Re: 1965 318 Poly ? Rebuild or swap to LA 318?
[Re: Dennis_K]
#91373
07/20/08 05:57 PM
07/20/08 05:57 PM
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,021 Chesapeake Va
BobK
super stock
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super stock
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Chesapeake Va
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Also, the newer 318's will bolt up to the early 727. The valves, timing gear, water pump, fuel pump, crank (318 & 340) will work in the poly. The Mopar stroker crank for a 318-340 will work in the poly.
1964 Plymouth Fury x 2 1964 Plymouth Sport Fury
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Re: 1965 318 Poly ? Rebuild or swap to LA 318?
[Re: Dennis_K]
#91375
07/20/08 09:00 PM
07/20/08 09:00 PM
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,021 Chesapeake Va
BobK
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super stock
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i believe that there is one bolt hole different, but it will work. Explore this site for more info. www.1962to1965mopar.ornocar.com
1964 Plymouth Fury x 2 1964 Plymouth Sport Fury
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Re: 1965 318 Poly ? Rebuild or swap to LA 318?
[Re: Dennis_K]
#91376
07/20/08 09:22 PM
07/20/08 09:22 PM
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 15,118 85086
moparpollack
Lil Herman
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Lil Herman
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Posts: 15,118
85086
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Look at the intake and exhaust ports. Then look at the modern 318 ports. Those engines were great as low rpm motors but anything else I would say pass.
56 Plaza 63 D100 step side 67 Coronet, 68 Roadrunner, 69 Super Bees, 69 Coronet 500 convertible, 70 Roadrunner Post, 79 D150 360, and a severe case of Mopar a,d,d
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Re: 1965 318 Poly ? Rebuild or swap to LA 318?
[Re: 65rbdodge]
#91379
07/21/08 07:48 AM
07/21/08 07:48 AM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,533 Indiana
Fury Fan
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master
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Indiana
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And '66-older transmissions have a different input spline count so be aware of this when swapping converters...
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Re: 1965 318 Poly ? Rebuild or swap to LA 318?
[Re: Fury Fan]
#91381
07/21/08 11:18 AM
07/21/08 11:18 AM
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Anonymous
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Anonymous
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Quote:
And '66-older transmissions have a different input spline count so be aware of this when swapping converters...
Yep, but later pumps and input shafts will swap in to the older aluminum torqueflites, and then you can use the newer style convertors w/o any problem.
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Re: 1965 318 Poly ? Rebuild or swap to LA 318?
[Re: Dennis_K]
#91382
07/21/08 11:27 AM
07/21/08 11:27 AM
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Anonymous
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Anonymous
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Quote:
Were any of the LA 318s internally balanced? We would have to use the 65 torque converter, so if the newer 318s are externally balanced, we would need to add a weight to the old converter, correct?
All the poly 318's were internally balanced, as were all LA 318's until ???? AFAIK, the late magnum 318's are also internally balanced, but I could be wrong.
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Re: 1965 318 Poly ? Rebuild or swap to LA 318?
#91383
07/21/08 12:40 PM
07/21/08 12:40 PM
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Anonymous
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Anonymous
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If you get a late 318 with cast crank you either need to use the B&M conversion flex plate thats balanced for the cast crank or add MP torque converter weights to the old converter.Easy fix. So I know everyone wants the latest and greatest toy from the shinny magazine pages but being creative and taking old tech and applying some new tech is cool as are the old Poly motors. The last thing I ever want to see is a row of old classic mopars with their hoods up and car after car is loaded with a 5.7 German hemi. Dare to be differant be a hot rodder not a parts installer.Ok thats my rant forthe day.
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Re: 1965 318 Poly ? Rebuild or swap to LA 318?
#91384
07/21/08 01:05 PM
07/21/08 01:05 PM
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Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 4,769 Holland MI Ottawa
2boltmain
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Parts are available to rebuild the poly. If you are on a tight budget the LA would be cheaper. The poly is different and very cool. Weiand still makes a dual plane 2x4 intake for this motor. Different is good. Its nice to see a 409, a nail head, a flathead, a 331,354,392 hemi, a POLY...ect (351 cleveland is a nice change in a mustang for once also.)
Keep old mopars alive.
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Re: 1965 318 Poly ? Rebuild or swap to LA 318?
#91385
07/21/08 01:13 PM
07/21/08 01:13 PM
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Anonymous
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Anonymous
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From this post: https://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Number=3771330is this quote from "dogdays": Quote:
[E]very single 318, A or LA, also every 273 was internally balanced. Even the 5.2 Mags are internally balanced.
I think I'm safe in saying that while cast-crank 340's and all 360's (which are all cast crank) are externally balanced, both forged AND cast-crank 273's and 318's are internally balanced.
