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Re: Rocker shaft shimmimg [Re: CrAzYMoPaRGuY] #376785 07/16/09 11:42 AM 07/16/09 11:42 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,200 Upper Midwest M MoparforLife Too Many Posts
MoparforLife Too Many Posts M Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,200 Upper Midwest	Quote: Quote: Quote: Quote: Do your math and you will see that you gained .010 didn't loose it. Using a shim will actually make things worse. You milled .030 and used a .040 gasket. Therefore you increased the distance not decreased. By milling .030 and using a .040 you actually lost ground. Put it together and forget the shims they will make things worse. I'm hoping I'm OK with the .010 difference... I'm doing the math trust me! I cut the head .030 = .030" LESS distance I increased the head gasket from .020"ish to .040"ish = .020 MORE distance .030 less distance from the cut and .020" more distance from the DIFFERENCE in head gasket thickness makes a total of .010" LESS DISTANCE. Not more. My heads are .010" closer to the cam centerline than before. I think you forgot to factor in the original .020"ish steel shim factory head gasket in your equation.... that was REPLACED by a .040" Felpro... Ether way,your good to go without shims. BTW, why would you want to cut the heads .030 and then add .020 back with a thicker head gasket??? I wanted to run the FelPro composite gaskets and increase my compression as opposed to REDUCE the compression. I also didn't want to affect my intake mating, and I've done the .030" cut with Felpro gaskets many times before.... I coulda just cut the heads .020", but I would STILL be checking my lifter preload, the heads have been redone by others and I'm not sure I trust the work! It's a 9:1 engine, I can't afford to drop compression! Even compensating for the .020 gasket difference (which I admit miscalculated) a .010 gain isn't a noticable cut no matter how you look at it. It is really no more than a truing trim. You won't even notice a difference. Many thousands of .010 or even up to .040 gains in cutting have been made with no problems or shimming.

Re: Rocker shaft shimmimg [Re: CrAzYMoPaRGuY] #376786 07/16/09 02:16 PM 07/16/09 02:16 PM
Joined: May 2005 Posts: 292 Keizer, Oregon D Dadrules enthusiast
Dadrules enthusiast D Joined: May 2005 Posts: 292 Keizer, Oregon	I thought I had a similar issue with a small block, the blocked was decked so pistons sat at .000 and used cometics .038 gaskets. bought shims, dykemed (sp?) the top of the valve stem to watch how the pattern changed with different thicknesses of shims and learned I didn't need shims, the pattern from the roller on the rocker was closest to right over the valve stem without shims. I'd bought a set of custom length pushrods from Smith Bros in Bend Oregon and everything lined up right, two threads showing from the bottom. I had added Hughes 1.6 roller rockers so I learned I needed to be paying attention to how the bottom of the adjuster and the cup on the pushrod got oiled and that's what led me to custom pushrods. they turned around my order in 48 hours.

Re: Rocker shaft shimmimg [Re: JohnRR] #376787 07/16/09 04:56 PM 07/16/09 04:56 PM
Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 16,479 Canada CrAzYMoPaRGuY OP I Live Here
CrAzYMoPaRGuY OP I Live Here Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 16,479 Canada	Quote: Then you have not been paying attention , shims are for correcting VALVE TO ROCKER GEOMETRY , NOT making up for head/block machining . LOL Quote: Then why are you running a thicker composite gasket ??? the .010 more you gained might have raised your compression what .1 ??? I prefer the Felpro composiute gasket to a steel shim gasket, and my heads had a terrible surface on them to boot. Looks like somebody sanded them with a rock before the engine was last put together.... Now... Can we get back on topic, it's ROCKER SHIMS I want to know about, not different ideas, different theories, how I can use shims for this, not for that... ROCKER SHIMS. Is there a difference between types, vendors,... or? CrAzYMoPaRGuY

