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External balance 360 will this combo need rebalanced #585067 01/17/10 02:02 AM 01/17/10 02:02 AM
Joined: Mar 2008 Posts: 724 PA USA F flatiron OP super stock
flatiron OP super stock F Joined: Mar 2008 Posts: 724 PA USA	Stock rods/Arp bolts Stock crank KB 107'S Sealed power rings ZE-251K30 BM Flexplate BMM 10236 Summit bracket racer damper Sum-C4278 Just a Mild bracket motor my first build hoping to turn it to 6500 RPM. Will I need to get this combo rebalanced will it be worth the $225.00 to do so.

Re: External balance 360 will this combo need rebalanced [Re: flatiron] #585068 01/17/10 02:19 AM 01/17/10 02:19 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 9,826 las vegas 70AARcuda master
70AARcuda master Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 9,826 las vegas	i believe a stock piston weight around 580 grams.. the kb 107 weight in at 502 grams.. stock pin should be 160 grams kb 107 pin is 132.... you are shedding some weight....i would rebalance... Tony 70 AARCuda Vitamin C 71 Dart Swinger 360 10.318 @ 128.22(10-04-14 Bakersfield) 71 Demon 360 10.666 @122.41 (01-29-17 @ Las Vegas) 71 Duster 408 (10.29 @ 127.86 3/16/19 Las Vegas)

Re: External balance 360 will this combo need rebalanced [Re: flatiron] #585069 01/17/10 04:55 AM 01/17/10 04:55 AM
Joined: Feb 2007 Posts: 1,025 Las Vegas, NV dodgeboy11 super stock
dodgeboy11 super stock Joined: Feb 2007 Posts: 1,025 Las Vegas, NV	And to add to that, the factory balance factors on the balancers and torque converters tends to vary a bit. So getting things balanced with your balancer and flexplate will make it a much happier engine.

Re: External balance 360 will this combo need rebalanced [Re: dodgeboy11] #585070 01/17/10 08:26 AM 01/17/10 08:26 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,200 Upper Midwest M MoparforLife Too Many Posts
MoparforLife Too Many Posts M Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,200 Upper Midwest	I know of a lot of them that use after market pistons whether KB's or others that aren't (both big and small block) than like long healthy, reliable lives on the street and the strip. None have the shakes like so many here try to lead you to believe will happen if you don't spend the $$$ to rebalance. Mine is one of the many. 'Course we aren't spinning unGodly high numbers either. 6-6200 tops is the norm. Clean it, if it's Dirty. Oil it, if it Squeaks. But: Don't fix it, if it Works!

Re: External balance 360 will this combo need rebalanced [Re: MoparforLife] #585071 01/17/10 10:48 AM 01/17/10 10:48 AM
Joined: Mar 2008 Posts: 724 PA USA F flatiron OP super stock
flatiron OP super stock F Joined: Mar 2008 Posts: 724 PA USA	Quote: I know of a lot of them that use after market pistons whether KB's or others that aren't (both big and small block) than like long healthy, reliable lives on the street and the strip. None have the shakes like so many here try to lead you to believe will happen if you don't spend the $$$ to rebalance. Mine is one of the many. 'Course we aren't spinning unGodly high numbers either. 6-6200 tops is the norm. Well thats what had me wondering I imagine over the years there has been thousands and thousands of 360's built and how many of them have been rebalanced. I want to spin mine to about 6500 In my build I'm just really curious how much of a difference I would see or I should say what the pros and cons would be

Re: External balance 360 will this combo need rebalanced [Re: flatiron] #585072 01/17/10 11:26 AM 01/17/10 11:26 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 75,008 U.S.S.A. JohnRR I Win
JohnRR I Win Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 75,008 U.S.S.A.	Quote: Quote: I know of a lot of them that use after market pistons whether KB's or others that aren't (both big and small block) than like long healthy, reliable lives on the street and the strip. None have the shakes like so many here try to lead you to believe will happen if you don't spend the $$$ to rebalance. Mine is one of the many. 'Course we aren't spinning unGodly high numbers either. 6-6200 tops is the norm. Well thats what had me wondering I imagine over the years there has been thousands and thousands of 360's built and how many of them have been rebalanced. I want to spin mine to about 6500 In my build I'm just really curious how much of a difference I would see or I should say what the pros and cons would be The con is you could/more than likely end up with a vibration that will eventually hurt something , it will cost you MORE to have it corrected than it will to just do it now. that is a very big difference in the weights of the stock parts to the new parts.

Re: External balance 360 will this combo need rebalanced [Re: MoparforLife] #585073 01/17/10 11:27 AM 01/17/10 11:27 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 75,008 U.S.S.A. JohnRR I Win
JohnRR I Win Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 75,008 U.S.S.A.	Quote: I know of a lot of them that use after market pistons whether KB's or others that aren't (both big and small block) than like long healthy, reliable lives on the street and the strip. None have the shakes like so many here try to lead you to believe will happen if you don't spend the $$$ to rebalance. Mine is one of the many. 'Course we aren't spinning unGodly high numbers either. 6-6200 tops is the norm. I really want to hear the story of how you got royally screwed because all you do is bash machine shops whenever someone asks a question related to one ...

