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its which is.. well.. i have no idea what it is.

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it is these STUPID claims that a 4.18" bore will not make horsepower.. that there "pathetic" "useless" etc. Hyper, bigblock, know the real story on these engines. the rest of you guys are being herded like sheep.

and Jack, the crank was a hypothetical example.
but again.. prove it wrong.. if you can..

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Ghost, I got this one. You guys are stuck on the
(excuse me chevy guys, no disrespect) CHEVY style
of engine building. Big (4 1/4 inch or better)
slugs and medium stroke (3.75 or 4.00 strokes) big ports, hi-compression, big carb, single plane intakes and if automatic trans are used, they are
using converters that launch the car in the
midrange of it's powerband, knowingly trying to wing a 440 like a 383 (6000-6500 rpm maybe 7000)
Strip fine, street racing borderlining dangerously
street performance sucks. 413's may not be able to
be winged like the above combo, but with it's
strong low/midrange power, it will slip out in
front of a 440 off the line with little to no
problem.

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The facts are the 413 with same heads cam intake carb... will make






Less power





The 440 will make more power at the low RPM mid range RPM and will be more at higher RPM

The 4.18 bore can make a lot of power, no one is argueing that bore size can not make a lot of power, no one said a 413 will not make a lot of power, just that the 440 will make more when it has the same equiptment, but the simple FACT is that it will not make as much power as the 440s bore size can. The valve will plain and simple be less shrouded in the 440 and will flow more air at virtually every lift includeing LOW lifts. As an aditional bonus with the bigger bore of the 440 you can put a bigger valve in it than you can a 413 and a bigger valve can flow even more at every lift includeing low lifts and will make more power than the port that is restricted to a valve that will fit a 413. The 413 will NOT make more power than a 440 in equally built engines.

If a smaller bore is better than why not build a 383 RB and while you are at it you could throw in some sleeves to make the bores on that even smaller and really make some awesome power

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Big Bores mean big valves, in a moderate stroke
motor. Big carbs are used and as the r's go
up in the motor, air flow is increased. The
velocity is less at low speed in a 440 vs 413.
The slightly smaller valves in the 413 actually
have a better velocity at low speed than the 440.
Flowing more air with better heads works, but
bore/stroke combo of the 413 would favor a good
flowing head with higher intake port velocity.
This is the key to running a strong 413. Like
I said not an upstairs motor, but plenty of
torque to hold it's own anyplace, short of a full
race or class-type motor.

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A 413 absolutely wil not no way no how make more low end tq than a 440 that is identicle except bore size, no way none whatsoever and anyone who thinks it will has no understanding of what makes an engine work.

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Quite. Which means you have no understanding of
volumetric efficiency. Tell you what, why don't
you run a 4.18 x 4.00 340 based 'Small/Big Block
against your 440, same technology, and let me
know the outcome. If you win, more power to your
argument. If the small block wins you'd better
figure a way to make that 440 more effcient to
run a 413 on modern technology.

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Gee where are the 426 guys???

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Sitting back, having cold ones, laughing at the
nonsense you are throwing in the forum.

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I think they're sitting back laughing at all this fractured logic. I'm just waiting for someone to chime in that a 318 will run with a 340. Oh, wait - don't forget the 413 vs. 440 logic: better throw in a 3.58 crank first. There is nothing wrong with a 413, but saying it will spank a 440 with all things being equal just denies the laws of physics. Would I throw one away? Heck no. Would I drag one home if I got it for cheap? Heck yeah. There is always Dogdays's special 471 recipe.

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The facts are the 413 with same heads cam intake carb... will make






Less power





The 440 will make more power at the low RPM mid range RPM and will be more at higher RPM

The 4.18 bore can make a lot of power, no one is argueing that bore size can not make a lot of power, no one said a 413 will not make a lot of power, just that the 440 will make more when it has the same equiptment, but the simple FACT is that it will not make as much power as the 440s bore size can. The valve will plain and simple be less shrouded in the 440 and will flow more air at virtually every lift includeing LOW lifts. As an aditional bonus with the bigger bore of the 440 you can put a bigger valve in it than you can a 413 and a bigger valve can flow even more at every lift includeing low lifts and will make more power than the port that is restricted to a valve that will fit a 413. The 413 will NOT make more power than a 440 in equally built engines.

If a smaller bore is better than why not build a 383 RB and while you are at it you could throw in some sleeves to make the bores on that even smaller and really make some awesome power

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Big Bores mean big valves, in a moderate stroke
motor. Big carbs are used and as the r's go
up in the motor, air flow is increased. The
velocity is less at low speed in a 440 vs 413.
The slightly smaller valves in the 413 actually
have a better velocity at low speed than the 440.
Flowing more air with better heads works, but
bore/stroke combo of the 413 would favor a good
flowing head with higher intake port velocity.
This is the key to running a strong 413. Like
I said not an upstairs motor, but plenty of
torque to hold it's own anyplace, short of a full
race or class-type motor.

