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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars?
[Re: pinkduster]
#84367
07/05/08 01:33 PM
07/05/08 01:33 PM
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 2,315
MOPAR HEADQUARTERS IN ALDEN NY
hemigod426
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 2,315
MOPAR HEADQUARTERS IN ALDEN NY
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not any more that they lower metal levels. 20-50 vr-1 racing valvoline is highest phosfurous/zinc, more heavy metal contain than mobil-1. its equal to amsoil but less than 1/2 price. im amsoil dealer costs me 6.25 per quart plus shipping. vr-1 is 3.00 my cost at advanced auto. or if you can get a deal on motorcycle oil thats the way to go motul bike oil is still unregulated by tree huggers at epa and its loaded with heavy metal. i have stavley oil engineers report on all oil. and motul is the best phosfurous/zinc content
MOPAR OR NO CAR
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars?
[Re: hemigod426]
#84368
07/05/08 01:39 PM
07/05/08 01:39 PM
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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I have always used Rotella synthetic. I have had this motor apart and everything has always looked great. I am running a 493 solid cam street/ strip car.
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars
#84369
07/05/08 02:50 PM
07/05/08 02:50 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,967
S.I. N.Y.
1MYTGTX
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,967
S.I. N.Y.
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I do & I have 1 more case of the old 15w-40 with the high zinc left....
1MYTGTX
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars
[Re: gd9704]
#84371
07/05/08 03:50 PM
07/05/08 03:50 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,443
Indiana
YO7_A66
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,443
Indiana
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Yes.
I was using the 15w-40 but I had WOT ticking so I dropped to the Rotella 10W-30 deisel and all is clear. (Mine is the older formula)
1970 YO7 A66 [Canadian Export] F8 Challenger
340 (Currently in shop for stroker assy.)
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars
[Re: YO7_A66]
#84372
07/05/08 06:06 PM
07/05/08 06:06 PM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,653
Near Reading PA USA
pinkduster
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,653
Near Reading PA USA
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So is the new formula junk?  I'm assuming the last batch I got for my Cummins is likely the new formula. What exactly is the point behind lowering the zinc content? No doubt, some "green" reason.  So, should I use this new formula Shell Rotella in my Road Runner... 440, 11.5 compression, MP solid lifter cam (528 lift I think  ), ported heads, MSD, blah, blah, blah.  I had been using Royal Purple synthetic, but it is sort of a pain in the butt to get.
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars
[Re: pinkduster]
#84373
07/05/08 06:15 PM
07/05/08 06:15 PM
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 21,822
Kirkland, Washington
Pacnorthcuda
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 21,822
Kirkland, Washington
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Quote:
So is the new formula junk? I'm assuming the last batch I got for my Cummins is likely the new formula. What exactly is the point behind lowering the zinc content? No doubt, some "green" reason.
So, should I use this new formula Shell Rotella in my Road Runner... 440, 11.5 compression, MP solid lifter cam (528 lift I think ), ported heads, MSD, blah, blah, blah. I had been using Royal Purple synthetic, but it is sort of a pain in the butt to get.
Its because of the 'new' 2007 diesel engines (big rigs--Cats and Cummins) and their DPFs (diesel particulate filters). Phosphorus and Zinc contribulte to clogging so they are being reduced.
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars?
[Re: pinkduster]
#84382
07/05/08 11:32 PM
07/05/08 11:32 PM
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 571
Western NC
68Bullit
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 571
Western NC
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What about the Chevron Delo 400? It's the same weight, but is it the same or better than the Rotella? And as far as the weight goes, is there really a big difference in the 10W and 15W?
Last edited by 68Bullit; 07/05/08 11:40 PM.
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars?
[Re: 68Bullit]
#84383
07/06/08 06:57 AM
07/06/08 06:57 AM
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Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 6,167
Maryland
GO_Fish
master
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master
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 6,167
Maryland
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I was running Rotella, but after they reformulated, I quit. I'm back to running Pennsoil 10w30 with a bottle of ZDDPlus.
If your engine has good oil pressure, running a thicker oil than specified is just going to make more heat and cost you some horsepower.
Scott B.
