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In Comp Eliminator we ran 24 screws per side of each rim. Besides keeping the tire from spinning on the rim the screws also stiffin the side wall. The screws change the way the sidewall works. We found the more screws the better the tire worked.

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Recommendation from Weld Wheels. 1/8th mile times; 7.51 and slower = 6 per side, 5.51 - 6.50 = 12 per side, 4.75 - 5.50 = 16 per side, quicker than 4.75 = DOUBLE BEAD LOCKS - but I'm sure there are a lot of guys here that are smarter than they are.

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Like all threads, good debate and opinions are welcome and always should be. The only other thing I left out of the initial post was "could this be a safety issue?" That was my thinking anyway. Like stated several times, the wide wheel and small tire maximizes the footprint, especially for classes limited by a tire size, etc. Commonly used with not many known problems.

What works for Charlie or any other credited sponsored racer might not work for the average guy.....to a point. As stated previously its a good bet Charlie does not race on that same set of tires the next race or all season, so yeah chances are he'll most likely never rip the screws out and spin the tire off a wheel. But for a guy with a car that bites the track, making the same or more power who tries to extend longevity and get as much out of his tires due to lack of funds might not be so lucky or successful. The probability for him to damage his car, crash into a competitor or face injury or death is somewhat higher IMO.

I have spoken to Hoosier, M/T and Goodyear reps about the subject of wide wheel/small tires; their answers are pretty much all the same. But I always have to pose the "what if" questions when there is a chance of something bad happening. And most times the "experts" will give an honest "what if" answer "off the record". You think they'll fix your car, competitors car or take care of you/your family if you get hurt? I don't think so.........

People are like sheep sometimes; believe and follow what the next guy is doing until something bad happens............

If this was a video of Booze ripping the tire off the wheel and crashing or other similar incidents posted on the internet, MOST replies to this thread with fast guys would present a whole new way of thinking. I KNOW there would be comments of, "I don't care how much slower it makes me or what it cost, my wheels will be getting beadlocks tomorrow or when I can afford it."

I simply posted the video to show you whats going on with a wide wheel/small tire w/screws. Just a heads-up to think about safety, nothing else.

Wes

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" could this be a safety issue" - IMO, yes.

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In Comp Eliminator we ran 24 screws per side of each rim. Besides keeping the tire from spinning on the rim the screws also stiffin the side wall. The screws change the way the sidewall works. We found the more screws the better the tire worked.

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Recommendation from Weld Wheels. 1/8th mile times; 7.51 and slower = 6 per side, 5.51 - 6.50 = 12 per side, 4.75 - 5.50 = 16 per side, quicker than 4.75 = DOUBLE BEAD LOCKS - but I'm sure there are a lot of guys here that are smarter than they are.

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In Comp Eliminator we ran 24 screws per side of each rim. Besides keeping the tire from spinning on the rim the screws also stiffin the side wall. The screws change the way the sidewall works. We found the more screws the better the tire worked.

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Recommendation from Weld Wheels. 1/8th mile times; 7.51 and slower = 6 per side, 5.51 - 6.50 = 12 per side, 4.75 - 5.50 = 16 per side, quicker than 4.75 = DOUBLE BEAD LOCKS - but I'm sure there are a lot of guys here that are smarter than they are.

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The comp guys are alitter smarter than most,I was a crew member for my inlaw but when guys like Hurley Blakney, John Guyer ,Buddy Nickins and Vinnie Deceglie start talking I was all ears. Weld don;t know [Edited by Moparts - Family Friendly Site - Keep it clean] about getting a badass car down the track.

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dude stop name dropping and beating your chest. a comp eliminator car does not run a wide wheel with a little tire, so it does not fit/count period in this discussion. you know damn well a comp elim car tire resembles zero relation to whats being discussed here. They have a wide wheel an wide tire! Maybe you should use some of that experience and keep your dart's front end on the ground w/wo the wheelie bars. geez!

dj

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In Comp Eliminator we ran 24 screws per side of each rim. Besides keeping the tire from spinning on the rim the screws also stiffin the side wall. The screws change the way the sidewall works. We found the more screws the better the tire worked.

