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Re: Educate me about vacuum pumps [Re: 540dust] #1127056
12/04/11 09:12 PM 12/04/11 09:12 PM
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,107
Quebec, Canada
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Diablo Offline
super stock
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Quebec, Canada
Quote:

If you're looking at the Moroso pumps, I think you should give this a look GZ VP104 Super Pro pump seems like a better deal to me, more capacity and less cost. Check it out http://www.gzmotorsports.com/compare.html



Thats what we used on our 640ci. Pretty sure it would be overkill for your engine but it has been a great pump for us!
Re: Educate me about vacuum pumps [Re: Big Squeeze] #1127057
12/04/11 11:08 PM 12/04/11 11:08 PM
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 3,502
SOUTH JERSEY
HEMIFRED Offline
master
HEMIFRED  Offline
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Joined: Jul 2010
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SOUTH JERSEY
Quote:

Most of the decent engines I have come across ran a Star Machine Vacuum pump.



I decided on a Star for one major reason they do not pull anything directly into the pump. Everything goes thru their VACUUM PUMP OIL SEPARATOR/EXHAUST TANK
first thus no trash that can tear up the rotors. All other designs require oil be passed into them. Star pumps are designed to run dry.
Quote:

The Pump is a “OIL-LESS” design, which requires NO LUBRICATION for operation. Oil in the Pump will not damage the Pump,
however it will reduce its performance. The dryer you can keep this Pump, the better it will work!



Quote:

VACUUM PUMP OIL SEPARATOR/EXHAUST TANK This new vacuum pump accessory is yet another example of Star Machines’ continuing effort to offer only the
finest vacuum components to the motorsports industry. Constructed of aluminum and CNC machined, the tank
can be completely disassembled if necessary. The “tank within a tank” design incorporates two separate
chambers. The inner oil separator chamber, containing a baffle and filter media, acts to reduce or eliminate oil
reaching the vacuum pump. A secondary benefit of this section is its ability to trap debris resulting from engine
failure before it can reach the vacuum pump and cause damage. The outer chamber serves as a free flowing
exhaust vent for the pump and also contains filter media. Separate drain cocks located in the bottom plate will
individually drain both chambers.


home of the
Sox and Martin Hemi Duster
Re: Educate me about vacuum pumps [Re: HEMIFRED] #1127058
12/05/11 10:06 AM 12/05/11 10:06 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,103
Phila Pa
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scatpacktom Offline
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Posts: 3,103
Phila Pa
I was able to borrow a Star vacuum pump at our last race. Pulled a safe 10 inches and it did nothing to my time slip, what is wrong with my engine?
Re: Educate me about vacuum pumps [Re: scatpacktom] #1127059
12/05/11 03:29 PM 12/05/11 03:29 PM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,284
Bend,OR USA
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Cab_Burge Offline
I Win
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,284
Bend,OR USA
Quote:

I was able to borrow a Star vacuum pump at our last race. Pulled a safe 10 inches and it did nothing to my time slip, what is wrong with my engine?

I have heard that the vacume pumps only help above 6000 RPM What RPM do you shift your car at?

Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: Educate me about vacuum pumps [Re: Cab_Burge] #1127060
12/05/11 03:32 PM 12/05/11 03:32 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,382
Las Vegas
Al_Alguire Offline
I Live Here
Al_Alguire  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,382
Las Vegas
FWIW we run a Moroso enhanced 4 vane on the orange car. I have it limited to 14lbs and have since the beginning. Tore it down at 223 passes and there was no sign of pin issues. It is back on thier now at the same vac settings. So far so good.

the silver car has a Dailey 5 stage dry sump and according to the data logger sees right at 18" a each pass.

"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."

"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
Re: Educate me about vacuum pumps [Re: Al_Alguire] #1127061
12/05/11 04:53 PM 12/05/11 04:53 PM
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,288
Oregon
sg66mopar Offline
pro stock
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,288
Oregon
I went with the GZ setup. Mostly because they answered the phone and talked me through all the parts I needed.

The price was OK and the kit showed up here real fast.

Mine's only pulling around 12 at the top end because I have it regulated down that much.