"I'm a self-made man... I started with nothing, and I still have most of it!"
68 360 rusty B'cuda 'vert (GO Fish)13.59@ 98.72 mph
69 340 GTS stock 14.18@ 95.60 mph
01 5.9L Ram 1500 Quad Cab 4x4
01 3.5L 300M 16.23@ 86.97 mph
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars?
[Re: GO_Fish]
#84384
07/06/08 10:14 AM
07/06/08 10:14 AM
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,407
northeast ohio
hulmule
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,407
northeast ohio
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I know when i run rotella in my cummins it smells bad. I can smell it in my cab and in the flumes.I run Delvac in my cumins.
1969 Dodge Coronet R/T Convertible
1979 LiL Red x2
2012 Yellow Jacket
2006 mega cab
1977 Trailduster
1979 Trailduster
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars
[Re: 68Bullit]
#84386
07/06/08 01:25 PM
07/06/08 01:25 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,186
Wherever I am.
Junky
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,186
Wherever I am.
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Quote:
What about the Chevron Delo 400? It's the same weight, but is it the same or better than the Rotella? And as far as the weight goes, is there really a big difference in the 10W and 15W?
Chevron Delo 400 LE 15W40 actually has more zinc than Shell Rotella T 15W40. I don't remember exactly, but it's above 1300 ppm zinc. At least 1200 ppm zinc is best for a flat tappet cam. I suppose 1150 ppm zinc (approximate) is OK, such as Shell's Rotella T's, for a stock engine or a mildly built engine. That's up to the individual to decide.
Shell Rotella T 5W40 full synthetic has about 1400 ppm zinc.
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars
[Re: 300_dup5]
#84388
03/17/15 08:27 PM
03/17/15 08:27 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 28,312
Cincinnati, Ohio
Challenger 1
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 28,312
Cincinnati, Ohio
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Quote:
Thanks Guys, new 440 here it comes
6-7 year old thread? 
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars
[Re: Challenger 1]
#84389
03/17/15 08:33 PM
03/17/15 08:33 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 8,020
Pangaea
B5 Bee
master
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master
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 8,020
Pangaea
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Quote:
Quote:
Thanks Guys, new 440 here it comes
6-7 year old thread?
Don't worry, oil additive packages haven't changed in the last 6-7 years. 
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars
[Re: Challenger 1]
#84391
03/17/15 11:06 PM
03/17/15 11:06 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,392
nielsville, minn.
quickd100
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,392
nielsville, minn.
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Quote:
Quote:
Thanks Guys, new 440 here it comes
6-7 year old thread?
For the last 30 years all I've used in everything from a brigs and Stratton to my 605 Hemi is shell rotella 15/40 HD diesel oil. Never had an oil related engine failure with it.Dave 
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars
[Re: quickd100]
#84392
03/17/15 11:38 PM
03/17/15 11:38 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 18,417
UPPER MICHIGAN, MARQUETTE COUN...
NITROUSN
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 18,417
UPPER MICHIGAN, MARQUETTE COUN...
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Quote:
For the last 30 years all I've used in everything from a brigs and Stratton to my 605 Hemi is shell rotella 15/40 HD diesel oil. Never had an oil related engine failure with it.Dave
Same here. Muscle motors even used Rotella when they dynoed my 526 Hemi.
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars?
[Re: terzmo]
#84399
03/18/15 11:22 AM
03/18/15 11:22 AM
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 667
Los Osos, Ca
CKessel
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 667
Los Osos, Ca
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Don't use the CJ rated oils. They are for 07.5 and newer diesels with the particulate filters and have zippo for ZDDP. Use a CI rated if you want to use diesel oil and make sure its not combo'd as CI/CJ.
Carl Kessel
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars?
[Re: Polarapete]
#84400
03/18/15 01:30 PM
03/18/15 01:30 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 18,582
Rust Belt, SW PA
Silver70
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 18,582
Rust Belt, SW PA
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Quote:
Quote:
I know when i run rotella in my cummins it smells bad. I can smell it in my cab and in the flumes.I run Delvac in my cumins.
