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Re: New Paint job on a budget thread. [Re: Marq] #37394
08/26/07 11:26 PM
08/26/07 11:26 PM

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Quote:

The acetone will flash much quicker.... BUT you better have an oxygen tank slapped on your back to avoid breathing the fumes. And don't have any open source flames where you are putting that acetone laced vapor into the air.

The main flaw I would suspect with the paint flashing too quickly is that it is not going to allow the paint the time to naturally self level.

And acetone is pretty nasty stuff all round. Acetone can eat into plastics, remove enamels, cleans hardened nail polish etc. So based on acetones nasty ability to eat things prior to it evaporating and drying, my biggest fear would be that when the second coat is sprayed the acetone will spend half of its energy trying to eat the paint layer below and the other half of its energy evaporating. IF it is able to eat or soften the lower layer of hardened paint, I suspect you would get a bad case of orange peel or elephant skin

But most importantly keep the health reason in the back of your mind if you plan to experiment with acetone...
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good point Marq !
(BTW - Thanks for all of your posts !
Like many others I started reading the whole thread and when I finally finished it, it was obvious to me who the big contributors have been all along, have a lot of respect for you, Exit, Aussie and of course Charger)

I did 2 coats of regular gloss rustoleum, wetsand, and a couple of coats of Brightside White on the Hood and I just finished wetsanding it with 2000, I am waiting for some pads and Poorboys stuff to get here and I'll put my new Porter Cable to work and make that baby shine !

I will do a quick test one of these days using acetone, but as always, I do it outside, not inside the garage, because I have 2 Cobras in the garage, don't want any overspray on them.


Re: New Paint job on a budget thread. #37395
08/27/07 12:20 AM
08/27/07 12:20 AM

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for spraying thick coats instead of rolling thin coats i can see why the faster flash of the acetone thinned paint would be better....

I have a question for the "porter cable" users...

what rpm do you buff at to get the good shine your getting?
I have a cheap buffer with one speed of 2500 rpm's....

Re: New Paint job on a budget thread. #37396
08/27/07 04:58 PM
08/27/07 04:58 PM

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I got the paint on pretty satisfactorily and am at the color sanding stage. I am using Meguiar's swirl remover (step one) and following it up with their polishing liquid (step two). It has worked pretty well with my cheapie orbital buffer and shines pretty good, but on a couple of panels I am getting a streaky haze. It's a whitish haze that seems like a wax build up but when I buff it again it comes back later... any ideas? These were the last two panels I did..did I let the buffing pads get too dirty or build up too much polish?

What now?

Re: New Paint job on a budget thread. #37397
08/27/07 06:11 PM
08/27/07 06:11 PM

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Give your buffing pads a good clean by soaking them in a bucket with either the proper buffing pad cleaner or dishwashing liquid, then rinse them in clean water until they look like new.

Wash those two panels with dishwashing liquid instead of a car wash solution and hit those panels with your swirl remover again. Use a high speed (3/4 to full speed)setting on the polisher and really work the polish in until there is hardly any residue left on the panel.

If that clears it up then do a couple of passes with the polish and you should be good. If it doesn't clear it up you might have to try a lighter grade swirl remover to help clean it up.

Re: New Paint job on a budget thread. #37398
08/27/07 08:42 PM
08/27/07 08:42 PM
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Quote:



good point Marq ! (BTW - Thanks for all of your posts ! Like many others I started reading the whole thread and when I finally finished it, it was obvious to me who the big contributors have been all along, have a lot of respect for you, Exit, Aussie and of course Charger)






Look into my eyes... look deeply into my eyes... you are beginning to feel sleepy from inhaling paint fumes. Your eye lids are getting heavy as you are falling deeper and deeper in to sleep. When I count to three you will wake up... and immediately sign the pink slip of the blue Cobra over to me for no charge... ONE.... TWO.... three...

Thanks for the kind words. I try to do my part

three.. !
Three.. !!
THREE... !!! Whats a matter.. can't you hear me...

Darn.. it didn't work.... ;(

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.

Last edited by Marq; 08/28/07 12:18 AM.
Re: New Paint job on a budget thread. #37399
08/28/07 05:27 AM
08/28/07 05:27 AM

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Quote:

If you have orange peel in the paint that you don't want once it's polished then keep wetsanding until it's all gone.

Once you have finished painting then don't worry about finding the cause of the orange peel unless you plan on painting another car. My guess of the cause though would be not enough thinning.





I may or may not attempt another car in the future - but I still need help with this one because I've only done 3 out of 10 panels so far. I took a cautious approach to this because I was still slightly skeptical about rollering a whole vehicle, so I started out doing a comparison - I rollered my tailgate and sprayed my hood, convinced that the spraying would yield better and easier results. How I wish I would've done the opposite! Oh well, I'm learning as I go.

I'm in the middle of doing the roof now, and I will definitely be rollering the rest of the truck entirely. I tried going a little thinner with the mix this time, and now I'm pretty sure that didn't cause my slight orange peel, because it began to run/sag on the roof sides as I applied it. I'm beginning to think maybe I nitpicked a little on the tailgate finish because what I'm seeing and calling "orange peel" isn't as bad as the word implied. I've seen factory finishes with a similar amount in dark colors. I probably could have wetsanded it away with a little more patience. You can see slight roller-strokes in one spot though (if you know to look) and that does bother me a little.

One quick observation for anyone else trying this for the first time - I'm on the 4th coat for the roof and I noticed I seem to be getting smoother results from sanding in a direction perpendicular to the direction I'm rolling (i.e. sanding north to south, painting east to west). It seems like such a simple thing, but I don't know if anyone else mentioned or tried that yet. At first I was worried I'd end up with a checkerboard effect, but that's not the case.

