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Re: 69 Charger Resto Mod. Rear Suspension choices [Re: Keith BlackĀ®] #1350709
12/15/12 03:59 PM
12/15/12 03:59 PM
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Couple of pics

Re: 69 Charger Resto Mod. Rear Suspension choices [Re: 440PURSUIT] #1350710
12/15/12 04:57 PM
12/15/12 04:57 PM
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Quote:

Anyone use the Magnum Force 4 link?

The lower arms are inside the stock frame rails which is nice unlike some others.

I will call Art Morrison on Monday.




The narrower the control arm spacing the more leverage effect wheel movement will have. Much like bracing yourself, a wider stance is a stabler one. The only benefit to having the arms inside the frame rails might be tire clearance.

While I admit I haven't looked at the Morrison stuff lately, my opinion of what I have seen is that it is more drag race oriented and not handling oriented. I assume you are looking for handling being that you posted here.


They say there are no such thing as a stupid question.
They say there is always the exception that proves the rule.
Don't be the exception.
Re: 69 Charger Resto Mod. Rear Suspension choices [Re: 440PURSUIT] #1350711
12/15/12 08:46 PM
12/15/12 08:46 PM
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Santa Fe Springs, CA
Dan@Hotchkis Offline
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Quote:

Couple of pics




That is cool! Petty used to use UCA bushings to mount his motor plates.

Re: 69 Charger Resto Mod. Rear Suspension choices [Re: 440PURSUIT] #1350712
12/16/12 11:59 AM
12/16/12 11:59 AM
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http://musclecarrestorations.com/feature/68chargerprostreet.html

Good pics on buildup. Old build 2007.

anyone know what these wheels are?

These are cool , too on the Challenger....

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php?topic=87545.50

Re: 69 Charger Resto Mod. Rear Suspension choices [Re: 440PURSUIT] #1350713
12/16/12 12:10 PM
12/16/12 12:10 PM
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Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
Mr.Yuck Offline
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rear wheels look STUUUUUUPID. not enough tire. You can have good handling w/ some side wall. I like the style, just not the tire choice on the Charger. The Chaley..not so much. something like these would look good.
Summit Racing® Series 431 Hustler Black Wheels SUM-431-8866B35 or if you like chrome... Summit Racing® Series 431 Hustler Chrome Wheels SUM-431-8866C35
and dang $102 each??? Wish I had something that needed wheels.

7505287-2a.jpg (353 downloads)

[IMG]http://i66.tinypic.com/pui5j.jpg[/IMG]
Coming soon!!!!
update [Re: 440PURSUIT] #1350714
12/18/12 01:29 PM
12/18/12 01:29 PM
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Morrison makes a triangulated 4 bar with an entire subframe. This comes with Shocks, sway bar and rear end housing (9") for $3650. Its a nicely engineered unit.
My chassis guy (Ed Lapadura, Boots Performance) says we can build it for less. This would allow me to keep more stock sheet metal, trunk/wheel well, rear passenger floor than with the aftermarket.

I want to keep my Dana 60, too, as this is a Mopar.

I will have over 16" of wheel well to accommodate. also a Diameter of up to 29".
This leaves tire choice up to cost as its a wear item. A 315/35/ZR20 is about $450 from Tire rack. it is 28.7 in Diameter. I may prefer a little taller sidewall so 18/19" rims are an option.

I will have to consider wheels quality of construction since existing engine dyno'd at 650 and I am running a stick.
Jeff, I'll look at the construction of the Summit rims. Seems like Forgeline/Budnik/Billet specialties have some nice options.

Re: update [Re: 440PURSUIT] #1350715
12/23/12 11:04 PM
12/23/12 11:04 PM
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Deciding on the setup took a bit, but its getting clearer now. Morrison stuff requires full back half and refabbing all trunk metal. I have already redone the trunk, so that would be wasteful.

We can use the RMS or Chassis Works 4 bar rear (recommendations?). The bar type trailing arm will allow up to a 13.5 cross section tire with only a reworked wheel tub. Most production tires in 20" are no more than 12.5" cross section. Wheel size selection and rear width is a matter of doing the math.

It seems this will go quicker than anticipated.

The Magnum Force Front end has Mustang II spindles. Any recommendations on who can supply the best value for 13" from brakes?
We need to mock up a wheel to determine backspace.