After experimenting a little I finally put the pickup in the driver side valve cover (Thank's Al) and put an extension on the top of the tank so the breather is well above the tank.
Re: Educate me about vacuum pumps [Re: scatpacktom] #1127062
12/05/11 05:13 PM 12/05/11 05:13 PM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 419
NY
F
F1Scamp Offline
mopar
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 419
NY
Quote:

I was able to borrow a Star vacuum pump at our last race. Pulled a safe 10 inches and it did nothing to my time slip, what is wrong with my engine?



Maybe your headgasket was already on its way out?

Work In Progress- 71' Duster F.A.S.T.- 10.36@130 Smallblock Record Holder.
Re: Educate me about vacuum pumps [Re: F1Scamp] #1127063
12/06/11 10:56 AM 12/06/11 10:56 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,385
Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda Offline
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an8sec70cuda  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,385
Marion, South Carolina [><]
I've had an aerospace pump on my car since 2008. No oiling problems. I have it set to pull about 12".
The pump did fail 2 weeks ago at a true street race at rockingham...just put the new one on this past weekend.

CHIP
'70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60
'69 road runner, 440-6, 18 spline 4 speed, Dana 60
'71 Demon, 340, low gear 904, 8.75
'73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75
'90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt
'06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
Re: Educate me about vacuum pumps [Re: scatpacktom] #1127064
12/06/11 11:25 AM 12/06/11 11:25 AM
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 3,502
SOUTH JERSEY
HEMIFRED Offline
master
HEMIFRED  Offline
master

Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 3,502
SOUTH JERSEY
Quote:

I was able to borrow a Star vacuum pump at our last race. Pulled a safe 10 inches and it did nothing to my time slip, what is wrong with my engine?



not all engines will gain power with a pump.It depoends on the ring tension
Unless there is a decent amount of back pressure in the crankcase and it is effecting the ring seal it won't help.

home of the
Sox and Martin Hemi Duster
Re: Educate me about vacuum pumps [Re: an8sec70cuda] #1127065
12/06/11 11:59 AM 12/06/11 11:59 AM
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 12,339
somwhere
S
smokinwoody Offline
I Live Here
smokinwoody  Offline
I Live Here
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 12,339
somwhere
they suck!!...

Re: Educate me about vacuum pumps [Re: Edge] #1127066
12/06/11 07:56 PM 12/06/11 07:56 PM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 912
London, England
mopar_mark Offline
super stock
mopar_mark  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 912
London, England
Quote:

Instead of pulling vacuuum from the valve cover you can pull from the fuel pump location as there is a limited amount of oil splashing from this location.



Is or has anyone else tried plumbing their Vacuum this way ?
Re: Educate me about vacuum pumps [Re: mopar_mark] #1127067
12/07/11 10:34 AM 12/07/11 10:34 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,385
Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda Offline
I Live Here
an8sec70cuda  Offline
I Live Here

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,385
Marion, South Carolina [><]
Quote:

Quote:

Instead of pulling vacuuum from the valve cover you can pull from the fuel pump location as there is a limited amount of oil splashing from this location.



Is or has anyone else tried plumbing their Vacuum this way ?


I have not, but a lot of people do and have no problems.

CHIP
'70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60
'69 road runner, 440-6, 18 spline 4 speed, Dana 60
'71 Demon, 340, low gear 904, 8.75
'73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75
'90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt
'06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
Re: Educate me about vacuum pumps [Re: an8sec70cuda] #1127068
12/07/11 12:56 PM 12/07/11 12:56 PM
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 12,339
somwhere
S
smokinwoody Offline
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 12,339
somwhere
Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Instead of pulling vacuuum from the valve cover you can pull from the fuel pump location as there is a limited amount of oil splashing from this location.



Is or has anyone else tried plumbing their Vacuum this way ?


I have not, but a lot of people do and have no problems.



any pictures with this setup??..
Re: Educate me about vacuum pumps [Re: smokinwoody] #1127069
12/07/11 01:37 PM 12/07/11 01:37 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 10,384
Upstate NY
Bigcube Offline
I Live Here
Bigcube  Offline
I Live Here

Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 10,384
Upstate NY
Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Instead of pulling vacuuum from the valve cover you can pull from the fuel pump location as there is a limited amount of oil splashing from this location.



Is or has anyone else tried plumbing their Vacuum this way ?


I have not, but a lot of people do and have no problems.



any pictures with this setup??..


