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Re: Need advice 340 vs 360 in A body
[Re: sixpackbee]
#137693
10/17/08 10:55 AM
10/17/08 10:55 AM
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 15,134
Kelowna, B.C. Canada
DPelletier
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 15,134
Kelowna, B.C. Canada
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Internal kinematics, huh? I read an interesting dyno test a while back whereby they tested identical builds, one with a shorter stroke and bigger bore and one with a longer stroke and smaller bore (they were BBC's IIRC) and the result was: No appreciable difference. They were attempting to debunk the theory that short stroke motors make more HP and long stroke motors make more torque. I think they succeeded. Obviously there are potential valve shrouding issues and POTENTIALLY heavier reciprocating assy's with longer stroke motors, but for the sake of 360's vs. 340's, I'm gonna side with the 360. With IDENTICAL builds, any small advantage in geometry is going to be more than negated by the 360's 20 extra cubic inches. .....as a previous poster said; if the 360 was introduced from the factory built identically to the earlier 340, people's opinions of 360's would be far different today.  Dave
1970 Super Bee 440 Six Pack
1974 'Cuda
2008 Ram 3500 Diesel
2006 Ram 3500 Diesel
2004.5 Ram 2500 Diesel
2003 Ram 3500 Diesel
2006 Durango Limited
[url] http://1970superbee.piczo.com [/url]
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Re: Need advice 340 vs 360 in A body
[Re: DPelletier]
#137694
10/17/08 11:22 AM
10/17/08 11:22 AM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 4,204
Fort Worth, TX
Clair_Davis
master
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master
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 4,204
Fort Worth, TX
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When push comes to shove, the 360 is only 5.88% larger than a 340, so they're essentially equal if they're both operating at a given VE. Now, the more power a package makes, the bigger that 5.88% becomes. With the same cam & upper end on both engines, the 360 will probably peak at a marginally lower RPM, but output will reflect the extra cubes. That's 23.5 free HP on a 400HP package.
Clair
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Re: Need advice 340 vs 360 in A body
[Re: Clair_Davis]
#137695
10/17/08 12:12 PM
10/17/08 12:12 PM
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 15,134
Kelowna, B.C. Canada
DPelletier
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 15,134
Kelowna, B.C. Canada
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Quote:
When push comes to shove, the 360 is only 5.88% larger than a 340, so they're essentially equal if they're both operating at a given VE. Now, the more power a package makes, the bigger that 5.88% becomes. With the same cam & upper end on both engines, the 360 will probably peak at a marginally lower RPM, but output will reflect the extra cubes. That's 23.5 free HP on a 400HP package.
Clair
I'm a little confused as your post seems to be saying on one hand the 5.588% isn't significant, but on the other hand it'll make more power because of the 20 extra cubes. 
Bottom line for me is that 20 extra cubes is 20 extra cubes and as you say, that's 23hp on a 400hp engine......all from a core that cost significantly less to buy in the first place. Seems like a no-brainer to me unless you already have a 340 or it's a legitimate 340 car and you're concerned about originality.
Dave
1970 Super Bee 440 Six Pack
1974 'Cuda
2008 Ram 3500 Diesel
2006 Ram 3500 Diesel
2004.5 Ram 2500 Diesel
2003 Ram 3500 Diesel
2006 Durango Limited
[url] http://1970superbee.piczo.com [/url]
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Re: Need advice 340 vs 360 in A body
[Re: 4BBodies]
#137697
10/17/08 02:27 PM
10/17/08 02:27 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,244
Canada
Kam*Kuda
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,244
Canada
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It looks like some decent 408's for sale in the For sale section here on moparts
1970 Barracuda Convertible
1968 Satellite Street Strip car
1654.5 Mustang
1955 Land Rover
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Re: Need advice 340 vs 360 in A body
[Re: DPelletier]
#137698
10/17/08 04:09 PM
10/17/08 04:09 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 4,204
Fort Worth, TX
Clair_Davis
master
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master
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 4,204
Fort Worth, TX
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Dave, you're right, what I said could be taken either way. Of course if 20hp isn't a big deal, then so be it. Folks running manifolds vs. headers leave that on the table every day. HOWEVER, to get to the point, I say run what you have. If you gots nothin', go get a 360. If my Barracuda project didn't come with a 340, I wouldn't have gone out of my way to get one for my Valiant. Built equally, the 360 is almost certainly going to come out on top every time.
Clair
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Re: Need advice 340 vs 360 in A body
[Re: Clair_Davis]
#137700
10/17/08 05:53 PM
10/17/08 05:53 PM
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 15,134
Kelowna, B.C. Canada
DPelletier
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 15,134
Kelowna, B.C. Canada
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Quote:
Dave, you're right, what I said could be taken either way. Of course if 20hp isn't a big deal, then so be it. Folks running manifolds vs. headers leave that on the table every day. HOWEVER, to get to the point, I say run what you have. If you gots nothin', go get a 360. If my Barracuda project didn't come with a 340, I wouldn't have gone out of my way to get one for my Valiant. Built equally, the 360 is almost certainly going to come out on top every time.
Clair
I can agree with all of that
Dave
1970 Super Bee 440 Six Pack
1974 'Cuda
2008 Ram 3500 Diesel
2006 Ram 3500 Diesel
2004.5 Ram 2500 Diesel
2003 Ram 3500 Diesel
2006 Durango Limited
[url] http://1970superbee.piczo.com [/url]
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Re: Need advice 340 vs 360 in A body
[Re: DPelletier]
#137701
10/17/08 06:44 PM
10/17/08 06:44 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,041
Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
Circle Track
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Circle Track
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,041
Lincoln Nebraska
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360 here. 20 more cubes, MUCH cheaper block. I would use magnum heads, KB pistons(for mag heads) in your desired CR & achieve .035-.040 quench.
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Need advice 340 vs 360 in A body
[Re: Mr T2U]
#137704
10/18/08 09:15 PM
10/18/08 09:15 PM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889
up yours
Supercuda
About to go away
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About to go away
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889
up yours
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Quote:
 on the 360. i don't know a lot about small blocks and A bodies so i don't know how much work it would be.
but with a 360 you can buy a newer motor from a modern car.
No, you can't. Chrysler never put a "modern" 360 in a car, just trucks.
Quote:
you can have fuel injection, much better drivability and better mpg, serpentine fan belt, and modern alternator. without that much hassles and extra expense other than some wiring mods.
Hmm, on what do you base this claim? Chrysler's FI setup is weak, at best. Almost impossible to modify cheaply, nothing like the aftermarket support GM and Ford setups have. Stock Fi will NOT have better mileage, not by a long shot. Driveability is hit or miss withte stock beer barrel intake. As for a modern alternator, so what. You can easily buy any number of bracket kits to put one on a small block, or you can dig around the yards for a late Diplomat with the Nippon Denso setup, think cop car here.
As for serpentine belt setup, I'll pass. I've had more than one eat it's belt, usually because the idler siezed up, then you lose everything. If my multiple belt setup loses one belt I can make it home. An old pair of panty hose will work as an emergency belt, can't do that with a serpentine setup.
They say there are no such thing as a stupid question.
They say there is always the exception that proves the rule.
Don't be the exception.
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