Sent the converter off to Lenny today. Hope to have back Wednesday so I can see what's up with the new bullet.

Leon

Make that tomorrow.

Here is a little eye candy

Leon

Got to make a few changes. Like speed the oil pump up or block some things off. Drove this thing last night. Stroke is everything. This thing is a torque beast.

Leon

sweet how big is the new engine bore stroke did you use the same heads from the old engine

It is 4" stroke with a 4.182" bore.

The only changes I made were necessary. I had to change the motor plate but, retained the newer belt drive. I also had to install my pan and dry sump pump as it all fit. The only performance change I made was my Edebrock 2816 Intake I had. I did convert it to a 4500 flange. I will need to do some welding and cosmetic work on it when I get a chance. The Intake that was on it was a very small runner Mopar intake.

I really can't wait til the winter where I can take it all apart and tighten some clearances and fix it for spray. It should really be fun then.

Leon

So you did a 440" R5P7.??

I might be confused here..

I didn't know they could go that big..


Chris..

That's because you haven't religiously been paying attention to my post, LOL.

It is an Ernie Elliot aluminum block. Taller deck height and larger 340 main bearings. You can actually build 467" but, 453 is the largest proven successful I know about. I honestly believe if you knew you were drag racing and had LA Sleeve install a sleeve to go 4.250" which EEI has not been offering last I checked you could build a real big one. Personally can't see why they have not done this Chevy guys have went big with their limited bore spacing.

Leon

Got the pump speed up and it worked great.

Needed to test. Did not have time to change the gears. I did not know what the converter would do as the 31X10.5 tires would go up in smoke pretty bad on the street. So I put my 21X14.5 tires on and with a 4.10 and a glide just not enough gear. Still had a 1.40 60 ft with the terrible gearing and big tires. Still got the 20 gallon fuel cell so the car is over 3,000 lbs. But, all is good. Nothing changed from the round-d-round except for the intake and the car went 5.90@118. Which is a fair 1/8 mile for a bad 60 ft. The quarter I was a little less pleased with. 9.2's at 147 MPH. I did not have any plugs in the trailer and was running on plugs that look worse than what is in you wife's car. LOL. So to say I was tuning is insane. Changing gears to 4.88 or lower and putting a new set of 31X10.5 tires on the car.

The converter was supposed to go 6,200 and was going 6,500-6700 depending on air with the tall gear. Hopefully the 4.88 and shorter tire will bring it down a little closer. The engine made peak HP at 7,400 for the previous owner. My Intake is a bit different but, first pass turned it 8,500 and that was better than shifting at 8,000.

Leon

8500 rpm........... that's gotta sound sweet.

The little 358 sounded sweeter at 9,500. 358 sounded noisy until it reached 7,500. A real loose bottom end used in NASCAR.

The 440 is standard firing order and relatively calm and quite. It was a little rough at part throttle but, like I said the plugs are pretty bad and the tune has gotta be out a little.

Leon

nice for the first time out what do you think u can get out of this new combo

The gear change alone should bring the 60 ft down a tenth. I would say a conservative guess for just that would be 5.75. There is definitely some tuning that can be done with the fresh plugs. I believe it can run what my W8 ran that had a lot more compression and camshaft. The MPH is not quite as good but, it more than makes up for that with torque.

My W8 was a max effort CFE cylinder head with a light spinning assembly. These P7's are just some ole used NASCAR stuff and the short block is very conservative internally.

Leon

Went testing Fri night. Track way fairly good. Car was leaving hard but having issues starting around 25 ft out. Tried several adjustments with rear shocks and tire pressure with no change.

Sat had a no track prep VA STREET OUTLAWS race. Leaned over the fender to pull a plug and realized the shock seemed to have no compression control. Found the adjuster backed out. Corrected this.

Long story short. No track prep on and ole airstrip 60 ft was 1.37 and ran 5.88@119.8 consistently. No one could believe an all motor small block driven on the street was running these numbers. Finished 6th against nitrous, blowers, and 700+ engines. Once I have time to go through the engine and fix all the loose ends it should really knock down some numbers. I suspect the 358 would have ran the same numbers with more gear ratio. The new 440 R5P7 only was turning 8,000 where the 358 really liked 9,000-9,500.

