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Re: gas percolating issues
[Re: JohnRR]
#1431291
05/07/13 11:09 AM
05/07/13 11:09 AM
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 965
S.W. Pennsylvania
markrr
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 965
S.W. Pennsylvania
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Quote:
Quote:
As I understand it, the Road Runner is likely a factory appearing car and you prefer to keep it that way?
I was thinking that some sort of return line may help. Something designed to keep fresh fuel in a loop instead of heated fuel just sitting in the fuel bowls. I'm not sure of how you'd do it though.
Jeff
That will help when driving, I know of one member that has/had a fuel perk issue while running once everything got hot , but that's not going to do anything for most people problems ... gas boiling off after shutdown.
So running a return line from a fuel seperator between the pump and carb to the tank will not improve starting after the engine is off?
I was planning on trying this soon.
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Re: gas percolating issues
[Re: markrr]
#1431292
05/07/13 11:13 AM
05/07/13 11:13 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,098
A Banana Republic near you.
JohnRR
I Win
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,098
A Banana Republic near you.
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
As I understand it, the Road Runner is likely a factory appearing car and you prefer to keep it that way?
I was thinking that some sort of return line may help. Something designed to keep fresh fuel in a loop instead of heated fuel just sitting in the fuel bowls. I'm not sure of how you'd do it though.
Jeff
That will help when driving, I know of one member that has/had a fuel perk issue while running once everything got hot , but that's not going to do anything for most people problems ... gas boiling off after shutdown.
So running a return line from a fuel seperator between the pump and carb to the tank will not improve starting after the engine is off?
I was planning on trying this soon.
I don't see how it would, it's not going to do anything to make the engine, and carb, cooler whether the engine is running or not.
Now if you leave an electric fuel pump running while the car is off, so it keeps putting fuel in the carb as it is boiling off, until the engine and carb cool down. I'm kidding of course ...
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Re: gas percolating issues
[Re: JohnRR]
#1431293
05/07/13 11:18 AM
05/07/13 11:18 AM
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 965
S.W. Pennsylvania
markrr
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 965
S.W. Pennsylvania
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
As I understand it, the Road Runner is likely a factory appearing car and you prefer to keep it that way?
I was thinking that some sort of return line may help. Something designed to keep fresh fuel in a loop instead of heated fuel just sitting in the fuel bowls. I'm not sure of how you'd do it though.
Jeff
That will help when driving, I know of one member that has/had a fuel perk issue while running once everything got hot , but that's not going to do anything for most people problems ... gas boiling off after shutdown.
So running a return line from a fuel seperator between the pump and carb to the tank will not improve starting after the engine is off?
I was planning on trying this soon.
I don't see how it would, it's not going to do anything to make the engine, and carb, cooler whether the engine is running or not.
Now if you leave an electric fuel pump running while the car is off, so it keeps putting fuel in the carb as it is boiling off, until the engine and carb cool down. I'm kidding of course ...
Interesting. I never thought about it this way. 
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Re: gas percolating issues
[Re: markrr]
#1431294
05/07/13 11:29 AM
05/07/13 11:29 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,098
A Banana Republic near you.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,098
A Banana Republic near you.
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
As I understand it, the Road Runner is likely a factory appearing car and you prefer to keep it that way?
I was thinking that some sort of return line may help. Something designed to keep fresh fuel in a loop instead of heated fuel just sitting in the fuel bowls. I'm not sure of how you'd do it though.
Jeff
That will help when driving, I know of one member that has/had a fuel perk issue while running once everything got hot , but that's not going to do anything for most people problems ... gas boiling off after shutdown.
So running a return line from a fuel seperator between the pump and carb to the tank will not improve starting after the engine is off?
I was planning on trying this soon.
I don't see how it would, it's not going to do anything to make the engine, and carb, cooler whether the engine is running or not.
Now if you leave an electric fuel pump running while the car is off, so it keeps putting fuel in the carb as it is boiling off, until the engine and carb cool down. I'm kidding of course ...
Interesting. I never thought about it this way.
Think about it, the issue is how the fuel reacts to the hot engine, and hot carb, that has fuel bowls open to the atmosphere. If there was a way to get the carb to always be say 75* then you won't have a problem.
Now if you cut a hole in your hood and mounted the carb to a phenolic spacer that put the carb and the air cleaner outside the engine compartment ...
kidding again ... 
The fix is an electric fuel pump with a return regulator , fuel will be cooler because it's always flowing back to the tank , and you flip the switch to fill the fuel bowls before starting it.
Or switch to fuel injection which basically does the same thing , the fuel pump turnns on to charge the lines and there is a return regulator in the syatem to keep the fuel always moving and dumping the excess back to the tank.
Or find non ethanol fuel ...
