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Carter, Edelbrock, or Holley? #1244625 06/03/12 03:07 AM 06/03/12 03:07 AM
Joined: Apr 2010 Posts: 19 Spokane Valley, Washington S stryker63 OP member
stryker63 OP member S Joined: Apr 2010 Posts: 19 Spokane Valley, Washington	Greetings, I am finally returning to my project after an extended period of unemployment. It is a �73 Plymouth Gold Duster resto-mod. Power plant is a warmed over �99 5.2L Magnum. Block is bored over 0.03� with a higher duration cam (duration @ 0.05 216 intake/224 exhaust), hypereutectic pistons, heavier (LS1) valve springs, and double timing chain, but otherwise stock. Goal is right around 290-300hp. Intake is an Edelbrock RPM Air-Gap (7577) manifold. I would like to run a Thermoquad but have heard they are not compatible with this intake. The Edelbrock guys suggest a 1407 (manual choke) or 1411 (electric choke) 750 cfm carb. I have also looked into the base 600 cfm Summit Racing carb or a smaller Holley (4160 or similar). My question is this: What carb would best complement this intake? I have been advised to try and stay within a range of 600-700 cfm. This is a low budget build so high-end or exotic carbs are not doable. Thanks for any and all opinions.

Re: Carter, Edelbrock, or Holley? [Re: stryker63] #1244626 06/03/12 03:40 AM 06/03/12 03:40 AM
Joined: Jul 2006 Posts: 4,319 Puyallup, WA S StealthWedge67 master
StealthWedge67 master S Joined: Jul 2006 Posts: 4,319 Puyallup, WA	First & formost: STAY AWAY from the 1407 / 1411 Edelbrock carbs. Garbage! I'd suggest a Holley 650 Street Avenger series for your combo. LemonWedge - Street heavy / Strip ready - 11.07 @ 120

Re: Carter, Edelbrock, or Holley? [Re: stryker63] #1244627 06/03/12 03:41 AM 06/03/12 03:41 AM
Joined: Dec 2007 Posts: 18,160 Mass DAYCLONA I Live Here
DAYCLONA I Live Here Joined: Dec 2007 Posts: 18,160 Mass	Holley or a Thermobog

Re: Carter, Edelbrock, or Holley? [Re: DAYCLONA] #1244628 06/03/12 03:53 AM 06/03/12 03:53 AM
Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 12,291 Kent, Wa 340SHORTY Truck Nut
340SHORTY Truck Nut Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 12,291 Kent, Wa	Hollet 3310 750 vac secondarys I am truckless..

Re: Carter, Edelbrock, or Holley? [Re: stryker63] #1244629 06/03/12 09:44 AM 06/03/12 09:44 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 8,944 Holly/MI D Dean_Kuzluzski master
Dean_Kuzluzski master D Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 8,944 Holly/MI	With 216/224 duration at .050........... Why would you want more cfm that you need and less throttle response off idle????? Poorer gas mileage too. Do the 600-650 carb. 600 Holleys are inexpensive at swapmeets and on this sites Classifieds Section. Don't overcarb. That 5.2/318, now 322, will scream nicely with a 600 Holley and pull down high teens in mileage. Even better with a 625 AFB with the jets/metering rods tweaked. Worse case, you can sell the 600-650 carb later for what you paid for it and upgrade to that 750 when you're ready to throw more gas money at it. R.I.P.- Gary "Coop" Davis 02/09/68-05/13/04

Re: Carter, Edelbrock, or Holley? [Re: Dean_Kuzluzski] #1244630 06/03/12 11:03 AM 06/03/12 11:03 AM
Joined: Apr 2007 Posts: 2,327 Glendale, AZ 6 69L78Nova Banned. Forever.
69L78Nova Banned. Forever. 6 Joined: Apr 2007 Posts: 2,327 Glendale, AZ	Go Thermoquad. Way better than a holley or afb! Better mpg, more power. Best street carb out 1969 Nova 454/M21/3.31 Mild mid-11 second weekend cruiser 1994 F150 XLT Super Cab 2WD 5.0/4R70W/3.55 (Daily driver)

Re: Carter, Edelbrock, or Holley? [Re: stryker63] #1244631 06/03/12 11:05 AM 06/03/12 11:05 AM
Joined: Sep 2004 Posts: 22,873 Chicken coop dustergirl340 Chicken Little
dustergirl340 Chicken Little Joined: Sep 2004 Posts: 22,873 Chicken coop	650 Holley. Or anything but an Edelbrock 750.

