68KillerBee master
68KillerBee master Joined: Jan 2004 Posts: 6,445 Missouri	I've had to send back my cut outs when they broke 2-3 times on my dime. What makes it worse is that it takes a week to get to them, 4-5 days to fix it, then another week to get them shipped back. Unless you want to pay a ridiculous shipping price to get it there quicker....

Re: Doug's Headers Don't fit my car. Am I unreasonable? [Re: sbhpcb] #1585859 03/02/14 11:07 PM 03/02/14 11:07 PM
Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 2,617 Stratford nj cudadan master
cudadan master Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 2,617 Stratford nj	they fit in my 74 cuda excellent, with the 5.7,, i also made my own motor mounts too,, not sure if that changes anything

Re: Doug's Headers Don't fit my car. Am I unreasonable? [Re: cudadan] #1585860 03/02/14 11:52 PM 03/02/14 11:52 PM
Joined: Sep 2008 Posts: 201 Rome, Ga S sbhpcb OP enthusiast
sbhpcb OP enthusiast S Joined: Sep 2008 Posts: 201 Rome, Ga	Looks Like 2 different cudadan's have made there own mounts and have been able to use the Doug's Headers. The cudadan that has showed us pics looks like has NO A/C. No a/c would have allowed me to Raise the motor as the a/c requires hood clearence on the truck motor, if I had built my on mounts. I used the TTI mounts as I felt they had sorta set the standard. My motor sits a little lower I think which causes the header to hit the Power steering gearbox. Neither of the cudadans show which hood they used. looks like the pics I saw showed the motor droped in with the headers attached and then the mounts built? I think my motor sits close to the Others I have seen on Moparts as that most folks that have run the truck exhaust manifolds have had to do just a little grinding to get them to fit as I would have had I not sloted the 3 gearbox holes on the borgeson box, the Factory box would have required a rib on the truck manifold to be ground off. Here is a quote from Doug's website: The D4477 will fit the 70-74 Challenger/Cuda, 68-74 Charger/Coronet/Belvedere/Super Bee/GTX/Roadrunner, as well as the 75-77 Fury using most of the common engine mounting kits on the market. Remember also there Tech Guy never would call me back, he had said he did not know anything about these headers and would have to call the R&D guy. I would have loved to talk with the R&D guy to make the headers fit if he knew something I did not. Thanks for all the replies so far.

Re: Doug's Headers Don't fit my car. Am I unreasonable? [Re: sbhpcb] #1585861 03/07/14 03:11 PM 03/07/14 03:11 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 8,145 Arkansas 340727dart master
340727dart master Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 8,145 Arkansas	If the parts aren�t exactly as described and/or they don�t fit, there is not one good reason any vendor can give to justify not paying the return shipping. Goodness knows there are way too many vendors today who ship faulty or defective parts, and refuse to pay to have them shipped back. Why people continue to use them is beyond me. Your life is not my fault. My life is none of your business. Speech is free only if you agree with those in control.

Re: Doug's Headers Don't fit my car. Am I unreasonable? [Re: sbhpcb] #1585862 03/09/14 11:13 PM 03/09/14 11:13 PM
Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 2,617 Stratford nj cudadan master
cudadan master Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 2,617 Stratford nj	Quote: Looks Like 2 different cudadan's have made there own mounts and have been able to use the Doug's Headers. The cudadan that has showed us pics looks like has NO A/C. No a/c would have allowed me to Raise the motor as the a/c requires hood clearence on the truck motor, if I had built my on mounts. I used the TTI mounts as I felt they had sorta set the standard. My motor sits a little lower I think which causes the header to hit the Power steering gearbox. Neither of the cudadans show which hood they used. looks like the pics I saw showed the motor droped in with the headers attached and then the mounts built? I think my motor sits close to the Others I have seen on Moparts as that most folks that have run the truck exhaust manifolds have had to do just a little grinding to get them to fit as I would have had I not sloted the 3 gearbox holes on the borgeson box, the Factory box would have required a rib on the truck manifold to be ground off. Here is a quote from Doug's website: The D4477 will fit the 70-74 Challenger/Cuda, 68-74 Charger/Coronet/Belvedere/Super Bee/GTX/Roadrunner, as well as the 75-77 Fury using most of the common engine mounting kits on the market. Remember also there Tech Guy never would call me back, he had said he did not know anything about these headers and would have to call the R&D guy. I would have loved to talk with the R&D guy to make the headers fit if he knew something I did not. Thanks for all the replies so far. , im running an AAR hood on my cuda, i have about 1/8th clearance to my steering box,i have seen ppl use an 1/8" shim between the motor and mount, just to get that little extra room

Re: Doug's Headers Don't fit my car. Am I unreasonable? [Re: cudadan] #1585863 03/09/14 11:35 PM 03/09/14 11:35 PM
Joined: Nov 2005 Posts: 1,943 San Angelo, Texas, U.S.A. 1968RR top fuel
1968RR top fuel Joined: Nov 2005 Posts: 1,943 San Angelo, Texas, U.S.A.	Headers seem to always be tight fits, even when they're in a car with a stock motor. When you put them on a modern engine in an older car, there are even more variables to consider than when putting them in a car with a period-correct engine. I don't have any experience with this manufacturer, and I'm not saying that you're in the wrong here; I'm just giving my . Of course, if the headers don't fit and Doug's is to blame, you deserve your back. Good luck. "When I'm in a slump, I comfort myself by saying if I believe in dinosaurs, then somewhere, they must be believing in me. And if they believe in me, then I can believe in me." - Mookie Wilson

Re: Doug's Headers Don't fit my car. Am I unreasonable? [Re: 1968RR] #1585864 03/09/14 11:50 PM 03/09/14 11:50 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 4,323 NY NY 3 340duster340 master
340duster340 master 3 Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 4,323 NY NY	if you bought thru ebay and paid with paypal, just seek refund through them, they really do the right thing for buyers + i think you get the buyers insurance for free through paypal purchases.

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