Yeah, I can vouch for that smell. I used it a couple of times in my '02 CTD. And I will probably use it when I finally fire the motor in the Ramcharger (it has been dormant since 2012 and it does not look to good for 2015). That 440 has a hot Comp hydraulic and I don't need lifter problems. 
I use it all the time, my truck even leaks oil and yet I never noticed any kind of smell
68 Road Runner, 69 Belvedere, 71 Challenger Vert
340 barracuda, 01 Ram CTD, 95 Ram, 04 Ram, 85 Daytona turbo Z
66 GTO, 06 Magnum RT AWD. 07 Ram CTD, 07 Ram
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars?
[Re: Silver70]
#84401
03/18/15 03:22 PM
03/18/15 03:22 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,363
Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,363
Marion, South Carolina [><]
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I didn't really notice it until I relocated the puke tank on my '01 Cummins, but right after an oil change it does have a weird smell. Kind of an acidic smell. It seems to go away after a while...maybe as the oil gets some miles on it.
I always run Rotella in my truck, but I use Valvoline VR1 race oil in my cars.
CHIP
'70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60
'69 road runner, 440-6, 18 spline 4 speed, Dana 60
'71 Demon, 340, low gear 904, 8.75
'73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75
'90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt
'06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars?
[Re: CKessel]
#84402
03/19/15 10:53 AM
03/19/15 10:53 AM
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Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 3,377
Rancho Cordova, CA
Exit1965
master
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master
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 3,377
Rancho Cordova, CA
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Quote:
Don't use the CJ rated oils. They are for 07.5 and newer diesels with the particulate filters and have zippo for ZDDP. Use a CI rated if you want to use diesel oil and make sure its not combo'd as CI/CJ.
I think Rotella and Delo 400 CJ-4s have about 1200-1300 ppm of zinc. I've been running it for years as have many others.
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars?
[Re: pinkduster]
#2390920
10/21/17 06:28 PM
10/21/17 06:28 PM
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Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 15,862
Central Florida
larrymopar360
Stud Muffin
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Stud Muffin
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 15,862
Central Florida
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Reviving an old post; what's the attractiveness of the 20W-50 weight of the VR-1 Valvoline. I've had it recommended to me by very experienced Mopar mechanic, and I know a lot of wise Mopar people who like it. I'm just wondering, aside from the Zinc content, what's the advantage of the weight?
Would you recommend that weight in my stroked 360, hydraulic roller cam, Florida temps, no racing, just some occasional heavy footed street driving?
Facts are stubborn things.
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars?
[Re: pinkduster]
#2390928
10/21/17 07:02 PM
10/21/17 07:02 PM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889
up yours
Supercuda
About to go away
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About to go away
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889
up yours
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20w50is very old school thinking.
I would not recommend 20w50 for anything other than a very old school, and archaicly, built engine.
Run the thinnest oil that will still give you goo oil pressure. I typically run 10w30, max.
They say there are no such thing as a stupid question.
They say there is always the exception that proves the rule.
Don't be the exception.
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars?
[Re: Supercuda]
#2390959
10/21/17 09:01 PM
10/21/17 09:01 PM
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Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 15,862
Central Florida
larrymopar360
Stud Muffin
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Stud Muffin
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 15,862
Central Florida
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20w50is very old school thinking.
I would not recommend 20w50 for anything other than a very old school, and archaicly, built engine.
Run the thinnest oil that will still give you goo oil pressure. I typically run 10w30, max. I still haven't installed an oil pressure gauge which is crazy I know. It came with an electrical gauge since it was an AHB, but I didn't re-install when crate engine was put in, so I don't know what oil pressure I have currently running Valvoline 10W-30. Again, I know I have GOT TO put an oil pressure gauge back in! I figure my engine is kind of old school, not being high tech tight tolerances modern day engine. Yes, roller cam, but still not the tight tolerances of today's modern built engines, no?
Facts are stubborn things.
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars?
[Re: pinkduster]
#2390980
10/21/17 10:00 PM
10/21/17 10:00 PM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889
up yours
Supercuda
About to go away
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About to go away
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889
up yours
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Well, I ran 5w30 in my 87 Diplomat's 318, said 318 is going strong still, unrebuilt.