Re: Carter, Edelbrock, or Holley? [Re: stryker63] #1244632 06/03/12 11:15 AM 06/03/12 11:15 AM
Joined: Jun 2003 Posts: 3,325 Truckville, the capital of NY 85_Ram_4speed master
85_Ram_4speed master Joined: Jun 2003 Posts: 3,325 Truckville, the capital of NY	Since you said low budget, get a 600 cfm Holley and rebuild it. They are usually found cheap enough and you can rebuild them and buy the carb for around $100. I agree the regular Edelbrocks are not the greatest, in my opinion only due to the lack of an adjustable secondary air door. The Thunder series Edelbrock on the other hand is an excellent choice. But I think they run around $350. Both carbs will require the Chrysler throttle cable bracket too, so by that for which ever carb when you get the rebuild kit. If this is a street car (which it sounds like), keep the CFM on the smaller side---you'll be much happier. Outcast Dodge guy.

Re: Carter, Edelbrock, or Holley? [Re: 85_Ram_4speed] #1244633 06/03/12 11:35 AM 06/03/12 11:35 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 24,562 Brookeville, Md Mr.Yuck Not enough dumb comments...yet
Mr.Yuck Not enough dumb comments...yet Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 24,562 Brookeville, Md	Holley. 650HP would work nice, but if you want to save a few $$ you can always get an old school 750 vac carb. [IMG]http://i66.tinypic.com/pui5j.jpg[/IMG] Coming soon!!!!

Re: Carter, Edelbrock, or Holley? [Re: Mr.Yuck] #1244634 06/03/12 12:03 PM 06/03/12 12:03 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 15,976 Chilliwack B.C. Canada R RUNCHARGER I Live Here
RUNCHARGER I Live Here R Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 15,976 Chilliwack B.C. Canada	Rebuilt Carter AVS or a new Edelbrock AVS. Do not run an AFB, the Holley 1850 is a cheap alternative as well. Sheldon

Re: Carter, Edelbrock, or Holley? [Re: stryker63] #1244635 06/03/12 02:17 PM 06/03/12 02:17 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 3,152 Central NC gch master
gch master Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 3,152 Central NC	A 600 holley will be fine and dandy.If you happen to stumbel on a 650 vacuum secondary all the better.Even a 600 double pumper would work well. You can always mill the choke horn or do a main body swap on a 600 for a little more flow.

Re: Carter, Edelbrock, or Holley? [Re: gch] #1244636 06/03/12 02:47 PM 06/03/12 02:47 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 20,970 A collage of whims topside Too Many Posts
topside Too Many Posts Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 20,970 A collage of whims	The Eddy 7577 looks like a square-bore, so the T-quad won't fit without an adapter or some modification. Not enough room under a Duster/Dart/Demon/Valiant hood for an adapter. You can use the regular Performer for a T-quad; look at the carb base area on the intake for a larger secondary opening. Look at the Weiand & others as well. I really like the T-quad or AVS-style carbs for the street, and 600-650CFM is all you'll need under about 7,000 RPM for your combo. Holleys are easy to tweak, but in my experience usually get a bit less MPG. Depending on what air cleaner you plan to use, the carb throat size may pose a problem.

Re: Carter, Edelbrock, or Holley? [Re: stryker63] #1244637 06/03/12 05:47 PM 06/03/12 05:47 PM
Joined: May 2005 Posts: 2,295 dark side of the moon D Dougsmopars top fuel
Dougsmopars top fuel D Joined: May 2005 Posts: 2,295 dark side of the moon	The carters. eddys and TQ's are not the best choise for a bigger cam motor. There idle circut is off vacunm and with bigger cam you have less vacunm. Also all above mentionedhave a heat soak problem and hard restart after warmed up. I'd suggest the Holley. I do prefer the Quick fuel carbs. Holley design with more features and less cost. Very nice street carb.

Re: Carter, Edelbrock, or Holley? [Re: Dougsmopars] #1244638 06/03/12 06:07 PM 06/03/12 06:07 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 8,944 Holly/MI D Dean_Kuzluzski master
Dean_Kuzluzski master D Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 8,944 Holly/MI	WOW!! Pretty wide range of responses! Bottomline.........the 600 Holley is hard to beat when they can be had all day long at swapmeets for $40 or less. I've run a Carter AFB for over 17 years and NEVER a heatsoak problem. ONE bad needle/seat and that's it. Very simple efficient carbs that are easy to tune & service, especially with his cam. Still say a 750 is overkill and gas mileage will suffer. R.I.P.- Gary "Coop" Davis 02/09/68-05/13/04

Re: Carter, Edelbrock, or Holley? [Re: Dean_Kuzluzski] #1244639 06/03/12 06:55 PM 06/03/12 06:55 PM
Joined: Apr 2012 Posts: 18,880 - R RSNOMO Moparts Torchbearer
RSNOMO Moparts Torchbearer R Joined: Apr 2012 Posts: 18,880 -	' Very simple efficient carbs that are easy to tune & service' Exactly... Have had a 'garbage' 1411 on top of a 440 for 20 years... ZERO issues... Compare an exploded view of a Holley, vs. a Carter... There's your answer... Last edited by RS23U1G; 06/03/12 06:57 PM.