Looks like we will progress!

Re: update [Re: 440PURSUIT] #1350716
12/24/12 12:21 PM
12/24/12 12:21 PM
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St. Louis, MO
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You sure your going Magnum Force? If sticking with stock Doctor Diff has what I believe to be the best 13" setup. It uses the viper calipers and the srt8 13" rotors. Not sure if its available just yet but it should be close if it's not.

My 2 cents on a rear 4 bar is RMS.

Damon

Re: update [Re: mopardamo] #1350717
12/24/12 01:43 PM
12/24/12 01:43 PM
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already have the MF front end.

I liked RMS site stating I can use spring relocate position t gain tire clearance. Can use tank and exhaust, too.

RMS vs Unlawful [Re: 440PURSUIT] #1350718
12/29/12 01:28 AM
12/29/12 01:28 AM
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Checking these 2 out. Can anyone offer additional comparison?

The Unlawful has a larger cage for upper control arm and rear shock location. It requires stock chassis shock mounting cross memeber be removed. This one seems stout and comes with a sway bar. Shocks mounted rear of differential.

RMS Street Lynx has a Single cross member for upper trailing arms shared with the shock mount ahead of differential. It seems easy locate on the existing rebound bumper mounts. Shock position ahead of Diff should absorb more of the pinion movement.

Both have lower trailing arm mounts via U-bolts at diff and are mounted in the stock leaf spring front hanger mounts. RMS said that I can simply use a Spring relocate to frame rail and move lower arms inward to allow use of full wheel tub. Even with stock lower arm positon I have 13.5" of total clearance from Wheel lip to training arm.

I guess either would allow the car to be lowered or raised via the adjustable coil over.. ???

RMS claims swaybar only a value in Drag Racing...

Re: RMS vs Unlawful [Re: 440PURSUIT] #1350719
12/29/12 08:09 AM
12/29/12 08:09 AM
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QLD Australia
Keith BlackĀ® Offline
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Chris , I can only speak for the unlawful system ( I have loaded lots of pics of the install under the readers rides section here ) , but the system is well engineered, strong and highly adjustable. I have 345' tires in there with room to move.
The guys at unlawful we're super helpful as well.

Good luck with your choice. Cheers , Darren


--------------------------------
Darren Beale
Keith Black Racing EnginesĀ®
Re: update [Re: 440PURSUIT] #1350720
12/29/12 09:35 AM
12/29/12 09:35 AM
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Berlin, N.J.
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Quote:

already have the MF front end.

I liked RMS site stating I can use spring relocate position t gain tire clearance. Can use tank and exhaust, too.





using the RMS streey lynx on an abody with a 8 3/4 rear (not sure about a dana) you can run a stock gas tank and tti tail pipes. would imagine the b and e bodies have even more room. give bill a call and he will know for sure.

should sell that magnumforce stuff and go all RMS. you won't be sorry.


It's better to keep your mouth shut and give the impression that you're stupid than to open it and remove all doubt.

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Re: update [Re: abodyjoe] #1350721
12/29/12 01:50 PM
12/29/12 01:50 PM
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Darren,
The big Viper tires are very cool.
So only wheel tub mods allow it to fit?
It seems I would only have 13.5 from inner wheel opening lip to trailing arm bar.
What is your axle flange width and wheel backspace?

RMS still an option since tire selection won't change.

Re: update [Re: 440PURSUIT] #1350722
12/29/12 06:15 PM
12/29/12 06:15 PM
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QLD Australia
Keith BlackĀ® Offline
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Quote:

Darren,
The big Viper tires are very cool.
So only wheel tub mods allow it to fit?
It seems I would only have 13.5 from inner wheel opening lip to trailing arm bar.
What is your axle flange width and wheel backspace?

RMS still an option since tire selection won't change.




We widened the wheel tubs level with the outer frame rail ( probably what most people do ), the flange to flange measurements are stock. I'll have to recheck the back spacing but I could go 1 inch wider each side ( outside offset ) if I wanted ... And probably will.
In theory you could run 14.5in each side, but its close on the inside to the lower arm.

I modified my setup to lower the car substantially, but as it comes it should be pretty good. Not sure about standard exhaust , again I run a 3-1/2in highly customised system over the axle with additional mufflers under the rear extension panels so my setup is unique.