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You are completly wrong, the 440 turning the same RPM weather it is low RPM or high RPM will have a higher port velocity if they are equiped with everything else identicle except bore size, it is because of the cubic inches NOT the bore size. The 440 will suck 220 cubic inches of air in one revolution the 413 will only suck 206.5 cubic inches of air per revolution, if you have the exact same size port then the air will have to move faster to flow 220 cubic inches through it then it will to flow 206.5 cubic inches of air. Velocity in a port is determined by cubic volume of air flowed VS the size of the port through witch it flows.

IF your statement was true than throw in the 383 RB motor and it will make more low RPM TQ than the mighty 413 and the Chrysler engineers knew this yet they kept makeing the engines with bigger and bigger bores to slow them down and make less TQ

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As it was said before, 440's will have the upstair
power due to it larger bore. things will will be tight between them at low and midrange.

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As it was said before, 440's will have the upstair
power due to it larger bore. things will will be tight between them at low and midrange.

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Still wrong on all counts. The 440 will crush it with low RPM tq due to the cubic inches and it will smash it on top end because of the ability to flow more air with a bigger bore and less shrouded valves. The low RPM TQ is a direct derivitive of the cubic inches and the 440 will kill an equally equipped 413.

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um WRONG. small bores BIG strokes.. thats what wins in a killer street engine. being of EQUAL cubic inches mind you.

JUST FOR AN EXAMPLE:
TOP FUEL ENGINES:

4.1875" bore x 4.500" stroke

remember kids.. just an example.. i know that isn't a street engine and its supercharged, but
yet they choose to make the engine that way.

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I've heard Andy is secretly working on a new book.
Here's a sneak preview...






Just ribbin' ya Andy!

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He sent me an advance copy. I hate to play spoiler but I will.

1st chapter outlines finding a 440 to build, or finding the best deal on a megablock.

2nd chapter details removing the 413 from your car.

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My apologies to the "low buck, grass roots, 1/4mi
1/8mi, warriors who have the LOVE for the sport
and the SPIRIT OF INNOVATION. Ignore the negative
posts and simply build what you desire to build.
Never "fall into the trap" of popular is best, or
got to have a certain engine,let me trade or junk
what I have. Sure there is a thing that there is
no replacement for displacement. That may not be
a universal rule for some of us. Run what you have, KNOW YOUR ENGINE AND IT'S LIMITATIONS whether it be a 225/6 or a 440 (and every displacement between the two). As far as you 440
guys honking about your buildups being better than
413's and 426's, I don't hear you squawking about SHUTTIN' DOWN HEMIS. Cmon now, they have 14 less
cubes than you, what's the problem. Could it be
some of you are simply "street bullies" that like
to pick on their lower displacement sibilings to the point of MAKING EVERYONE RUN 440's. Some
innovative spirit, guys. Get real. The horsepower
race is on the decline. TORQUE IN THE RIGHT RANGE,
and consistency will outweigh SOME horsepower
advantages. Parts break less, engine/trannies last much longer and the car is much more fun to drive. Don't get me wrong, horsepower IS needed
but torque is KING. Example: The Buick GS Series
Vehicles. Love them.

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8 pages! The 413 is not special, no way, it's a Legend by now...!



So, now we all agree that a 413 owns a 440 at just about anytime of the day I think it's time to move our 413-legend motor to the also legendary 426 Hemi.

If a lowly 440 can take a Hemi upto 4/5000 rpm, ofcourse you don't have to wonder how the legendary 413 would absolutely KILL the Hemi when it really comes down to it...

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As it was said before, 440's will have the upstair
power due to it larger bore. things will will be tight between them at low and midrange.

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Still wrong on all counts. The 440 will crush it with low RPM tq due to the cubic inches and it will smash it on top end because of the ability to flow more air with a bigger bore and less shrouded valves. The low RPM TQ is a direct derivitive of the cubic inches and the 440 will kill an equally equipped 413.

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um WRONG. small bores BIG strokes.. thats what wins in a killer street engine. being of EQUAL cubic inches mind you.

JUST FOR AN EXAMPLE:
TOP FUEL ENGINES:

4.1875" bore x 4.500" stroke

remember kids.. just an example.. i know that isn't a street engine and its supercharged, but
yet they choose to make the engine that way.

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Following YOUR logic... If the smallest bores and longest stroke makes the most TQ and TQ wins races then how the hell come we don't all run 225 slant six's and slaughter the competition? Bet you didn't know the 225 had the longest stroke of almost ANY engine put in a car since about 1960 and one of the smallest bores of the muscle car era, the smallest bore and the longest stroke, and to further make it the king it has the smallest valves and ports of any mopar motor from the muscle era... it should even kill the mighty Hemi any day of the week ! Heck if only the 18 wheelers knew of the 225 they could save all that money on 1000 cube catapiller diesels they run. The fact is your logic is completly wrong, the 440 will make more TQ because it has more DISPLACEMENT. No one ever said a 413 is slow so you need to quit repeating it, re-read the post genious. The only things people have said about it are it will make less TQ than an equally built 440 and pistons are expensive customs or expensive lo-po replacement pistons and you could buy a 440 and build it cheaper and make more TQ doing it. Stop trying to put words in peoples mouths.