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Re: gas percolating issues
[Re: JohnRR]
#1431295
05/07/13 12:07 PM
05/07/13 12:07 PM
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 965
S.W. Pennsylvania
markrr
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 965
S.W. Pennsylvania
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
As I understand it, the Road Runner is likely a factory appearing car and you prefer to keep it that way?
I was thinking that some sort of return line may help. Something designed to keep fresh fuel in a loop instead of heated fuel just sitting in the fuel bowls. I'm not sure of how you'd do it though.
Jeff
That will help when driving, I know of one member that has/had a fuel perk issue while running once everything got hot , but that's not going to do anything for most people problems ... gas boiling off after shutdown.
So running a return line from a fuel seperator between the pump and carb to the tank will not improve starting after the engine is off?
I was planning on trying this soon.
I don't see how it would, it's not going to do anything to make the engine, and carb, cooler whether the engine is running or not.
Now if you leave an electric fuel pump running while the car is off, so it keeps putting fuel in the carb as it is boiling off, until the engine and carb cool down. I'm kidding of course ...
Interesting. I never thought about it this way.
Think about it, the issue is how the fuel reacts to the hot engine, and hot carb, that has fuel bowls open to the atmosphere. If there was a way to get the carb to always be say 75* then you won't have a problem.
Now if you cut a hole in your hood and mounted the carb to a phenolic spacer that put the carb and the air cleaner outside the engine compartment ...
kidding again ...
The fix is an electric fuel pump with a return regulator , fuel will be cooler because it's always flowing back to the tank , and you flip the switch to fill the fuel bowls before starting it.
Or switch to fuel injection which basically does the same thing , the fuel pump turnns on to charge the lines and there is a return regulator in the syatem to keep the fuel always moving and dumping the excess back to the tank.
Or find non ethanol fuel ...
I understand what you're saying and agree.
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Re: gas percolating issues
[Re: markrr]
#1431296
05/07/13 07:31 PM
05/07/13 07:31 PM
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,179
California
mickm
OP
master
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Posts: 4,179
California
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i'm going to try the gaskets i get from edelbrock. they were only $15 each, so not bad. if it doesn't to the trick, not sure what i'll do as i can't see anything that wouldn't mean heavy mods to all my existing stuff.
and yes, i do want to keep it stock appearing.
interesting thing though, this didn't happen on my old engine, which besides the internal components was almost exactly the same: iron block, aluminum heads, same headers, carbs and manifold.
the only difference...
the old engine had a vapor separator with a return line to the tank, and this one just has a regular fuel filter....
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Re: gas percolating issues
[Re: mickm]
#1431298
05/07/13 11:29 PM
05/07/13 11:29 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,098
A Banana Republic near you.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,098
A Banana Republic near you.
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Quote:
interesting thing though, this didn't happen on my old engine, which besides the internal components was almost exactly the same: iron block, aluminum heads, same headers, carbs and manifold.
the only difference...
the old engine had a vapor separator with a return line to the tank, and this one just has a regular fuel filter....
Why did you remove the vapor separator then? I'd be putting that back first.
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Re: gas percolating issues
[Re: JohnRR]
#1431301
05/14/13 02:31 AM
05/14/13 02:31 AM
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,179
California
mickm
OP
master
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Joined: Jul 2006
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California
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Quote:
Why did you remove the vapor separator then? I'd be putting that back first.
don't have a direct answer to that question. i have to elimatnate things one at a time though, so i will try that in one of the first rounds.
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Re: gas percolating issues
[Re: Jjs72D]
#1431303
05/14/13 08:59 PM
05/14/13 08:59 PM
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,179
California
mickm
OP
master
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,179
California
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Quote:
How did you do to and from Van Nuys? With temps running at and above 100 degrees, I'm curious if you had more trouble.
engine ran great, and the problems with starting and sometimes idling was a little worse, even though the engine didn't over heat or anything.
i got the gaskets from edelbrock, and they are much thicker than i thought, so i'm not going to use them. they list another set that is .125, and also listed for heat issues, so i may give those a try.
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Re: gas percolating issues
[Re: JohnRR]
#1431304
05/14/13 10:03 PM
05/14/13 10:03 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 28,312
Cincinnati, Ohio
Challenger 1
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 28,312
Cincinnati, Ohio
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Quote:
Quote:
interesting thing though, this didn't happen on my old engine, which besides the internal components was almost exactly the same: iron block, aluminum heads, same headers, carbs and manifold.
the only difference...
the old engine had a vapor separator with a return line to the tank, and this one just has a regular fuel filter....
Why did you remove the vapor separator then? I'd be putting that back first.
Ummm yea.