Re: Carter, Edelbrock, or Holley? [Re: Dougsmopars] #1244640 06/03/12 07:11 PM 06/03/12 07:11 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 862 Iowa State fan kilroy super stock
kilroy super stock Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 862 Iowa State fan	Quote: The carters. eddys and TQ's are not the best choise for a bigger cam motor. There idle circut is off vacunm and with bigger cam you have less vacunm. Also all above mentionedhave a heat soak problem and hard restart after warmed up. I'd suggest the Holley. I do prefer the Quick fuel carbs. Holley design with more features and less cost. Very nice street carb. Only difference in the QF v older hollies v other carbs is that QF have circuits with adjustable bleeds. You can do the same with drill bits and wire and or drilling and tapping your own. The adjustable circuits do you NO GOOD what-so-ever if you dont understand them or have a way to see the tuning effects caused by them. I personally prefer TQ but opinions are like A-holes, everyone has one and they all stink. All carburetors can be tuned the same, read ALL CARBS CAN BE TUNED THE SAME. Have someone tear one apart in front of you and decided which one looks the easiest for you to fix, it your ride, you ll have to fix it. 1973 Charger, former SE, former auto I'm not trying to be difficult, it comes naturally....

Re: Carter, Edelbrock, or Holley? [Re: RSNOMO] #1244641 06/03/12 07:20 PM 06/03/12 07:20 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 338 Montreal Quebec STROKIE enthusiast
STROKIE enthusiast Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 338 Montreal Quebec	I installed a garbage 1411 on the 451... Never had problems when you know how to tune it. I used Holley on many engines good carb but now I prefer Edelbrock.

Re: Carter, Edelbrock, or Holley? [Re: kilroy] #1244642 06/03/12 10:09 PM 06/03/12 10:09 PM
Joined: May 2005 Posts: 2,295 dark side of the moon D Dougsmopars top fuel
Dougsmopars top fuel D Joined: May 2005 Posts: 2,295 dark side of the moon	The QF carb also has adjustable vac diaphram for secondaries so no need to mess around with springs like a stock holley.

Re: Carter, Edelbrock, or Holley? [Re: Dougsmopars] #1244643 06/03/12 11:03 PM 06/03/12 11:03 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 862 Iowa State fan kilroy super stock
kilroy super stock Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 862 Iowa State fan	Quote: The QF carb also has adjustable vac diaphram for secondaries so no need to mess around with springs like a stock holley. so do TQs and Eddy AVS and Qaudjets. again THEY ALL ARE THE SAME in what they do. find one and get comfy, or try them all and have fun with everyone. No one carb is going to demystify working on them or tuning them. They are either tuned right making them the "BEST" carb or completely out of tune and or the motor is not in time and they are the "WORST" carb. Again, find one and get comfy; short of dropping one if you follow rebuild instruction you cant "break one". Last edited by kilroy; 06/03/12 11:03 PM. 1973 Charger, former SE, former auto I'm not trying to be difficult, it comes naturally....

Re: Carter, Edelbrock, or Holley? [Re: kilroy] #1244644 06/04/12 05:23 AM 06/04/12 05:23 AM
Joined: Mar 2003 Posts: 9,108 Rogue River, OR Jeremiah master
Jeremiah master Joined: Mar 2003 Posts: 9,108 Rogue River, OR	Quote: Quote: The QF carb also has adjustable vac diaphram for secondaries so no need to mess around with springs like a stock holley. so do TQs and Eddy AVS and Qaudjets. again THEY ALL ARE THE SAME in what they do. find one and get comfy, or try them all and have fun with everyone. No one carb is going to demystify working on them or tuning them. They are either tuned right making them the "BEST" carb or completely out of tune and or the motor is not in time and they are the "WORST" carb. Again, find one and get comfy; short of dropping one if you follow rebuild instruction you cant "break one". Relax. The QF Slayer series of carb ($300) uses an externally adjustable vacuum secondary dash-pot. It also has idle bleeds in the main body and the secondary metering plate is drilled for jets. That said if you don't have the tune up parts you will be spending a little more to tune the carb to perfection.

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