Re: External balance 360 will this combo need rebalanced [Re: flatiron] #585074 01/17/10 11:51 AM 01/17/10 11:51 AM
Joined: Jun 2003 Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI MR_P_BODY Master
MR_P_BODY Master Joined: Jun 2003 Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI	Quote: Stock rods/Arp bolts Stock crank KB 107'S Sealed power rings ZE-251K30 BM Flexplate BMM 10236 Summit bracket racer damper Sum-C4278 Just a Mild bracket motor my first build hoping to turn it to 6500 RPM. Will I need to get this combo rebalanced will it be worth the $225.00 to do so. In one word... yes... factory Mopar engines had/have the worst balance out there and your making it worse JMO... but for the few bucks its worth it to me

Re: External balance 360 will this combo need rebalanced [Re: MR_P_BODY] #585075 01/17/10 12:02 PM 01/17/10 12:02 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,200 Upper Midwest M MoparforLife Too Many Posts
MoparforLife Too Many Posts M Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,200 Upper Midwest	Quote: Quote: Stock rods/Arp bolts Stock crank KB 107'S Sealed power rings ZE-251K30 BM Flexplate BMM 10236 Summit bracket racer damper Sum-C4278 Just a Mild bracket motor my first build hoping to turn it to 6500 RPM. Will I need to get this combo rebalanced will it be worth the $225.00 to do so. In one word... yes... factory Mopar engines had/have the worst balance out there and your making it worse JMO... but for the few bucks its worth it to me I would like to know where this got started too. I have talked to alot of good machine shops that do a lot of race engines for all brands and they tell me that the mmopars are no worse than any other. As for me getting screwed by a shop I haven't but have been around a long time and have seen a lot of builds both ways. have also seen many builds where only one or 2 cylinders were bored to 'patch' and engine and they went many biles with no vibs or problems. As for rebuild, sure they are meant for street engines but a lot of them are run harder with less care than race engines and take a beating and keep going. so if it ain't needed why spend the bucks. If I plan on spinning my engine into the high numbers I will go all the way. But until then I will spend my money elsewhere and not support the machine shops for any more than I have to. And yes I have good friends in some of these shops and they go along with what I say. Do what you please and spend your money where you want. If you think that every engine that gets rebuild or rebored or a piston swap gets a rebalance - you better think again. The machine shops I use aren't out to spend every bodies money for them.

Re: External balance 360 will this combo need rebalanced [Re: MoparforLife] #585076 01/17/10 12:21 PM 01/17/10 12:21 PM
Joined: Jun 2003 Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI MR_P_BODY Master
MR_P_BODY Master Joined: Jun 2003 Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI	I would like to know where this got started too. Its called testing.... in the lab at Chrysler we tested competitor stuff all the time... the engine lab did testing to see if we were better or worse... well we were the worst.... its not just a one time thing, its done all the time... for Chrysler it was a dollar thing... it cost more to get it closer, they felt at the time it wasnt beneficial to change... now days companies are trying much harder to be the best but its still a dollar value

Re: External balance 360 will this combo need rebalanced [Re: flatiron] #585077 01/17/10 01:07 PM 01/17/10 01:07 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 5,894 Florida Locomotion master
Locomotion master Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 5,894 Florida	Quote: Stock rods/Arp bolts Stock crank KB 107'S Sealed power rings ZE-251K30 BM Flexplate BMM 10236 Summit bracket racer damper Sum-C4278 Just a Mild bracket motor my first build hoping to turn it to 6500 RPM. Will I need to get this combo rebalanced will it be worth the $225.00 to do so. Just because you might not "feel" the imbalance doesn't mean it's "right". The more you invest in your engine and the longer you want to keep it, the better deal the $225.00 balance job is. The longevity, HP, torque, fuel mileage, etc. may not be a lot or obvious, but there is a difference. I'm rather bias towards paying attention to details. But particularly in rule-limited class cars like IHRA/NHRA Stock, you have to pay attention to details to try & make more HP than the other guy, not to mention keeping the engine performing as well as it can. If you don't want to spend the money or simply can't, it will get you by. But it's not "right", or as good as it could be. Besides, if the pistons are lighter, that means you'll be getting a little more weight removed from the crank side for an even lighter overall rotating assembly! I just remembered that we recently had a similar debate about balancing slicks. Same statements apply. Last edited by Locomotion; 01/17/10 01:14 PM.

Re: External balance 360 will this combo need rebalanced [Re: Locomotion] #585078 01/17/10 01:28 PM 01/17/10 01:28 PM
Joined: Mar 2008 Posts: 724 PA USA F flatiron OP super stock
flatiron OP super stock F Joined: Mar 2008 Posts: 724 PA USA	I thank you all for your input most of you know I've only been around a short time and have alot to learn and sometimes I'm a bit of a pain with all the questions I have and then questions about your answers. What brought this up is I went to the machine shop Friday and I asked him who does his Balance work and that started us on a conversation about how many engines are rebuilt and modified and not rebalanced. His feelings was that it is a great idea and does help but not absoultly a must. My rotating assembly from Damper to BM flexplate is headed to the shop.

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