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Re: 1965 318 Poly ? Rebuild or swap to LA 318?
#91386
07/21/08 01:41 PM
07/21/08 01:41 PM
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 12,419 Kalispell Mt.
HotRodDave
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I Live Here
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ALL 318s poly or LA cast or forged are internally balanced. Some time in production of the poly 318 the starter hole was changed. I was putting a 318 poly in a dart with a 318 LA and got it all in there and the starter would not go in. I don't remember what the difference was or if I could have just used the older starter but I didn't have on to try so I dropped a 273 in that I had on the other side of the shop. I think the motor I was trying was a 64 from a polara 4dr. The poly has good combustion chamber shape, OK intake ports and very good exhaust ports. There are a few cam available, TTI makes headers weind intakes, and whatevr stroker kits fit in 318LAs will fit in them. Since the valves are closer to straight up and down piston to valve clearance should not be a problem. I have heard of guys going all the way to 340 size bores with them but I would get a very reputable sonic tester to test it first, even if they all could go 4.040 bore when new (not) they are 40plus years old and have corosion in them reduceing the maximum over bore. You could make a very stout 390 something stroker with them. Put in a good cam intake and port work on the intake side of the heads and it will make a killer sleeper 450hp and 500tq is not out of the realm of reality.
I am not causing global warming, I am just trying to hold off a impending Ice Age!
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Re: 1965 318 Poly ? Rebuild or swap to LA 318?
[Re: HotRodDave]
#91388
07/21/08 02:06 PM
07/21/08 02:06 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,376
dogdays
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I Live Here
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Poly Lovers, Unite! Thanks for remembering my post. ALL 318s and 5.2 Mags, as well as all 273s are internally balanced. For sure also ANY 318 or 273 (not sure about 5.2)crank can be swapped into ANY OTHER 273 or 318 without rebalancing. So if the Poly had a crank with the smaller diameter ring for the converter, a later 318 crank can swap right in with no other changes, except the thrust bearing in the new crank's bearing set has to be the older smaller diameter one to fit the block. So the 'bay's $99.95 318 crank and kit may need a different thrust bearing to go into the Poly block.
On to the ports. I believe that if you compare the cross-section of the Poly intake port to the cross-section of the 318 (not 360) intake port you will find that the Poly has more cross-section. I also believe that the Poly head flows quite a bit more than the 135 cfm of the usual 318 port. Old-timers concur that an old 318 is a lot stouter than a new (LA) 318 for pulling a trailer. Old timers like this don't even consider the 5.2 Mag because they haven't owned a vehicle that new. I think an injected 5.2 Mag would be stronger than the Poly pulling a load.
The 4" stroker crank drops right in, rods are the same dimensionally as all LA rods, pistons need to have valve pockets for the intake valve which are different than the Wedge location.
There are two problem areas for the Poly. First is intake selection. Since Holley discontinued the Weiand 7503, there are no new intakes available. The last used Weiand 7503 I tracked on the 'bay sold for $520! There were some 2-4 intakes stock and these are decently priced but try to put carbs on them! The factory 4-barrel manifold from the 1962 is priced at about the 7503 range.
The second problem area is the camshaft selection. Crane and Isky used to make cams but not for a long time now. Chris Neilsen in Utah has a supply of cores and will grind one for you, that's who ground Pavlovich's cam. There is a smaller cam company who advertised new Poly cores about 3 years ago. Figure that the new Poly cam, lifters and pushrods will run you $400 or so. If anyone has better information chime in.
The blocks are pretty stout but Mopar casting quality rules. I would feel safe at 0.060" overbore and I believe Pavlovich's engine ended up with 4.000" pistons. But I'd UT a block before going to 4.000".
The timing set, oil pump and distributor swap from LA motors, not a problem.
Rocker Arm Specialities will rebuild the rockers.
Race Section denizen OU812 claims to have Poly head porting experience.
The Edelbrock P-600 3-2s manifold for Polys has been discontinued for ages. It is cool but uses Stromberg 97 type 3-bolt 2-barrel carbs that either leak or cost an arm and a leg to have work right. There is an aftermarket fuel injection system that looks like a 97 so that may be an option. also the 97 is back in production at cost of ~$400 each.
All for now, R.
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Re: 1965 318 Poly ? Rebuild or swap to LA 318?
[Re: dogdays]
#91389
07/21/08 05:58 PM
07/21/08 05:58 PM
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,021 Chesapeake Va
BobK
super stock
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super stock
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Posts: 1,021
Chesapeake Va
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There is a P-300 set up for Rochester carbs also. Mine runs Ford 94's or Stromberg 97's. Surprises a lot of people.
1964 Plymouth Fury x 2 1964 Plymouth Sport Fury
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