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Re: 66 Belvedere II Hemi - safety neutral switch
[Re: edl]
#1452421
06/14/13 04:45 PM
06/14/13 04:45 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,125
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JohnRR
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Quote:
Quote:
Will the 3 prong by the brake booster reach down to the trans , does it look like it will plug into the switch on the trans ? If the answer to both of these is no then I have no clue what that is .
Does the car start , run and drive now ? If it does will it start in gear ?
to be clear, there is no wire plugged into the fire wall - just an empty socket on the fire wall - i am starting to think it must have nothing to do with it - who would wire from the starter back up to the firewall near the brake booster, only to then go back under the car to the tranny? - i guess stranger things have happened...but...
the car does start, run and drive now
it will start in gear 
How about a picture of the 3 prong plug at the firewall you are talking about ?
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Re: 66 Belvedere II Hemi - safety neutral switch
[Re: edl]
#1452423
06/14/13 05:55 PM
06/14/13 05:55 PM
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 6,516
Santa Cruz, California
Lefty
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master
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Santa Cruz, California
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The schematic shows one wire from the NSS on the trans to the "G" pin on the starter solenoid. That's all you need. The car will not crank until that wire is grounded. I suspect all you need is the correct one pin NSS, correct connector for the NSS and a wire and terminal to the terminal labeled "G" on the starter solenoid. Quote:
OK - i found a wiring diagram in the meantime, attached
it shows that the last step in the loop is a black 16ga wire from the starter solenoid to the safety neutral switch - as we all now know, there should be only this single wire going to a single wire socket on the tranny - that wire is missing and there is no wire of any kind going to the tranny so clearly one fix could be to put a 16ga black wire from the starter to the tranny (assuming i can get the kind of 3 prong switch it needs)
on the ignition side, is there anything that separately is part of the loop for this circuit? - that is, is there something from the ignition to the starter specially for the safety neutral switch that is required for the wire from the starter to the safety neutral switch to work? - or, is it as simple as juice to the starter solenoid upon ignition and this black wire activates and grounds it out if the switch on the tranny is engaged (or unengaged, however it works)?
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Re: 66 Belvedere II Hemi - safety neutral switch
[Re: JohnRR]
#1452427
06/18/13 01:50 PM
06/18/13 01:50 PM
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 331
Northeast
edl
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Quote:
The 66 trans should not have a 3 prong , also the 3 prong needs the correct rooster comb inside the trans to be activated. contact member joesixpack he usually has the switch you need for sale.
John - you were right - Joesixpack had the single terminal(male)threaded post - but he does not have the connector or the rooster comb - any thoughts on who might have these?
thanks as always!
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Re: 66 Belvedere II Hemi - safety neutral switch
[Re: edl]
#1452428
06/18/13 02:04 PM
06/18/13 02:04 PM
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 10,189
A Red State
SNK-EYZ
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I Live Here
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Are you sure that it has the wrong comb/rooster tail in the trans? They may have just tried to install the later style switch and wiring but never messed with anything inside the trans. 
Kayse can't keep up at all now. lol
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Re: 66 Belvedere II Hemi - safety neutral switch
[Re: SNK-EYZ]
#1452431
06/18/13 04:27 PM
06/18/13 04:27 PM
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 331
Northeast
edl
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Quote:
Are you sure that it has the wrong comb/rooster tail in the trans?
They may have just tried to install the later style switch and wiring but never messed with anything inside the trans.
contacted a tranny shop Brewers recommended for auto trans - they confirmed that although there are different rooster combs, it would not affect the NSS - so switching the NSS terminal from the later 3 prong switch to the single terminal switch does not necessitate changing the rooster comb - so that is one problem less
also, i re-looked at the wiring diagrams and now realize that what i attached above is for a Valiant and not a Belvedere - the correct one is now attached - it is very simple - it is a 16ga brown wire with an eyelet on one end (the single switch at the tranny is a post with a nut) and a different kind of connector (don't know what yet - looks from the wiring diagram like some sort of a spade) that plugs into the ground slot on the starter relay switch on the firewall
boy was i way off track!
so - (i) have found and ordered the correct switch for the tranny (ii) don't need to change the rooster comb (iii) do need to find someone that sells that brown 16ga wire with the proper connections on each end
does anyone have a thought on who sells such a wire?