They say there are no such thing as a stupid question.
They say there is always the exception that proves the rule.
Don't be the exception.
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars?
[Re: pinkduster]
#2391084
10/22/17 09:08 AM
10/22/17 09:08 AM
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,322
Michigan
crlush
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,322
Michigan
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I used diesel oil in my poly 318 to get some zinc in and too cheap for brad penn.
Last edited by crlush; 10/22/17 09:43 AM.
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars?
[Re: pinkduster]
#2391108
10/22/17 10:55 AM
10/22/17 10:55 AM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889
up yours
Supercuda
About to go away
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About to go away
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889
up yours
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let's not divert to the "benefits" of zinc in diesel oil
They say there are no such thing as a stupid question.
They say there is always the exception that proves the rule.
Don't be the exception.
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars?
[Re: Supercuda]
#2391224
10/22/17 02:14 PM
10/22/17 02:14 PM
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Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 15,862
Central Florida
larrymopar360
Stud Muffin
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Stud Muffin
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 15,862
Central Florida
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let's not divert to the "benefits" of zinc in diesel oil The only reason I went a little off topic is I revived this thread that began 2008, and has not been active in OVER two years. It's nine years old and seemed to have run it's course, and Valvoline VR1 was discussed within the thread.
Facts are stubborn things.
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars?
[Re: pinkduster]
#2391243
10/22/17 02:37 PM
10/22/17 02:37 PM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889
up yours
Supercuda
About to go away
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About to go away
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889
up yours
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Being 9 years old I doubt any of the oil formulations mentioned then are still made today.
They say there are no such thing as a stupid question.
They say there is always the exception that proves the rule.
Don't be the exception.
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars?
[Re: moparsquid]
#2391266
10/22/17 03:08 PM
10/22/17 03:08 PM
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 3,696
jersey
Spaceman Spiff
master
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master
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 3,696
jersey
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I use it for the high zinc content they removed most of the zinc a few years ago.
526 cubes of angry wedge, pushbutton shifted, 9 passenger killer!
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars?
[Re: pinkduster]
#2391880
10/23/17 04:02 PM
10/23/17 04:02 PM
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 74
Stevensville, ON
Frank Raso
member
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member
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 74
Stevensville, ON
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See the HAMB discussion: ZDDP again!My understanding is that the 800 ppm phosphorus limit is really only applicable for dual-rated (CK-4/SN) 30-grade HDEOs. I've been using Petro Canada Duron SHP 10W-30 which has both API CK-4 & Ford WSS‐M2C171‐F1 but has the same additive package for Duron SHP 15W-40 (API CK-4/SN & Ford WSS‐M2C171‐F1). Shell Rotella T4 now only has diesel ratings (no Ford WSS‐M2C171‐F1 either) and no longer has any S-ratings. But there are those who do have aggressive aftermarket cams and high pressure springs, or people just want extra assurance, like me. I use a heavy duty diesel engine oil with typical zinc level of >1200 ppm. Sholoff posted some brands a couple of posts up, any of those are good oils. The new CK-4 specification for HDEO's raises the performance level up even higher, but beware of oils that list both API CK-4 & SN service classification, as they now are required to meet the lower zinc levels of the SM category. Stick with an oil that is CK-4 only and you'll be just fine.
I'm NOT a fan of aftermarket oil additives, like ZDDP in a can, as they can (and probably will) upset the balance of the chemistry of the additive package, which includes other surface acting chemicals besides ZDDP, and just mixing the unknown chemicals together with no way to know how they will react is looney, no real chemist worth his diploma would approve. Also, just to clarify about ZDDP, it is, as I posted above, a surface acting chemical. It has a polar head (seeks to attach itself to metal surfaces) and an oil soluble tail. It reacts chemically with the metal surface due to the heat of operation to form a glass like layer (what we geeks call a "tribo film") on the rubbing surfaces of the engine, to provide a self sacrificing layer. When the parts rub together this layer will rub off, preventing metal to metal contact. As the layer is rubbed off, additional ZDDP in the oil will plate out on the surfaces to replace it. The rate at which the film rubs off is related to the severity of the load (aggressivenes of cam and pressure of the valve springs). A mild or medium severity cam and low to medium pressure springs will remove the film at a lower rate than an aggressive cam with high spring pressures.
