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Stock-block build with original B1s... #992747
05/15/11 01:24 PM
05/15/11 01:24 PM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 147
Milledgeville, (central) Georg...
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Bighead440 Offline OP
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Bighead440  Offline OP
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Milledgeville, (central) Georg...
Finally scored a nice set of B1 originals offa Ebay with valves, intake manifold, T&D rockers, all gaskets and valve covers all brand new. Basically all I have to buy are head studs and offset roller lifters to get started. I want to run them on an early (thick main web, '71 cast, BIG numbers) 400 block with stroker internals (custom pistons, etc.). This is going in either a Colt with strut front end an ladder bars or a FED rail, so it will be a lightweight, Powerglide equipped vehicle regardless. Being locked into a stock B-block, should I consider a 511" (4.25") stroke, short (6.535") rod combo, or just stick with the 499" setup with 440 length or 6.7" Chevy BB rods? I know I will have to spin it (rpm) on that small of a motor, but in a lightweight chassis, and especially the rail with a transbrake and NO suspension or a squirrelly Colt, maybe a softer bottom end will help get launched. Ideas, thoughts, data??? Thanks in advance...RB

Re: Stock-block build with original B1s... [Re: Bighead440] #992748
05/15/11 09:11 PM
05/15/11 09:11 PM
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,128
Salt Lake City
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camastomcat Offline
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Salt Lake City
Aluminum mains and filled block with 14-1 max compression, aluminum rods, good 4340 crankshaft, would be my recipie. But, after all the money you spend for the block work, you will wish you bought a mega block.

Re: Stock-block build with original B1s... [Re: camastomcat] #992749
05/15/11 10:09 PM
05/15/11 10:09 PM
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,107
Quebec, Canada
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Diablo Offline
super stock
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I would girdle it too!

Re: Stock-block build with original B1s... [Re: Diablo] #992750
05/15/11 10:50 PM
05/15/11 10:50 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,015
Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw...
gregsdart Offline
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Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw...
You say you are locked in to a stock block? Pardon my promoting an aftermarket block, but I believe it to be in your best interests.
That stock block will make a nice down payment on a KB low deck block, if you would consider that. About $5200 ready to assemble, from what I hear. Do some figuring on machine work and the KB looks like a better deal, from my experiences so far. You will have a block that can make over 900 hp easily, and if the heads have been ported, maybe more. The stock blocks are in dangerous territory at that level and above. Any way you go about it, my vote goes for 2.200 mains on the crank, as short a piston as you can run with the B1 heads. Then figure out which rod will go in there, by adjusting the pin height of the piston to match. With a motor that will generate the rpms this one will, I would also go with aluminum rods in a stock block. If you can find a crank with center counter weights, that will take a lot of stress off a stock block also.

Last edited by gregsdart; 05/15/11 10:59 PM.
Re: Stock-block build with original B1s... [Re: gregsdart] #992751
05/15/11 11:45 PM
05/15/11 11:45 PM
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 4,590
Indy
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joshking440 Offline
Lunch is on me!
joshking440  Offline
Lunch is on me!
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Joined: Oct 2006
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Indy
I run a stock block, exact same thing you want to build 230 casting 71 400 block 499, bme rods, orig b1s, alum main caps bcr girdle, 9.4:1 comp and a 118mm turbo! But....

I am building a new koleno low deck cast iron block so I can beat on this thing harder once i get it all figured out.

Call Steve and Marty at koleno! Talk to them about their new block if you are interested.

Last edited by joshking440; 05/16/11 01:06 AM.
Re: Stock-block build with original B1s... [Re: joshking440] #992752
05/16/11 01:01 AM
05/16/11 01:01 AM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 147
Milledgeville, (central) Georg...
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Bighead440 Offline OP
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Bighead440  Offline OP
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Milledgeville, (central) Georg...
I neglected to mention that I have the BCR aluminum sap/main girdle system and I also have a 4.15" 4340 "B" crank (new) and a Bryant gun-drilled 4.15" ProMod "RB" (Hemi) crank, used but good after grinding to 2.2" rod journals, "B" mains, reducing the counterweights and machining a flexplate register. If I were to get a 4.25" "B" 4340 crank it would be 2.2 rod journals as well. The aluminum rods sound good, and I actually have some 6.65" GRPs that I bought for another build that I can use, since I put that one on the street with longer iron rods. I want to stick to a flat-top piston, so IDK about the 14:1 but I could come close with milling. I am not going to run this in a series or every weekend, so it's not like I'm putting 100 passes a year on it anyway. Has Koleno released their low-deck "B" block yet? If I go that route I'm building a 528/542" motor minimum!!!

Re: Stock-block build with original B1s... [Re: Bighead440] #992753
05/16/11 01:05 AM
05/16/11 01:05 AM
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 4,590
Indy
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joshking440 Offline
Lunch is on me!
joshking440  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 4,590
Indy
I have one of thekolenos, and I know others to be ready soon!

Re: Stock-block build with original B1s... [Re: joshking440] #992754
05/16/11 01:10 AM
05/16/11 01:10 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,380
Las Vegas
Al_Alguire Offline
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Al_Alguire  Offline
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Las Vegas
Put it together. Detonation and bob weight will be your enemies. Keep detonation away and the rotating assembly as light as you can and it can live for a long time. I have had a few stock block B1 deals and they have all lived well. I ALWAYS use aluminum rods and caps and a short fill. IMO go with the shorter rod 4.25" stroke with the 2.200" rods. Makes for a great package that can make good reliable power.


