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Self Learning EFI systems with nitrous? turbo? super? #879359 12/13/10 11:05 PM 12/13/10 11:05 PM
Joined: Mar 2004 Posts: 3,287 Dalton, MA Slipknot440 OP master
Slipknot440 OP master Joined: Mar 2004 Posts: 3,287 Dalton, MA	Can any of these new systems be used with turbos, supers, or nitrous. I've noticed since the EZ EFI has become big that holley, edelbrock and powerjection now have systems at similar prices...but similar quality?

Re: Self Learning EFI systems with nitrous? turbo? super? [Re: Slipknot440] #879360 12/14/10 12:26 AM 12/14/10 12:26 AM
Joined: Feb 2003 Posts: 21,318 Manitoba, Canada DaytonaTurbo Too Many Posts
DaytonaTurbo Too Many Posts Joined: Feb 2003 Posts: 21,318 Manitoba, Canada	I suppose you could do it just fine with a wet nitrous system. And if the injectors flow enough, you might be able to get it to work with a roots type supercharger but I don't think any of them would accept a turbocharger or centrifugal supercharger.

Re: Self Learning EFI systems with nitrous? turbo? super? [Re: DaytonaTurbo] #879361 12/14/10 12:41 AM 12/14/10 12:41 AM
Joined: Feb 2003 Posts: 8,697 A Andrewh master
Andrewh master A Joined: Feb 2003 Posts: 8,697	fast came out with the self learn for their regular system that can handel boost. but the price jump is pretty significant. From 800 for the ez to 1400 for the computer for the fast. look at the deals section there is a post on it with new pricing.

Re: Self Learning EFI systems with nitrous? turbo? super? [Re: Andrewh] #879362 12/14/10 01:27 AM 12/14/10 01:27 AM
Joined: Jan 2007 Posts: 7,664 IN A ahy master
ahy master A Joined: Jan 2007 Posts: 7,664 IN	With nitrous or boost, you can destroy an engine petty quick with lean A/F. The computer would have to be a real fast learner to catch up before destruction occurs. Plus nitrous is on/off... I don't think controllers have provision to adjust that fast. Better I think to go with the full system (XFI or equivalent) and set it up with correct maps.

Re: Self Learning EFI systems with nitrous? turbo? super? [Re: ahy] #879363 12/14/10 12:35 PM 12/14/10 12:35 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,938 Sonora CA Mopar_Rich top fuel
Mopar_Rich top fuel Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,938 Sonora CA

Re: Self Learning EFI systems with nitrous? turbo? super? [Re: ahy] #879364 12/14/10 01:20 PM 12/14/10 01:20 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 28,069 Irving, TX feets Senior Management
feets Senior Management Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 28,069 Irving, TX	Quote: With nitrous or boost, you can destroy an engine petty quick with lean A/F. The computer would have to be a real fast learner to catch up before destruction occurs. Plus nitrous is on/off... I don't think controllers have provision to adjust that fast. Better I think to go with the full system (XFI or equivalent) and set it up with correct maps. I think that going easy on the learning cycles with boost would be a benefit. Don't slam WOT and 40 psi boost into the engine the first time you fire it. Work up to it so the computer can learn. After that, it will have the MAP figured out and should respond like anything else you've programmed. Nitrous? No. I don't like the idea of a dry system even on the LS1s that made it so popular. That's relying on an O2 sensor to correct the mix (I believe). That means the first few batches have already burned. I don't like living on the edge of engine death. We are brothers and sisters doing time on the planet for better or worse. I'll take the better, if you don't mind. - Stu Harmon

Re: Self Learning EFI systems with nitrous? turbo? super? [Re: feets] #879365 12/14/10 02:04 PM 12/14/10 02:04 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,938 Sonora CA Mopar_Rich top fuel
Mopar_Rich top fuel Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,938 Sonora CA	Quote: I think that going easy on the learning cycles with boost would be a benefit. Don't slam WOT and 40 psi boost into the engine the first time you fire it. Work up to it so the computer can learn. After that, it will have the MAP figured out and should respond like anything else you've programmed. True for the XFI 2.0, but not for EZ-EFI. The EZ-EFI will not allow for more than a 1 bar map table. Quote: Nitrous? No. I don't like the idea of a dry system even on the LS1s that made it so popular. That's relying on an O2 sensor to correct the mix (I believe). That means the first few batches have already burned. I don't like living on the edge of engine death. A dry system is better (again, I'm only talking about the XFI system). The XFI does not use the O2 reading when using nitrous to determine the amount of fuel. There is a base nitrous table (based on how much HP is being added) that it uses to immediately add fuel faster than any other approach could do. You have control of whether is goes back into closed loop later after things have settled down, or you can stay open loop. In my opinion this is a very safe way to go since the engine will never see "the edge of death".

Re: Self Learning EFI systems with nitrous? turbo? super? [Re: Mopar_Rich] #879366 12/15/10 01:44 PM 12/15/10 01:44 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 28,069 Irving, TX feets Senior Management
feets Senior Management Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 28,069 Irving, TX	I was told they were working on multi-bar map systems for the EZ systems. As for the nitrous tables you're feeding the computer info and it's assuming the N2O is flowing when triggered. It sould work fine as long as you don't change the N2O pill without changing the tables. I'm still not comfortable with N2O. Something about it bothers me. We are brothers and sisters doing time on the planet for better or worse. I'll take the better, if you don't mind. - Stu Harmon

Re: Self Learning EFI systems with nitrous? turbo? super? [Re: feets] #879367 12/15/10 04:03 PM 12/15/10 04:03 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,938 Sonora CA Mopar_Rich top fuel
Mopar_Rich top fuel Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,938 Sonora CA	Yes they are working on the EZ systems being able to handle greater than 1 bar. But I wish they wouldn't, or at least limit it to 2 bar! The XFI 2.0 is already a self learning system and whenever I tune a boosted motor I always back off on the timing, and that's something the EZ systems cannot do because they do not control timing. Sure - you can use a boost referenced ignition system like the MSD-BTM but that's still a crap shoot to me. I'd rather have full control as the motor gets into areas where there just isn't much room for error.

Re: Self Learning EFI systems with nitrous? turbo? super? [Re: Mopar_Rich] #879368 12/17/10 12:12 AM 12/17/10 12:12 AM
Joined: Feb 2005 Posts: 350 Grande Prairie, Alberta, Can. CW25 enthusiast
CW25 enthusiast Joined: Feb 2005 Posts: 350 Grande Prairie, Alberta, Can.	Wow that surprizes me that the EZ systems don't offer timing control. I would never buy a system without timing control but I have run boosted for years. 11.67@118 1.88 60' with only 7-8 lbs of boost. Turbocharged, megasquirted, 407 BB, 440 source heads, roller cam, 9:1 comp. http://s292.photobucket.com/albums/mm14/beansgracie

Re: Self Learning EFI systems with nitrous? turbo? super? [Re: CW25] #879369 12/17/10 02:21 PM 12/17/10 02:21 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,938 Sonora CA Mopar_Rich top fuel
Mopar_Rich top fuel Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,938 Sonora CA	Remember, the EZ system was created for a low cost, simple, bolt on, self learning system for an average street guy. Those then need more control step up to the XFI.

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