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Re: gas percolating issues
[Re: Challenger 1]
#1431305
05/15/13 01:15 PM
05/15/13 01:15 PM
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,179
California
mickm
OP
master
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OP
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,179
California
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
interesting thing though, this didn't happen on my old engine, which besides the internal components was almost exactly the same: iron block, aluminum heads, same headers, carbs and manifold.
the only difference...
the old engine had a vapor separator with a return line to the tank, and this one just has a regular fuel filter....
Why did you remove the vapor separator then? I'd be putting that back first.
Ummm yea.
i was under the impression the the separator doesn't make a very good filter. is that not the case?
anyway, how could that affect a percolating issue? gas is percolating in the fuel bowls, a long way from the separator.
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Re: gas percolating issues
[Re: mickm]
#1431306
05/15/13 01:29 PM
05/15/13 01:29 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 28,312
Cincinnati, Ohio
Challenger 1
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 28,312
Cincinnati, Ohio
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
interesting thing though, this didn't happen on my old engine, which besides the internal components was almost exactly the same: iron block, aluminum heads, same headers, carbs and manifold.
the only difference...
the old engine had a vapor separator with a return line to the tank, and this one just has a regular fuel filter....
Why did you remove the vapor separator then? I'd be putting that back first.
Ummm yea.
i was under the impression the the separator doesn't make a very good filter. is that not the case?
anyway, how could that affect a percolating issue? gas is percolating in the fuel bowls, a long way from the separator.
I use them on both my cars and drive them a lot during the hot weather with no other filters. Returning the extra gas does help the fuel pump do it's job easier and push fuel up into the carb so it will restart when it real hot.
I have been using them for 7 years now and have driven in many extreme conditions with no problem.
I idled last week for a hour at a time cruising Daytona beach on the sand and on the streets under 10 mph for over hour easy 5 days in a row. Also Myrtle beach on the streets at near idle for well over a hour at a time all last week. And I was burning 10% ethanol fuel that I bought at the pumps down there. They work I'm here to tell you.
I drove for miles on the beach and in town at idle, my motor is also tuned pretty close because it never get's hot.
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Re: gas percolating issues
[Re: Challenger 1]
#1431307
05/15/13 02:00 PM
05/15/13 02:00 PM
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,179
California
mickm
OP
master
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OP
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,179
California
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Quote:
I use them on both my cars and drive them a lot during the hot weather with no other filters. Returning the extra gas does help the fuel pump do it's job easier and push fuel up into the carb so it will restart when it real hot.
what do you mean, you use them both? a filter and a separator?
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Re: gas percolating issues
[Re: mickm]
#1431308
05/15/13 03:11 PM
05/15/13 03:11 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 28,312
Cincinnati, Ohio
Challenger 1
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 28,312
Cincinnati, Ohio
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Quote:
Quote:
I use them on both my cars and drive them a lot during the hot weather with no other filters. Returning the extra gas does help the fuel pump do it's job easier and push fuel up into the carb so it will restart when it real hot.
what do you mean, you use them both? a filter and a separator?
No I only use the separator only.
I see no real problem with running a filter between the separator and your carb(s) except they act as heak sink imo, that's why I don't run one up by my motor.
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Re: gas percolating issues
[Re: Challenger 1]
#1431309
05/15/13 03:18 PM
05/15/13 03:18 PM
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,179
California
mickm
OP
master
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OP
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Joined: Jul 2006
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Quote:
No I only use the separator only.
I see no real problem with running a filter between the separator and your carb(s) except they act as heak sink imo, that's why I don't run one up by my motor.
i will give it a try and see if it changes anything.
i'm running 5/16" line from the pump to the carbs, but may need to put 3/8" from the pump to the T. guess i'll just need to play around with it and see what works.
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Re: gas percolating issues
[Re: mickm]
#1431310
05/15/13 03:29 PM
05/15/13 03:29 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 28,312
Cincinnati, Ohio
Challenger 1
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
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Cincinnati, Ohio
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I'm sure 5/16" is enough for street strip car between the pump and carbs, imo. It's how hard the pump has to work to suck the gas, so a larger 3/8" is best to feed the pump and 5/16 out is perfect. Here's my 340 that I always talk about. Nothing fancy and has been like this since like 2005. I did replace all the rubber hoses last summer and there is a #57 carb jet in my return line to insure I don't return too much fuel. Been working real good for me. Up until last summer the car had 5/16" suction line on it. I installed new 3/8 suction/vent lines with a hemi/440-6 return through the sending unit last summer. Before that I used a homemade line to the sending unit. Now I have the complete 4 piece hemi line setup on my little 340 car.  Oh yea the fuel pump is nothing special either and has been dead reliable. I imagine some are saying "sure if you want to idle around forever". I drove it at over 100 mph-4800-5800 rpm for like 5-6 miles at a time out at Bonneville in Utah. I kept trying to run it out of gas and I never could. It pulled and pulled. And it still had the original 5/16 suction line on it then.
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