Re: Rocker shaft shimmimg [Re: CrAzYMoPaRGuY] #376788 07/16/09 05:04 PM 07/16/09 05:04 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 75,008 U.S.S.A. JohnRR I Win
JohnRR I Win Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 75,008 U.S.S.A.	Quote: Quote: Then you have not been paying attention , shims are for correcting VALVE TO ROCKER GEOMETRY , NOT making up for head/block machining . LOL Quote: Then why are you running a thicker composite gasket ??? the .010 more you gained might have raised your compression what .1 ??? I prefer the Felpro composiute gasket to a steel shim gasket, and my heads had a terrible surface on them to boot. Looks like somebody sanded them with a rock before the engine was last put together.... Now... Can we get back on topic, it's ROCKER SHIMS I want to know about, not different ideas, different theories, how I can use shims for this, not for that... ROCKER SHIMS. Is there a difference between types, vendors,... or? nce again , get your pencil ready ... Something must be being lost in the translation from English to Canadian ???? If it ain't broke don't break it ...

Re: Rocker shaft shimmimg [Re: JohnRR] #376789 07/16/09 05:50 PM 07/16/09 05:50 PM
Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 16,479 Canada CrAzYMoPaRGuY OP I Live Here
CrAzYMoPaRGuY OP I Live Here Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 16,479 Canada	Quote: Quote: Quote: Then you have not been paying attention , shims are for correcting VALVE TO ROCKER GEOMETRY , NOT making up for head/block machining . LOL Quote: Then why are you running a thicker composite gasket ??? the .010 more you gained might have raised your compression what .1 ??? I prefer the Felpro composiute gasket to a steel shim gasket, and my heads had a terrible surface on them to boot. Looks like somebody sanded them with a rock before the engine was last put together.... Now... Can we get back on topic, it's ROCKER SHIMS I want to know about, not different ideas, different theories, how I can use shims for this, not for that... ROCKER SHIMS. Is there a difference between types, vendors,... or? nce again , get your pencil ready ... Something must be being lost in the translation from English to Canadian ???? If it ain't broke don't break it ... NEXT!!!!! Can it get any more painful? Either reply about certain types of shims or continue and AHHH, the beauty of MoParts..... CrAzYMoPaRGuY

Re: Rocker shaft shimmimg [Re: CrAzYMoPaRGuY] #376790 07/16/09 09:45 PM 07/16/09 09:45 PM
Joined: Aug 2005 Posts: 11,543 chicagoland,usa B buildanother I Live Here
buildanother I Live Here B Joined: Aug 2005 Posts: 11,543 chicagoland,usa	Wow. all this back and forth, are you understanding that shimming the shaft up will be changing the rocker tip to valve stem geometry like mentioned?

Re: Rocker shaft shimmimg [Re: buildanother] #376791 07/16/09 10:10 PM 07/16/09 10:10 PM
Joined: May 2007 Posts: 430 New Hampshire n_bogie1984 mopar
n_bogie1984 mopar Joined: May 2007 Posts: 430 New Hampshire	ok i have no clue on rocker shims but as the guy said he don't care about every ones ideas on what is doing, he just wants to know the products, and what to look for. best of luck getting your info cause i dont see this going anywhere fast

Re: Rocker shaft shimmimg [Re: n_bogie1984] #376792 07/16/09 10:14 PM 07/16/09 10:14 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 32,930 Grand Prairie,Texas stumpy I Win
stumpy I Win Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 32,930 Grand Prairie,Texas	Mancinni sells the tapered shims.

Re: Rocker shaft shimmimg [Re: stumpy] #376793 07/16/09 10:27 PM 07/16/09 10:27 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,200 Upper Midwest M MoparforLife Too Many Posts
MoparforLife Too Many Posts M Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,200 Upper Midwest	I really don't see why poster thinks that shims or special length push rods would be nessessary with the little bit (.010) gained in the milling & gasket usage which like said before is nothing more than a minor truing trim and done everyday and put back together. It very likly would button back up even with the original gasket thickness with no problem.

Re: Rocker shaft shimmimg [Re: 1_WILD_RT] #376794 07/16/09 10:36 PM 07/16/09 10:36 PM
Joined: Jan 2004 Posts: 27,347 Today? Who Knows? 1_WILD_RT Management Trainee
1_WILD_RT Management Trainee Joined: Jan 2004 Posts: 27,347 Today? Who Knows?	Quote: FWIW the amount your shimming shouldn't be a problem...Mancini sells them... http://chucker54.stores.yahoo.net/rocshafshim1.html As I posted yesterday...