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Recommendation from Weld Wheels. 1/8th mile times; 7.51 and slower = 6 per side, 5.51 - 6.50 = 12 per side, 4.75 - 5.50 = 16 per side, quicker than 4.75 = DOUBLE BEAD LOCKS - but I'm sure there are a lot of guys here that are smarter than they are.

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The comp guys are alitter smarter than most,I was a crew member for my inlaw but when guys like Johnny Gray, Hurley Blakney, John Guyer ,Buddy Nickins and Vinnie Deceglie start talking I was all ears. Weld don;t know [Edited by Moparts - Family Friendly Site - Keep it clean] about getting a badass car down the track.

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Your wrong on them not knowing DO-DO... they test
all the time BUT they have a multi million dollar
business and have to put a safety cushion in there
so if a person wants to do something different thats
up to them if they crash

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NoT comparing Comp to this crap but most of you have not seen any video of the back of cars except this one so don't be quick to bash when you have nothing to compare it with. My point is rim screws will hold the tire in place with no problem. Go buy your beadlocks and waste your money if your scared.

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Your wrong on them not knowing DO-DO... they test all the time BUT they have a multi million dollar business and have to put a safety cushion in thereso if a person wants to do something different thatsup to them if they crash

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Talking about something you know nothing about and I have to laugh at you! . For a guy who can't even ring a motor right, I do not value your opinion nor should you be giving one.

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Lets keep this thread on-point and positive, not slam people. Raff knows his stuff and does not have to prove it. He's been helping Moparts members long before 2003. His opinions are valued here. Just sayin'

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Your wrong on them not knowing DO-DO... they test
all the time BUT they have a multi million dollar
business and have to put a safety cushion in there
so if a person wants to do something different thats
up to them if they crash

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Talking about something you know nothing about and I have to laugh at you! . For a guy who can't even ring a motor right, I do not value your opinion nor should you be giving one.

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Well I guess I'm not PERFECT like YOU but I guess
your GOD.... but you sure talk BS and from your
comment on Weld Wheels you dont know Jack Sh!t

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It doesn't have a 509 cam, super stock springs, cop car or rallye wheels, nor a pinion snubber. . . . I wouldn't expect some of you to understand. Charlie has forgotten more race wins than many of us will ever have.

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Like all threads, good debate and opinions are welcome and always should be. The only other thing I left out of the initial post was "could this be a safety issue?" That was my thinking anyway. Like stated several times, the wide wheel and small tire maximizes the footprint, especially for classes limited by a tire size, etc. Commonly used with not many known problems.

What works for Charlie or any other credited sponsored racer might not work for the average guy.....to a point. As stated previously its a good bet Charlie does not race on that same set of tires the next race or all season, so yeah chances are he'll most likely never rip the screws out and spin the tire off a wheel. But for a guy with a car that bites the track, making the same or more power who tries to extend longevity and get as much out of his tires due to lack of funds might not be so lucky or successful. The probability for him to damage his car, crash into a competitor or face injury or death is somewhat higher IMO.

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In Comp Eliminator we ran 24 screws per side of each rim. Besides keeping the tire from spinning on the rim the screws also stiffin the side wall. The screws change the way the sidewall works. We found the more screws the better the tire worked.

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Recommendation from Weld Wheels. 1/8th mile times; 7.51 and slower = 6 per side, 5.51 - 6.50 = 12 per side, 4.75 - 5.50 = 16 per side, quicker than 4.75 = DOUBLE BEAD LOCKS - but I'm sure there are a lot of guys here that are smarter than they are.

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I think we definitely are wiser than most. We have run 7.89 in the 1/4 weighing 3600 lbs, on DOT tires, and we save weight by using no rim screws at all.

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Please explain to me how a guy with the same or more power could possibly get more runs and hook harder? My car kills the tire in 15 passes.

as for the lack of funds............ he won't be making the same or more power, if he is he's buying tires becsue if he doesn't he just goes up in smoke.

and last thing, If your running heads up to give up a tenth or two like you stated is huge i don't like giving up anything.