I do know pulling vacuum from the valley cover is a bad idea. I tried it, it was pulling so much oil the output looked like a fire hose.
Re: Educate me about vacuum pumps [Re: jyrki] #1127070
12/07/11 02:18 PM 12/07/11 02:18 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,016
Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw...
gregsdart Offline
I Live Here
gregsdart  Offline
I Live Here

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Posts: 10,016
Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw...
I had vacuum leaks that were hard to track down and could only pull 7 inch vac for quite a while on the moroso 3 vane. If I had it to do again, I would go four vain and use a bleed to control vacuum. I don't need one now on my 528, it will only pull 10/12 inches spinning it 50 percent engine speed, or about 3700 rpm. The bigger unit will consistently pull max vacuum from launch, and if you develop a small leak will still give you good vacuum to a point. Plus, for the few extra $$ you are set for a bigger motor if you move up.
I use a good, sidebucket oil pan, a baffled valve cover with a large baffle under the breather, set up front on the valve cover. I pull so little oil that I have gone five or six passes and it wasn't worth draining the little puke tank. I also use two breathers on the puke tank, to make sure that if there is any restriction with one, I don't have to worry about it. I wash them once a year.

8..603 156 mph best, 2905 lbs 549, indy 572-13, alky
Re: Educate me about vacuum pumps [Re: Bigcube] #1127071
12/07/11 03:02 PM 12/07/11 03:02 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 190
Winterpeg, Canada
H
hvyweight Offline
member
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Winterpeg, Canada
That is the only way I could control the amount of oil coming into the pump. I tried the valley pan and the valve cover. The fuel pump plate work for me. I can also tell you that I had to put a shield around the front half of the breather tank to elminate a siphoning effect from the wind going throught the front of my car at 145+ mph!

6955551-001.JPG (98 downloads)
Re: Educate me about vacuum pumps [Re: smokinwoody] #1127072
12/07/11 04:23 PM 12/07/11 04:23 PM
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 698
Alberta Canada
E
Edge Offline
mopar
Edge  Offline
mopar
E

Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 698
Alberta Canada
Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Instead of pulling vacuuum from the valve cover you can pull from the fuel pump location as there is a limited amount of oil splashing from this location.



Is or has anyone else tried plumbing their Vacuum this way ?


I have not, but a lot of people do and have no problems.



any pictures with this setup??..



there is a picture in my earlier post on the topic, not a great picture but you can see the 12 AN line from the pump going behind motorplate to the fuel pump plate. It is Moroso piece that comes with the 12 AN male end and the plate is tapped and machined for the ORB fitting

76 Duster work in progress
Re: Educate me about vacuum pumps [Re: Edge] #1127073
05/05/12 05:41 PM 05/05/12 05:41 PM
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,075
Mo.
racerx Offline
master
racerx  Offline
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Posts: 4,075
Mo.
I did a search and came up with this old thread on vacuum pumps.Just like to add that sense I've change out my valley plate and installed a set of the Super Performance gaskets i've see an increase in vacuum readings so ...anyone no whats a good reading at idle?I know that u don't want to go past 14" in a full past.........Thax.

Re: Educate me about vacuum pumps [Re: 540dust] #1127074
05/05/12 10:26 PM 05/05/12 10:26 PM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,871
MI, usa
dvw Offline
master
dvw  Offline
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,871
MI, usa
Quote:

If you're looking at the Moroso pumps, I think you should give this a look GZ VP104 Super Pro pump seems like a better deal to me, more capacity and less cost. Check it out http://www.gzmotorsports.com/compare.html [/quote

I agree on paper they look as good as anybody. About the same cost as a Moroso but a nicer piece. Is it better? well see in a month or so.
Doug
Re: Educate me about vacuum pumps [Re: smokinwoody] #1127075
05/05/12 10:29 PM 05/05/12 10:29 PM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,871
MI, usa
dvw Offline
master
dvw  Offline
master

Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,871
MI, usa
Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Instead of pulling vacuuum from the valve cover you can pull from the fuel pump location as there is a limited amount of oil splashing from this location.



Is or has anyone else tried plumbing their Vacuum this way ?


I have not, but a lot of people do and have no problems.



any pictures with this setup??..



I did it . 1/2' pipe tapped into the block off plate. With a Jessel there's nothing spinning in there except the crank. Additionally the GZ pump is designed to pull some oil.
Doug

Last edited by dvw; 05/05/12 10:30 PM.
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