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Re: Borgeson steering box install by Rick Ehernberg
[Re: ScottSmith_Harms]
#1357991
12/26/12 08:51 PM
12/26/12 08:51 PM
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 3,456
Fly Over States
PHJ426
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 3,456
Fly Over States
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From the article it appears Rick has shed some light on how to make this product better by: A. Showing them where the box needs to be clearanced to fit all the Mopar K frames. B. How to build a pot coupling box instead of using the U joint. C. Coaxing them into making adapter fittings for the box so factory Mopar hoses fit. Why is everyone so cranked up about a modification being truly "bolt in" heck even them Chinese crankshafts from some vendors require machining to fit in your Factory Mopar blocks.   And welding a K frame requires welding 
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Re: Borgeson steering box install by Rick Ehernberg
[Re: 1_WILD_RT]
#1357994
12/27/12 05:53 AM
12/27/12 05:53 AM
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 2,128
sweden
sshemi
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 2,128
sweden
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Quote:
My Borgeson box in my Falcon requires similar mods & while it uses a much better box than the OE unit it doesn't use as good of a box as the Mopar offering... If you actually drive you car you get more information feed to you by the steering box than virtually an other component... If you want the best driving experience it's worth it to step up..... 
Thats what i was thinking too + its lighter than stock.
I guess what i am most upset with is the adapter fittings i bought together with the box that i can now throw in the trash can.
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Re: Borgeson steering box install by Rick Ehernberg
[Re: Mopar Mitch]
#1357995
12/27/12 09:49 PM
12/27/12 09:49 PM
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,491
Lethbridge, AB, Canada
dangina
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,491
Lethbridge, AB, Canada
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Quote:
current issue..
i went to the store and picked up the current issue of ma and i don't see any article on installing this box
on the cover it says million dollar beeper with a 69 runner on the front , Feb 2013
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Re: Borgeson steering box install by Rick Ehernberg
[Re: dangina]
#1357996
12/27/12 10:37 PM
12/27/12 10:37 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,704
MICHIGAN
DynoDave
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,704
MICHIGAN
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Quote:
Quote:
current issue..
i went to the store and picked up the current issue of ma and i don't see any article on installing this box
on the cover it says million dollar beeper with a 69 runner on the front , Feb 2013
Your store is an issue behind. "Current" is the April 2013 issue, with a Petty blue '71 Plymouth Superbird creation on the cover.
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Re: Borgeson steering box install by Rick Ehernberg
[Re: cogen80]
#1357998
12/28/12 02:03 AM
12/28/12 02:03 AM
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 18,493
Granite Bay CA
Kern Dog
Striving for excellence
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Striving for excellence
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 18,493
Granite Bay CA
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Quote:
i don't see what the big deal is about cutting your column? but i also don't know why they couldn't have made a plug and play type of thing either. seriously how hard could that have been?
Cutting the column?
SOME of us have one year only steering columns...1970 B body A/T type. If I screwed mine up I'd be stranded for awhile looking for another, which certainly means spending mucho Dinero.
This is a situation where price is proportionate to ease of assembly. If it were only $200, you'd be an idiot to complain about having to modify things a bit. Ramp that price to $500 or more, then things had better fit right and work properly.
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Re: Borgeson steering box install by Rick Ehernberg
[Re: 1_WILD_RT]
#1358001
12/28/12 03:21 AM
12/28/12 03:21 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 42,714
Spokane Washington
ScottSmith_Harms
Mr Wizzard
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Mr Wizzard
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 42,714
Spokane Washington
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Quote:
Yup.. Nobody seems to realize the lower shaft can be swapped from quite a few other cars & since you modding the one for the Borgeson you might as well swap the lower shaft before you cut it...
Yes, they are interchangable, however if Borgenson would just supply a proper coupler in the first place tearing into the steering column wouldn't be neccessary at all which relates to my initial comments.
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Re: Borgeson steering box install by Rick Ehernberg
[Re: 1_WILD_RT]
#1358003
12/28/12 01:49 PM
12/28/12 01:49 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 42,714
Spokane Washington
ScottSmith_Harms
Mr Wizzard
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Mr Wizzard
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 42,714
Spokane Washington
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Quote:
I agree it would be great if they offered a OE style coupler as an option but when you realize how limited the market is & the expense of a part like the coupler body which requires quite a few machining steps then needs to be hardened to a proper level...
I'm not thrilled with the idea that any length variation is shifted from the coupler to the collapsing slip joint
I'm not so sure the market is all that limitted, in fact I think it's a good sized niche they could fill if they went about offering a COMPLETE product along with the right marketing effort to raise awareness. They don't strike me as a company that can't afford to do them right if they so choose, I feel pretty comfortable that even if it hurt a little they could do it if they wanted to and still keep the doors open. Doing something the right way isn't usually cheap or easy, but the rewards are also likely to be better if it's done right.
*On a side note: I always get a kick out of comments from companies who come to market with a poorly done product for a specific niche and then drop it after a while saying they don't make the product anymore because the demand was too low from (Insert market niche name here). They never want to accept the blame for producing a part that wasn't accepted by the target buying audiance that was actually due to the short commings of thier offering.
