Single or twin turbo???
#880040
12/14/10 05:59 PM
12/14/10 05:59 PM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 208 Norrland, Sweden
Swedcharger67
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Hi all, I'm currently busy restoring the body of my 67 Dodge Charger, but already thinking about hot engine projects... Now, my current thinking is going down the twin turbo path, since I imagine 2 small turbos are easier to squeeze in than 1 big turbo. I want to keep the exterior of the car just like the original. Engine will be a 472 cui with fuel injection and all computerized. What's your thinking about it, pros and cons with single/twin turbos...?? Cheers, Martin
Martin, 67 Charger, 512 cui, E85, MegaSquirt MS3X sequential ignition & injection
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Re: Single or twin turbo???
[Re: 1Fast340]
#880043
12/15/10 08:02 AM
12/15/10 08:02 AM
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Posts: 208 Norrland, Sweden
Swedcharger67
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Quote:
dont realy know, but i think this guy http://www.dteracing.se/ could be a good source for information on how much power could reliably be made with either alternative
Yes, thanks for the good link, some nice engines there. I'm not after any race-winning top power, I'm more looking for hi torque at mid revs and an efficiently running and reliable (and fun) street engine. Martin
Martin, 67 Charger, 512 cui, E85, MegaSquirt MS3X sequential ignition & injection
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Re: Single or twin turbo???
[Re: wrenchinrandy]
#880044
12/15/10 08:20 AM
12/15/10 08:20 AM
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Posts: 208 Norrland, Sweden
Swedcharger67
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Quote:
I spent what seems a lifetime trying to put turbo's on the 451 in my '67 Charger. I looked at single and twin set-ups. I finally went with twins because, for me at least, the installation was more simple. In the end I fit all of it under a stock hood without modifying the engine bay. Good luck with your project.
Well, that's interesting, that's how I want to do it as well. I want to be able to restore the car to original whenever I want and not chop it up in any way. Also, the original 383 4bbl will not be used for the engine project, but another block.
How did your project turn out in the end? What brand and size turbos were you using? Anything you would do differently if you were to build a similar engine again? Apologies for my many questions... Martin
Martin, 67 Charger, 512 cui, E85, MegaSquirt MS3X sequential ignition & injection
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Re: Single or twin turbo???
[Re: Swedcharger67]
#880046
12/15/10 04:55 PM
12/15/10 04:55 PM
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 49 Borden, Indiana, U.S.A.
wrenchinrandy
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So far I am happy with the results. I have about 4K miles on it with a very basic tune. It runs better with the EFI than it ever has. I am sorting through some heat control concerns (I am concerned though I've had no issues) and recovering from an unfortunate meeting of my oil pan with an exposed man hole. My goal is to have all of that wrapped up by spring and go to the Dyno for some real tuning. I am looking forward to being ecstatic with it then, as I really haven't experienced the turbos yet. As far as which turbos I have, they are a T3/T4 hybrid using 60-1 compressors and Buick GN style turbines. As for regrets, I try to research everything and make good choices. I chose the hybrid turbos on the advice of a friend (brand x fan, figures...) that pointed out the GN inducer is round, as opposed to the more common T4's rectangle. While that made fabrication easier, I think I may have limited myself as far as performance potential goes. In the short term, that probably won't be a big deal as, like you, I have no intention of any serious competition. The only other regret that I have is my choice of transmission. I put a Viper T-56 in the car. The installation took a couple of years since I can only work a couple of hours a week on the car. Don't get me wrong, now that it is installed I love it, especially the .5 sixth ratio. However I could have been enjoying the car a couple of years ago if i'd made another choice. This regret I think will disappear over time. I put a post that had some pictures on this forum earlier this year, July I think. If you can't find it I would be happy to repost. Also, while I am no expert, I would be happy to field any questions. I can at least tell you my choices and the reason behind them.
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Re: Single or twin turbo???
[Re: wrenchinrandy]
#880047
12/16/10 08:40 AM
12/16/10 08:40 AM
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Posts: 208 Norrland, Sweden
Swedcharger67
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Thanks for the info. I'm struggling with the search function and haven't been able to find your posts with pictures. Yeah, I'm looking forward to getting a fuel injected engine and get full control of the engine. Sure modern carbs are good, but there are limitations with big cams and intakes at low air speed. Fuel injection should take care of that nicely. Well, this winter is reserved for body work, next winter the supercharged fun will begin, I'm sure we will have reason exchange ideas again!
Martin, 67 Charger, 512 cui, E85, MegaSquirt MS3X sequential ignition & injection
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Re: Single or twin turbo???
[Re: wrenchinrandy]
#880051
12/16/10 06:18 PM
12/16/10 06:18 PM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 208 Norrland, Sweden
Swedcharger67
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Thanks for the pictures! A very nice and clean installation! Did you move the battery to the trunk? Good work to fit it all under the hood! In terms of engine/fuel control I'm thinking of using Megasquirt or VEMS, what are you using? Cheers,
Martin, 67 Charger, 512 cui, E85, MegaSquirt MS3X sequential ignition & injection
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Re: Single or twin turbo???
[Re: Swedcharger67]
#880052
12/16/10 06:50 PM
12/16/10 06:50 PM
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 49 Borden, Indiana, U.S.A.
wrenchinrandy
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Yes the battery got moved to the trunk. As did the supplemental fuse block and relays (fuel pumps, intercooler pump, cooling fans). The ECU I'm using is an Autronic SM2. I am using an M&W Prodrag 4 firing eight coils in a wasted spark configuration. The coils are mounted just above the panrails. That is why you don't see any plug wires in the pictures. I have been very happy with the Autronic, but I know there are some more capable models out there. You might look into it though because there is an excellent source of support that I think is based in Sweden. I realize they may not be in your back yard, but if they are close, they are world renown in the Autronic world. "They" in this case are MRM Racing. Again, I am not claiming Autronic is the best choice, only that you might check them out.
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Re: Single or twin turbo???
[Re: wrenchinrandy]
#880053
12/17/10 06:30 AM
12/17/10 06:30 AM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 208 Norrland, Sweden
Swedcharger67
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Thanks, I looked into MRM racing and I am surprised to see the number of suppliers of ECUs today. I'm however more into the enthusiast products like MegaSquirt and VEMS, I even consider developing my own ECU just for fun, since I have a background in developing microprocessorbased systems. Well, it's not until next winter that I can get started on an ECU project...the winters up here seem to be getting shorter in sync with the growing number of projects... Thanks again,
Martin, 67 Charger, 512 cui, E85, MegaSquirt MS3X sequential ignition & injection
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Re: Single or twin turbo???
[Re: jyrki]
#880055
12/17/10 04:30 PM
12/17/10 04:30 PM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 208 Norrland, Sweden
Swedcharger67
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Hi Jyrki, lots of nice machinery in Mopoilija's pictures...even an 8.2l Volvo Penta was spotted... Personally I don't know yet what I need in terms of parts, I'm probably myself going to fabricate most of the stuff I need. Cheers,
Martin, 67 Charger, 512 cui, E85, MegaSquirt MS3X sequential ignition & injection
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