Based on my experience with all this stuff, and others will likely differ, just about anything like this you chose to do will require some unexpected work you didn't originally plan for. Laws of the universe!



--------------------------------
Darren Beale
Keith Black Racing EnginesĀ®
Re: update [Re: Keith BlackĀ®] #1350723
12/29/12 06:31 PM
12/29/12 06:31 PM
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I understand what im into Chassis builder has alot of experience.

With the large 345 what size brake is necessary? Lotta weight when increasing wheel/tire size. I guess no less than 13" to fill up large rim, too.

Re: update [Re: 440PURSUIT] #1350724
12/30/12 02:26 AM
12/30/12 02:26 AM
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Keith BlackĀ® Offline
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Quote:

I understand what im into Chassis builder has alot of experience.

With the large 345 what size brake is necessary? Lotta weight when increasing wheel/tire size. I guess no less than 13" to fill up large rim, too.




I guess you could run any size ( dia ) you like, you're really only limited by the inside diameter of the wheel & calliper clearance. So smaller brakes are a possibility.
I went for 14.25 in rear disc 's which match the front .. because they look better. I'm running 4 piston calipers on the rear.


--------------------------------
Darren Beale
Keith Black Racing EnginesĀ®
Re: 69 Charger Resto Mod. Rear Suspension choices [Re: 440PURSUIT] #1350725
12/30/12 02:25 PM
12/30/12 02:25 PM
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Coram, NY
Pool Fixer Offline
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Quote:

Please advise on Wheel manufacturers where I may find an appropriate product.

Thanks




It depends on what you are looking for in a wheel. I'm not against cheap wheels at all. I run cheap wheels, these cheap wheels:
Coys C57

The summit wheels mentioned seem like a great deal but I don't like the backspacing on those and unlike 2 and 3 piece or custom wheels, you can't just change it on the cheapies...you could use spacers but even if they were in the right spot in the wheel well they would look like poo with barely any lip showing. the summit wheels look like they are more targeted at modern muscle like mustangs/camaros/challengers where the track of the car is much wider relative to the outer sheetmetal.

On the hotchkis rear springs, at least on a 68 charger, you will have to clearance the weird bulge on the outer wheelhouse. hard to explain but it's there. I run the hotchkis springs w/a 295/45/18 tire on an 18x9.5 wheel with 5" backspace. This puts the wheel about 1/4" more "in" than i'd like it and it still rubbed just a bit. I suppose a 40 series tire might have done the trick but I wanted big wheels with some respectable sidewall. Go figure I still get killed on here by the dog dish hubcap boys club lol. They even venture into the handling section to denounce the blasphemy once in a while

I have the pass side wheel well modified, but we are talking a 3" wide x maybe 10-11" long section cut out and a patch in it's place that follows the natural curve of the wheel well. The drivers side is unmodified. Pass side has zero issues, drivers rubs just a bit and not all the time.

Re: 69 Charger Resto Mod. Rear Suspension choices [Re: Pool Fixer] #1350726
12/30/12 11:21 PM
12/30/12 11:21 PM
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Dkn- cool color combo and I like the stance. You are correct that a more expensive custom wheel will provide me the backspace and look I want. I want a deep basket in back.

You also have the balance of sidewall height right, too. I hope to tie it all together by doing protouring look with mild custom paint.

I d always liked the t7 and fk5 colors. Google " molten orange" and check out the car w ghost flames. The purists can look at my black Hemi 69 or r4 RT clone. Or my other resto's.

Re: 69 Charger Resto Mod. Rear Suspension choices [Re: 440PURSUIT] #1350727
12/31/12 12:51 PM
12/31/12 12:51 PM
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Coram, NY
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Another deal breaker for wheels is the lip. When you go larger than stock, I can't stand the "stepped" look by the lip. I like the smooth lip, which also makes the wheel look like it has more dish too.

Re: 69 Charger Resto Mod. Rear Suspension choices [Re: Pool Fixer] #1350728
12/31/12 01:04 PM
12/31/12 01:04 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
Mr.Yuck Offline
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the wheels listed have a 5.880 in. Backspace... the picture obviously does not. these have 6.63" of backspace.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-431-8966b35/overview/ Still for $103 that's not aweful.

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