Now this is important. The tribo film will only get so thick, no matter how much ZDDP is in the oil. Putting more ZDDP in the oil does will not provide a thicker film. Let that sink in for a moment. More ZDDP does not equal a thicker tribo film. What it means is the oil can protect the surfaces longer than an oil with lower levels of ZDDP. In theory, if you only put a few hundred miles between oil changes, even when using a modern SN gas engine oil with low levels of ZDDP, you will probably never deplete the ZDDP out of the oil and never have a wear problem. Of course, that depends on the aggressiveness of your cam and the pressure of the valve springs, and how hard you drive it.
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars?
[Re: dogdays]
#2392322
10/24/17 01:46 PM
10/24/17 01:46 PM
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Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 15,862
Central Florida
larrymopar360
Stud Muffin
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Stud Muffin
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 15,862
Central Florida
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To the resurrectionist: If you want to ask a question don't you think you could just make a new post? Are the Mods charging for starting a thread? Some newby is going to read the old stuff and "learn" a crapload of incorrect information.
Rotella? Go to your local Walmart and look at the Diesel oil selection. There are now THREE grades of Rotella. Saying put Rotella in it has little meaning unless you specify the grade.
R. Who is the newby here? I guess you're referring to me? Why so critical and picky for crying out loud. If so I joined six years ago. I was asking about VR1 since it was mentioned in thread and thread had died. Thought it was ok and didn't start a new one because so often there are multiple threads covering related information. No, they don't charge for new threads, but man there are a lot of redundant threads. Sorry if I offended....again. I more laid back than the average member here, so it appears.
Facts are stubborn things.
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars?
[Re: Frank Raso]
#2393175
10/26/17 12:49 AM
10/26/17 12:49 AM
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 6,562
Downtown Roebuck Ont
Twostick
Still wishing...
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Still wishing...
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 6,562
Downtown Roebuck Ont
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I see that the phosphorus (antiwear component of ZDDP) level was only 825 ppm in your sample of Delo 15W-40 and that it had the low end of viscosity (12.6 cSt @ 100°C). The viscosity range for 40-grade oils is 12.5 to <16.3 cSt. That was what was in it when I bought it. It has been switched back to Rotella T4 15/40. The last analysis report for T4 I saw on Bob is the Oilguy showed similar Zinc levels and Phos around 900-1000 ppm IIRC. I don't recall the viscosity but there were no negative comments on it so I assume it is acceptable. Kevin
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars?
[Re: pinkduster]
#2393407
10/26/17 04:02 PM
10/26/17 04:02 PM
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 74
Stevensville, ON
Frank Raso
member
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member
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 74
Stevensville, ON
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HAMB member Blues4U states that he is a lubrication engineer and his posts confirm that he is quite knowledgeable about engine oils. One of the points he makes is that modern HDEO is very suitable for flat-tappet gasoline engines and that these oils do not require ZDDP supplements. This is in agreement with GM TechLink's Engine Oil Myths. The Delo and Rotella appear to be excellent flat-tappet engine lubricants even with the much lower phosphorus concentrations than the 1400+ ppm that many people believe are crucial. I also think that it is not beneficial to use an oil that is thicker than necessary. See Engine Wear.
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Re: Anyone using Rotella Diesel oil in their musclecars?
[Re: pinkduster]
#2395262
10/30/17 11:07 AM
10/30/17 11:07 AM
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Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 876
Missouri
jwb123
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 876
Missouri
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This is the answer I got from Shell, when I asked about the new formulation. I use it in my older muscle car engines, and recommend it to my customers engines. Hi Jim, Our CK-4 formulation still has about 1200 ppm of zinc and 1100 ppm of phosphorus, and should still be able to provide adequate protection for flat tappet engines. I’ve attached a brochure that goes over the chemical changes in detail. I hope this helps. Best regards, Aly Shell Technical Information 1-800-237-8645 (Option 3, 1) Safety and technical data sheets for active Shell products can be found at www.epc.shell.com.
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