"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."

"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
Re: Stock-block build with original B1s... [Re: Al_Alguire] #992755
05/16/11 12:11 PM
05/16/11 12:11 PM
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,128
Salt Lake City
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camastomcat Offline
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Salt Lake City
Quote:

Put it together. Detonation and bob weight will be your enemies. Keep detonation away and the rotating assembly as light as you can and it can live for a long time. I have had a few stock block B1 deals and they have all lived well. I ALWAYS use aluminum rods and caps and a short fill. IMO go with the shorter rod 4.25" stroke with the 2.200" rods. Makes for a great package that can make good reliable power.




I've done the same thing but never over 850HP. I never had problems either but have seen others that have, and bob weight, main flex, and detonation are the reason for failure, as Al mentioned. Aluminum mains are a must.

Re: Stock-block build with original B1s... [Re: camastomcat] #992756
05/16/11 01:40 PM
05/16/11 01:40 PM
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 1,397
Carson City, Nevada
Biginchmopar Offline
pro stock
Biginchmopar  Offline
pro stock

Joined: Nov 2010
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Carson City, Nevada
I have a 400 block aluminum caps half fill that makes right at 900hp @ 498CID. No problems so far! I have a Brand New 4340 4.25" crakshaft for a 400 that I want to sell. My combo has steel rods but I can see using aluminum to make the rotating assembly a little lighter.

Re: Stock-block build with original B1s... [Re: Biginchmopar] #992757
05/16/11 11:14 PM
05/16/11 11:14 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,380
Las Vegas
Al_Alguire Offline
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Al_Alguire  Offline
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Las Vegas
I never had the B1 the Valiant on the dyno but it wen 9.02 at 149 weighing 3470lbs. Not sure on the power numbers, use whatever claculator floats your boat. It worked very well for me. It was a 4.25 stroke, good set of B1 originals and had aluminum rods, caps and a short fill in a 400 block.

No reason it cant work. Is it the optimal set up these days probably not given you can get a World block fairly easily. Will it work and last? Yes if it is built right and you keep it from detonating it will.


"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."

"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
Re: Stock-block build with original B1s... [Re: Al_Alguire] #992758
05/16/11 11:19 PM
05/16/11 11:19 PM
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 1,397
Carson City, Nevada
Biginchmopar Offline
pro stock
Biginchmopar  Offline
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Carson City, Nevada
Man you need a light car!

Re: Stock-block build with original B1s... [Re: Biginchmopar] #992759
05/16/11 11:29 PM
05/16/11 11:29 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,380
Las Vegas
Al_Alguire Offline
I Live Here
Al_Alguire  Offline
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Las Vegas
Quote:

Man you need a light car!




Dont I know it. Then again I am not exactly a small guy either...You could just buy mine so i can get started on a light one


"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."

"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
Re: Stock-block build with original B1s... [Re: Al_Alguire] #992760
05/17/11 12:03 AM
05/17/11 12:03 AM
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 5,619
long island NY
A
Ari440 Offline
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Ari440  Offline
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long island NY







what did these heads flow


1.39 9.85 - 137 mph
Re: Stock-block build with original B1s... [Re: Ari440] #992761
05/17/11 11:07 AM
05/17/11 11:07 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,380
Las Vegas
Al_Alguire Offline
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Al_Alguire  Offline
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Las Vegas
Ari they were 412-422cfm on the three benches they were on.


"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."

"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
Re: Stock-block build with original B1s... [Re: Al_Alguire] #992762
05/17/11 10:02 PM
05/17/11 10:02 PM
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 5,619
long island NY
A
Ari440 Offline
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Ari440  Offline
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long island NY
Quote:

Ari they were 412-422cfm on the three benches they were on.





AL

what was compression and cam you where using ?


1.39 9.85 - 137 mph
Re: Stock-block build with original B1s... [Re: Ari440] #992763
05/17/11 11:18 PM
05/17/11 11:18 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,380
Las Vegas
Al_Alguire Offline
I Live Here
Al_Alguire  Offline
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Las Vegas
Ari-Frankly I dont recall the cam specs off hand. I was under .750" lift and did have 115LSA. I had planned on spraying the motor but never did. The compression was just under 14-1.

I am in the process of moving to Vegas and most of the car stuff is already there with the cars. Sorry I cannot be more specific for you. The cam was from Scott Brown.


"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."

"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
Re: Stock-block build with original B1s... [Re: Al_Alguire] #992764
05/17/11 11:22 PM
05/17/11 11:22 PM
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 5,619
long island NY
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Ari440 Offline
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long island NY
thanks AL

one more question ,if you remember

what was timming and jetting


1.39 9.85 - 137 mph
Re: Stock-block build with original B1s... [Re: Ari440] #992765
05/17/11 11:24 PM
05/17/11 11:24 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,380
Las Vegas
Al_Alguire Offline
I Live Here
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Las Vegas
Timing was 34 degrees on motor passes. Carb is a Holley Ultra Dominator and jetting was in the 90-92 range after some playing with air bleeds etc.


"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."

"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
Re: Stock-block build with original B1s... [Re: camastomcat] #992766
05/18/11 12:31 AM
05/18/11 12:31 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,380
Las Vegas
Al_Alguire Offline
I Live Here
Al_Alguire  Offline
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Posts: 19,380
Las Vegas
Ari-Here is a crappy video of it for what it's worth.

http://www.streetfire.net/video/walkaround-of-b1-mopar_90841.htm


"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."

"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
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