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Re: disc conv - a body spindles w/ f body everything el
[Re: dvw]
#54965
03/24/08 02:20 PM
03/24/08 02:20 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,471
So Cal
autoxcuda
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,471
So Cal
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Quote:
The chart I saw did not show excessive bump steer.
Maybe I missed somthing. I've always thought toe change (bump steer) resulted from different arcs between the tie rod assy and lower control arm. the imaginary box formed by the inner and outer tie rod pivot points along with the lower control arm pivot and lower ball joint contols the arcs radius and length. If the horizontal sides and vertical sides of the box are the same length,there should be no bump steer. I fail to see how the upper arm influences bump steer. I'm always willing to learn. My real life experiences with these knuckles have worked well.
Doug
Just having the tie rod length equal to the lower control arm length alone does not assure 0 bump. They have to be on the same exact paths.
In your box analogy, the tie rod ends have to be at the exact same height from the ground and make a right angle box with the lower control arm (not just a parallelogram). Sounds good, but because the out tie rod is moved inward to get Ackermann, the box is never a right angle.
The more suspension travel the harder it is to get the least bump possible. You'll rarely if ever get 0 bump on a bump steer gauge over a big range like 2" droop and 3" compression. Compromises...
Quote:
Trust me a new Colorado P/U is far worse than either one.
Have you ran that one on a bump steer gauge?
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Re: disc conv - a body spindles w/ f body everything else?
#54967
03/24/08 06:23 PM
03/24/08 06:23 PM
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 5,337
the house on the left.
cogen80
master
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master
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 5,337
the house on the left.
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Quote:
I’ve heard a lot of enthusiasts say that using the A-Body spindles is not necessary as they use the taller spindles from B/R and FMJ-Bodies. Personally, I’d rather error on the side of the leading professionals who have made their careers in the high performance Mopar area of interest as well as original Chrysler engineers who developed these cars in the first place. Check out the quotes and the provided links below. I know this will probably ruffle a lot of feathers out there, but that’s okay, it’s only my opinion. And if people choose to use taller spindles in their disc brake swaps, that just means more available A-Body spindles for the rest of us, heck! Everybody wins... 
“Do not succumb to the temptation to use "lookalike" knuckles from later Mopars, such as 73-up B/R-bodies, F/J/M bodies, etc. These parts, while visually very similar, are taller, altering suspension geometry (camber change, bump steer, etc.), and possibly forcing the ball joints beyond their designed range, a/k/a “over angling”. - Richard Ehrenberg, Mopar Action
“Using the correct knuckle avoids any of these potential pitfalls, and results in a "factory engineered" installation. Hey, Chrysler paid those engineers big bucks to get it right, so you might as well take advantage of their know how. Plus, we're getting it for free!” - Richard Ehrenberg, Mopar Action
“The later style casting shown on the right came on 1973 or later B body cars as well as the FMJ body cars. Even though it looks the same as the A body part, it will not work since it is too tall to maintain proper suspension geometry.” - Andy Finkbeiner, AR Engineering
http://www.moparaction.com/Tech/archive/disc-main.html
http://www.arengineering.com/
bla bla bla....
i'll listen to a guy i trust.
http://www.bigblockdart.com/techpages/spindles.shtml
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Re: disc conv - a body spindles w/ f body everything el
[Re: dvw]
#54968
03/24/08 06:34 PM
03/24/08 06:34 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,175
NC
DARTSPORT340
super gas
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super gas
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,175
NC
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Quote:
Trust me a new Colorado P/U is far worse than either one.
Doug
Thats not the only problems with the Colorados lol have ya'll got any with the burn valve/cyl head replacment bulliten? 
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Re: disc conv - a body spindles w/ f body everything el
[Re: dvw]
#54970
03/24/08 07:48 PM
03/24/08 07:48 PM
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 3,075
Eastern Ohio
mopowergtx
master
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master
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 3,075
Eastern Ohio
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Quote:
I've enjoyed Ricks articles for years. Over the years he has had more imformative Mopar articles than anyone. Heck they even did an article on my car once. But in this case I stand firm. These knuckles flat out work.
Doug
I agree, Rick is a wealth of Mopar knowledge and I greatly value his opinions and tips, and myself I always try to stick to the stock setup on anything I do if at all possible. But it does seem like too many guys have run and tested the FMJ spindles to dismiss that they work. I'd agree if you have the 73-76 spindles definately use them but like I said your not going to find them in yards around here. Diplomats, not thats another story. I think every yard has one of them. To each his own. 
Theres more than one way to skin a cat.
And old dogs are hard to teach new tricks.  
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Re: disc conv - a body spindles w/ f body everything el
[Re: mopowergtx]
#54971
03/24/08 09:45 PM
03/24/08 09:45 PM
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
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when the correct parts are not hard to procure.
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I assume your meaning the 73-76 A-body spindles? I sure as heck cant find them in any junkyard yards here in OHIO. But you can find Diplomats/5th Avenues around for the F,M,J body spindles no problem.
I’ll agree with that. I scoured all the wreaking yards in my general area and couldn’t find any 73 to 76 A-Body spindles for sale. Some said they crushed those cars long ago. I did find some 73 Darts with spindles, but they were complete cars and not available for parting. So I tried opening my search to everybody in moparts.com. You place a want add in A-Body parts, or keep your eye on A-Body parts for sale and you’ll find them. But you have to be quick, it took me a few tries, but I finally landed a pair and at a great price too.
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Re: disc conv - a body spindles w/ f body everything el
[Re: meepmeep70]
#54978
11/07/08 05:53 PM
11/07/08 05:53 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,080
U.S.S.A.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,080
U.S.S.A.
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Quote:
i used 73 duster spindles on my 70 road runner,and the calipers mount to the front,so what brake line hoses would i want to order? thanks for any direction 
what calipers do you have ? since your car originally had calipers mounted to the front all you need is a brake hose that is the same length as what your car would have wit hthe correct end on the hose for the caliper , shouldn't be hard to get at the local parts store .
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for $800. I cant get rid of it for nothing 