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Re: Borgeson steering box install by Rick Ehernberg
[Re: ScottSmith_Harms]
#1358004
12/28/12 02:29 PM
12/28/12 02:29 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 27,347
Today? Who Knows?
1_WILD_RT
Management Trainee
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Management Trainee
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 27,347
Today? Who Knows?
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Yet Mike Ross has made a number of expensive parts with allot of $$ invested only to find the market won't support a high quality reproduction part....
They've provided the basis of a much needed upgrade, If you feel the market will support a custom coupler make it & see how it sells...
"The Armies of our ancestors were lucky, in that they were not trailed by a second army of pencil pushers."
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Re: Borgeson steering box install by Rick Ehernberg
[Re: 1_WILD_RT]
#1358005
12/28/12 02:51 PM
12/28/12 02:51 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 42,714
Spokane Washington
ScottSmith_Harms
Mr Wizzard
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Mr Wizzard
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 42,714
Spokane Washington
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Quote:
Yet Mike Ross has made a number of expensive parts with allot of $$ invested only to find the market won't support a high quality reproduction part....
Mike and I talk often, I don't think that statement is entirely true. Probably more of a case of there weren't enough cars remaining to be restored that still needed said parts than the quality or the $ invested in the parts, that combined with the poor economy and slowing musclecar market trending towards fewer nut and bolt restorations that might use said parts over cheaper or used parts alternatives.
Quote:
They've provided the basis of a much needed upgrade
I agree, a basis, now finish the job!
Quote:
If you feel the market will support a custom coupler make it & see how it sells...
Yes, I think THEY should, that and grind the boxes so they fit without further mods. 
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Re: Borgeson steering box install by Rick Ehernberg
[Re: ScottSmith_Harms]
#1358006
12/28/12 10:54 PM
12/28/12 10:54 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,394
Pikes Peak Country
TC@HP2
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,394
Pikes Peak Country
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Quote:
I'm not so sure the market is all that limitted, in fact I think it's a good sized niche they could fill if they went about offering a COMPLETE product along with the right marketing effort to raise awareness.
I dunno. Mopar buyers are automatically at a 4:1 disadvantage compared to Chevy or Ford potential sales market. Once you can actually penetrate the mopar market, it is populated predominately of drag racing and restoration activities. This box is heavier than drag racers want and it is no where near correct for the resto crowd.
It took how many years of prodding to have this forum spun off from moparts general menu? Despite that, there are still only 37 members who have logged their combinations and I know four of those are mine. Compare that to the e.t. bracket list of fastest cars on moparts with hundreds of entries, and you could say we are a niche of the niche of the niche. Handling mopars are a very, very, small segment of the market.
They are so small in fact, that the Goodguys organization jokes about creating a bounty for mopars to show up at their autocross events because the turn out is so small. To put that in to a perspective, a vendor will sell 16 boxes to other guys for every one mopar box that is sold. Sure, maybe they could sell one additional unit if it was completely engineered as a turn key deal, but again, they don't seem to be pursuing that market segment. IMO, this is more of a situation where they look at fitting mopars as a by product of their production, not a target of the production, therefore they see no value in engineering additional components to reach one additional sale for every 16 they make with practically no effort.
Borgeson reps feel free to dissect this view and prove me wrong by providing market research numbers. If you're doing product planning, you will have these numbers.
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Re: Borgeson steering box install by Rick Ehernberg
[Re: ScottSmith_Harms]
#1358007
12/29/12 12:29 AM
12/29/12 12:29 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,002
Long Island, NY
shakerjoe
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,002
Long Island, NY
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I for one, would be more inclined to spend the money/my money, on a completely engineered kit ready to install with all parts required and included - than to cut/hack/weld - I don't own a welder so I'd have to bring to someone to do it - hopefully correctly - the first time - so I could complete the install. I think if a company wants to bring a product to market to sell, the "kinks or bugs" should be as worked out as possible - whether it be for A,B,C or E body or whatever - they are charging a premium price and I wouldn't argue they don't deserve the money for a premium product, but I just don't think selling it - for me anyway - that I should have to do the involved labor to get it to work is right - charge a few more bucks if you have to so as it works the first time out of the box for the installer; not all of us have the means or funds to go to the well twice or more to get it right and have a product they can enjoy on install. I've been thinking of a FF3 kit for my project - more weight, less money - but is a straight up install as far as I know...my
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Re: Borgeson steering box install by Rick Ehernberg
[Re: sshemi]
#1358009
12/29/12 02:01 AM
12/29/12 02:01 AM
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,491
Lethbridge, AB, Canada
dangina
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,491
Lethbridge, AB, Canada
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Quote:
Thats what i was thinking too + its lighter than stock.
I guess what i am most upset with is the adapter fittings i bought together with the box that i can now throw in the trash can.
why is this? sorry i dont have the article. dont you need to buy the coupler with the box?
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