Still can't understand why more of these engines are not out there. My cousin was wanting to spend a couple thousand on stuff to do a street blower set up on his 340. I could not get it through his head the 358's are cheap especially when you buy them apart. Change a few things like pistons and rings which are all available cheap on Ebay and you have a very top shelf engine for literally pennies on the dollar.

Leon

So is a healthy dose of nitrous in the near future? I would love to see how a motor like this responds to it.

Over the winter

Leon

Excellent. You keep testing and sharing with us and I'll keep learning! I should have bought your old W short block, crap.

I am a bit confused. Where is the great bargain for drag racing? If a used up Nascar 358 is so good, why is Leon running a $7500+ aluminum block plus all the other $$$ goods to make it a 440? Obviously, a used 358 is not good enough.

Evidently you have not been keeping up.

I originally intended to build a 440 or larger engine. A 358 with a 2.25" main is not going to handle my intentions.

I heard about these blocks a couple years ago when the XR2 talk was just getting started. I then found an engine with the EEi block for sale. I called and found that it too had the 2.25" mains. The guy told me about an engine his friend who had just built with the later 340 main block and was very happy.

I sold my W8 stuff piece by piece to keep things going while waiting on my previous house to sell.

After the sale I was preparing to buy everything to build an EEI block. Yes $7,500, and that is a deal it is done and ready with Jesel keyway bushings. All other aluminum blocks I checked on at this level for other makes once machined were around that price or more. The crank is $3,200 as a off the shelf 340 based crank does not work with the rear seal or front belt drive. I did not have that much money to sink into the deal and the heads I had were a little smaller than what I needed. The intake manifolds were $600 also.

Bob Leeth wanted to sell out. He had everything needed to bolt it in the car. That makes a huge difference. Based on his information and his troubles he had made changes that made sense. I bought his stuff. I bought this combination with plans to later build a 440+ shortblock for it. After breaking a rocker arm and a mishap in the shop #5 cylinder got hurt bad. Just bad luck.

That 358 Trwaters ran 5.82 at 118. So yes it is a great bargain for drag racing. Bad luck can come with any engine. Things happen.

I want to someday run a lot of nitrous with this combo. A 2.25" main is not going to be happy with 500HP nitrous. While looking for a replacement block I was not having much luck for a machined block like the one I had. I was trying to purchase a used block and crank and the guy who had some would not sell. I was prepared to call EEI and it was too late in the day. I then found the current 440 R5P7 that came with a disassembled Bush 358. So I bought them.

Argue what you want. However I did not have to buy the $7500 block and $3,200 crank to go 440 on my own as planned. It is not a bad deal if you do. The world is full of these P7 heads people have bought up. When builders are getting $10K for a 408 that are over estimated to make 600HP. Yes the 358 stuff covering Ebay for $10K is a great bargain. They make 800 HP in cup form.

Leon

Tested some more last night at VMP. The weather was 70's and muggy. Made a run with my 1050 and then switched out to the 1250. The car picked up .5 mph in the 1/8 and nothing in the quarter. Last time we were there the car ran faster shifting at 8,500. Did not beat on it rather shifted at 8,000. It was noticeable the engine was falling over in high gear near the 1/4 mark at 8,000. Like previously mentioned the cam is tiny. A change is definitely in order.

This just for Trwaters. This 440 that blows the whole idea of bargain IYO is no faster in current form. It just requires less gear ratio and less RPM to run with the current cam. There is nothing wrong with the 358 combos especially if you have a torqueflite to keep it in a happy RPM.

Can't wait to get into this 440 and correct the mismatched spacers. Then some more cam to pick up the peak torque RPM and make some more HP.

Leon

I am curious about the headers. Did you change them going up in CI and down in rpm's? Are they 4:1 or the Nascar type tri-Y's? I do believe the tri-Y headers is one important key component in bringing up the torque in the Nascar engines, and I have not seen them in use for drag-racing, any comments to this? Thanks, Oyvind