Re: Rocker shaft shimmimg [Re: 1_WILD_RT] #376795 07/16/09 10:40 PM 07/16/09 10:40 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,200 Upper Midwest M MoparforLife Too Many Posts
MoparforLife Too Many Posts M Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,200 Upper Midwest	Quote: Quote: FWIW the amount your shimming shouldn't be a problem...Mancini sells them... http://chucker54.stores.yahoo.net/rocshafshim1.html As I posted yesterday... Why??? No Need. One more un-needed potential problem.

Re: Rocker shaft shimmimg [Re: buildanother] #376796 07/16/09 10:59 PM 07/16/09 10:59 PM
Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 16,479 Canada CrAzYMoPaRGuY OP I Live Here
CrAzYMoPaRGuY OP I Live Here Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 16,479 Canada	Quote: Wow. all this back and forth, are you understanding that shimming the shaft up will be changing the rocker tip to valve stem geometry like mentioned? Yup. That's pretty simple. I don't find anybody reading what I REQUESTED except for a very few.... Thanks for the link 1 WILD RT This sums it up guys... I was just looking for opinions on ACTUAL PRODUCT. That's all. From n bogie1984... Quote: ok i have no clue on rocker shims but as the guy said he don't care about every ones ideas on what is doing, he just wants to know the products, and what to look for. CrAzYMoPaRGuY

Re: Rocker shaft shimmimg [Re: stumpy] #376797 07/16/09 11:01 PM 07/16/09 11:01 PM
Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 16,479 Canada CrAzYMoPaRGuY OP I Live Here
CrAzYMoPaRGuY OP I Live Here Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 16,479 Canada	Quote: Mancinni sells the tapered shims. Thanks Stumpy. I saw the above link, I'm gonna buy some and see what they look like... CrAzYMoPaRGuY

Re: Rocker shaft shimmimg [Re: MoparforLife] #376798 07/16/09 11:02 PM 07/16/09 11:02 PM
Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 16,479 Canada CrAzYMoPaRGuY OP I Live Here
CrAzYMoPaRGuY OP I Live Here Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 16,479 Canada	Quote: I really don't see why poster thinks that shims or special length push rods would be nessessary with the little bit (.010) gained in the milling & gasket usage which like said before is nothing more than a minor truing trim and done everyday and put back together. It very likly would button back up even with the original gasket thickness with no problem. I just want them on hand in case, and I want to buy some out of curiosity. That's it! CrAzYMoPaRGuY

Re: Rocker shaft shimmimg [Re: CrAzYMoPaRGuY] #376799 07/16/09 11:14 PM 07/16/09 11:14 PM
Joined: Jul 2008 Posts: 403 NE Ohio 7 71 FJ6 Charger mopar
71 FJ6 Charger mopar 7 Joined: Jul 2008 Posts: 403 NE Ohio	'71 383HP FJ6 Charger SE

Re: Rocker shaft shimmimg [Re: 71 FJ6 Charger] #376800 07/17/09 12:04 AM 07/17/09 12:04 AM
Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 16,479 Canada CrAzYMoPaRGuY OP I Live Here
CrAzYMoPaRGuY OP I Live Here Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 16,479 Canada	Quote: THAT'S IT!!!!!!! I'm gonna go cause trouble in the General Forum!!!!!!!!! CrAzYMoPaRGuY

Re: Rocker shaft shimmimg [Re: CrAzYMoPaRGuY] #376801 07/17/09 07:39 AM 07/17/09 07:39 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,200 Upper Midwest M MoparforLife Too Many Posts
MoparforLife Too Many Posts M Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,200 Upper Midwest	http://www.hughesengines.com/Index/produ...word&page=3

Re: Rocker shaft shimmimg [Re: buildanother] #376802 07/17/09 09:43 AM 07/17/09 09:43 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 75,008 U.S.S.A. JohnRR I Win
JohnRR I Win Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 75,008 U.S.S.A.	Quote: Wow. all this back and forth, are you understanding that shimming the shaft up will be changing the rocker tip to valve stem geometry like mentioned? He OBVIOUSLY does not CARE that he's fixing ... fixing ??? ... his NON ISSUE incorrectly.

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