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Bob,

Re-read what I stated, think about it and then you'll understand why I won't need to answer your question.

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Please explain to me how a guy with the same or more power could possibly get more runs and hook harder? My car kills the tire in 15 passes.

as for the lack of funds............ he won't be making the same or more power, if he is he's buying tires becsue if he doesn't he just goes up in smoke.

and last thing, If your running heads up to give up a tenth or two like you stated is huge i don't like giving up anything.

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Bob,

Re-read what I stated, think about it and then you'll understand why I won't need to answer your question.

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Uh-oh! Look who has come out his cave, to give his .
I see both points that are being made. Charlie certainly knows what he is doing, but, if I were a friend/crew member, and saw that vid, I would tell him that he bumped his damn head, if he were to make another pass, with that setup. As far as the argument about weight? Huh? I gladly added the weight of my Champion beadlocks, but, gained the security of knowing that I did everything that I could possibly do, to protect myself, and the guy in the other lane. I guess adding the 10+ pound fire system was a mistake too? No offense to any of the bracket guys, but, I only follow the heads up stuff, so, I will only comment on the heads up arena. To be honest, I feel that Beadlocks should be MANDATORY, at the speeds that these cars are running.(6-7-8 second cars) Can the shi_ hit the fan on a 9 second car? Of course. My point is, if you have had to abide by the Specs (25.2, 25.3, 25.5), why are they overlooking a major player in the drivetrain? The wheels. My Cuda, with the Pro Stock Hemi, made in the area of 1250-1275 HP at the wheels (rough, but, conservative guess) There was no way that I was going to trust my life on some screws to hold that wheel/tire in place, at 160 mph. The 25.3 Spec was a good start, but, you still have cars that weigh in the area of 3500 pounds, going 200 mph, on a little tire. Bada$$? Yes. Totally crazy dangerous? Yes. Might sound a bit off topic, but, I did the tech for every car at the last West Coast Hod Rod race, and was very surprised to see a number of fast (mid 7-8 second) cars, that had no beadlocks. Alright, back to my cave....

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Uh-oh! Look who has come out his cave, to give his .
I see both points that are being made. Charlie certainly knows what he is doing, but, if I were a friend/crew member, and saw that vid, I would tell him that he bumped his damn head, if he were to make another pass, with that setup. As far as the argument about weight? Huh? I gladly added the weight of my Champion beadlocks, but, gained the security of knowing that I did everything that I could possibly do, to protect myself, and the guy in the other lane. I guess adding the 10+ pound fire system was a mistake too? No offense to any of the bracket guys, but, I only follow the heads up stuff, so, I will only comment on the heads up arena. To be honest, I feel that Beadlocks should be MANDATORY, at the speeds that these cars are running.(6-7-8 second cars) Can the shi_ hit the fan on a 9 second car? Of course. My point is, if you have had to abide by the Specs (25.2, 25.3, 25.5), why are they overlooking a major player in the drivetrain? The wheels. My Cuda, with the Pro Stock Hemi, made in the area of 1250-1275 HP at the wheels (rough, but, conservative guess) There was no way that I was going to trust my life on some screws to hold that wheel/tire in place, at 160 mph. The 25.3 Spec was a good start, but, you still have cars that weigh in the area of 3500 pounds, going 200 mph, on a little tire. Bada$$? Yes. Totally crazy dangerous? Yes. Might sound a bit off topic, but, I did the tech for every car at the last West Coast Hod Rod race, and was very surprised to see a number of fast (mid 7-8 second) cars, that had no beadlocks. Alright, back to my cave....

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I know this whole deal is like beating a dead horse!
When I told Charlie about this post, he laughed and shook his head.
He runs 20 screws per side, and they change tires every 12-15 passes. And NEVER has there been a tear in a bead of a tire. Those guys (Hot Street, Pro Stock, SSO) have been doing it for yrs! And if you put a GoPro on your 1/4, chances are the tire is doing the same thing if your wheel is as wide or wider than the tire...