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Re: 66 Belvedere II Hemi - safety neutral switch
[Re: edl]
#1452432
06/18/13 05:11 PM
06/18/13 05:11 PM
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 331
Northeast
edl
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it also occurs to me that this will be a hemi only part b/c the starter relay switch is not on the firewall but on a bracket on the left inner fender wall - so it will have to be a longer wire than otherwise i have found a similar part at year one - part #L38434, but it is for a '68 i spoke to M&H who makes it for Y1 and have found out it is a 46" wire also, it appears that the it is a male spade on the starter relay and so the other end of the wire is a female spade connection Question: 1. is the male spade on a 66 starter relay switch (the hemi version that is on the bracket off the inner left fender wall) the same as '68 starter relay that sits on the fire wall? if yes, seems that one fix (if i can't find a used or NOS wire) is to get the Y1 wire and splice in some extra inches in the middle... EDIT: spoke to Y1 - they said a 68 won't work for 66 - guy couldn't say why, but said they were "night and day" 
Last edited by edl; 06/18/13 05:25 PM.
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Re: 66 Belvedere II Hemi - safety neutral switch
[Re: stumpy]
#1452437
06/19/13 10:18 AM
06/19/13 10:18 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,125
A Banana Republic near you.
JohnRR
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Quote:
If you follow the instructions I gave you then you would have the correct answers to your NSS questions.
That's a good way to look at it and figure out what is what but in the end he has a low mileage original hemi car and from the other posts the OP has made in the past they seem to point toward making the car original ...
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Re: 66 Belvedere II Hemi - safety neutral switch
[Re: JohnRR]
#1452438
06/19/13 11:28 AM
06/19/13 11:28 AM
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 331
Northeast
edl
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Maybe i am still unclear what Stumpy is saying - Stumpy, i thought you were telling me a way in which i could tell if i have the right starter relay But John is right, i do have a low mileage original hemi car and want to keep the car as original as i can if what stumpy was saying is to switch the starter relay to one for a manual trans car and jury rig it to bypass the NSS, that is not what i would want to do - for safety reasons in that case as well as originality but, to be truthful, i guess i am still unclear what stumpy is suggesting anyway, at this point i will look at the positive battery cable harness this weekend and see if the brown wire i need is bundled in there thanks for everyone's patience and guidance!
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Re: 66 Belvedere II Hemi - safety neutral switch
[Re: stumpy]
#1452440
06/19/13 01:24 PM
06/19/13 01:24 PM
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 331
Northeast
edl
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Quote:
What I am suggesting is for you to see whether or not you have the right rooster comb and switch combo for the trans not the car. I realize the car should have a single terminal switch which uses a different rooster comb on the valve body than the three terminal switch. I didn't suggest you bypass anything. I said if it starts ther way it is someone has already bypassed the switch.
got it!!
the guy at the tranny shop Brewers sent me to said that it shouldn't matter what rooster comb i have as far as the NSS is concerned - that each of the available rooster combs is detented in a way that effects the NSS the same way - i know that the rooster comb that is in there now otherwise works, because the car drives and the column shift works in all gears - so...i think i am set in not needing a rooster comb
i have located the correct single terminal switch and purchased it - so if what i have been told is right, when i plug that switch into the tranny, it should work provided it is wired to the starter relay correctly
so the only thing that leaves is the wiring - the switch is definitely being bypassed at the moment because the car will start in gear - i don't know if i currently have the right starter relay - so that is one thing i have to check - assuming i have the right starter relay, the only thing i need to find (or replace) is the 16ga brown wire that should connect to the starter relay via a female blade connector on one end of the wire and the tranny switch via an eyelet connector on the other end of the wire
little by little!
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