Thanks for all the great tips Aussie Driver, you can bet I'll be back for more!

Re: New Paint job on a budget thread. #37400
08/28/07 12:23 PM
08/28/07 12:23 PM
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Quote:

One quick observation for anyone else trying this for the first time - I'm on the 4th coat for the roof and I noticed I seem to be getting smoother results from sanding in a direction perpendicular to the direction I'm rolling (i.e. sanding north to south, painting east to west). It seems like such a simple thing, but I don't know if anyone else mentioned or tried that yet. At first I was worried I'd end up with a checkerboard effect, but that's not the case.




I don't know about that but it makes sense. I do know when painting a room its better to alternate directions with each coat when rolling. I've been painting a bedroom and practicing my technique with a big roller. Its also helping me to learn patience with the process. I ordered my paint yesterday for the car, Rustolem Industrial fire hydrant red. I'm going to start practicing on my cowl panel & trunk lid. The rest of the car isn't ready yet.

Last edited by 69stanger; 08/28/07 12:25 PM.

Freedom Of Speed!
Re: New Paint job on a budget thread. [Re: 69stanger] #37401
08/28/07 06:17 PM
08/28/07 06:17 PM

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Hi it's me again, the guy who cant seem to post pics, the same guy who said I will never be sold on the roller method....

...well I just picked up a quart of rustoleum gloss black and a HFD roller, and a can of 100% mineral spirits.... What the **** am I doing? Im about to roll paint onto the hood of my car! Cant make it look any worse I suppose, I'm the guy with a rattle canned black paint job on an old prelude. Wish I could just show the pics but somehow I cant post pics, maybe since my low post count my user privledges dont allow posting pics yet?
Well I am in fear that this will be a waste of twenty hard earned bucks today but the car needs repainted anyway so might as well experiment.... If I can make it look better than it is then I suppose the money was well spent?

I still think you guys are getting good results because you're going real crazy with the thinner which when I rattle canned it, that wasnt an option.....

I'm nervous about the whole thing.

And that wagner gun?
I'm really nervous about that....

sigh.
All the money Ive spent on 4 rattle can jobs and now i'm trying this roller method (on the hood) I coulda gone to maaco and got them to do a presidential.

Re: New Paint job on a budget thread. #37402
08/28/07 06:52 PM
08/28/07 06:52 PM

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Nah, I painted a test peice with the roller, had the mixture slightly thicker than water, and it does level itself out nice and the bubbles self pop, but theres a ton of dust and specs in the paint that arent there when you spray it. I wont be doing this, I cant bring myself to paint my car with a roller, I might as well go try that wagner gun for $60.

The rustoleum is super shiny, I can see my face in the paint and not just a blurry image either, I can see every ugly detail on me like a mirror.

I think my rattle can job of appliance epoxy was just a really hard coat of primer and if I get that wagner and spray the thinned rustoleum on there, I think I can get a shine.

But Ive thought that before and the results werent satisfactory.....
Well, since I'm determined, and perhaps a bit stupid, I'm going to get the wagner gun, maybe by this weekend.

I have one quart of gloss black, I'll get another quart of it and some dark navy blue because I want to add just a pinch of dark blue to the black.

Is 2 or maybe 2.5 quarts of paint enough to spray a couple coats with? Plus I'll have mor ewhen I add the thinner....


Last edited by MEAN88Si4WS; 08/28/07 07:03 PM.
Re: New Paint job on a budget thread. #37403
08/28/07 07:06 PM
08/28/07 07:06 PM

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Okay ten minutes later I look at the paint and my face has gotten blurrier, as it dries it loses the wet look, what we need is a paint that dries fast and doesnt lose the wet look..... Acetone for the win?

Re: New Paint job on a budget thread. #37404
08/28/07 07:12 PM
08/28/07 07:12 PM
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I think the acetone would dry way too fast to roll on. That is why I was asking about using it in a gun.

I haven't had a whole lot of experience with acetone, but can't imagine it would be a whole lot worse (for spraying) than laquers would be?

Brew

Re: New Paint job on a budget thread. [Re: tsbrewers] #37405
08/28/07 08:18 PM
08/28/07 08:18 PM

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Im soured on rustoleum I think. The test peice has dried dull. Maybe you can get it to look great with hours upon hours of polishing but I'm just not up to that job. I will pay the extra 40 bucks or whatever to get real auto enamel that dries shiny with no polishing. After all, thats what all my Maaco jobs have been, single stage cheap enamel, and they all looked great with no buffing whatsoever. They dont buff the 200 dollar job they spray it and push it out the door!

Last edited by MEAN88Si4WS; 08/28/07 08:19 PM.
Re: New Paint job on a budget thread. #37406
08/28/07 08:58 PM
08/28/07 08:58 PM

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Sounds like you are just too impatient, and dont want to spend any time.

There's too many great results being performed, providing you actually read all the post's, and follow instructions.

Re: New Paint job on a budget thread. #37407
08/28/07 10:23 PM
08/28/07 10:23 PM

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I really dont want to spend THAT much time, when I could just pony up the extra $40 for paint that needs no polishing..... It seems like the $50 paint job is $50 but 40 hours of hard labor, where as a real paint job might be $70 for a gallon of real auto paint, plus you need a paint gun, but it can be done in an afternoon and done with it.... Factor in the labor and its much cheaper to just spray real automotive paint on there....

Re: New Paint job on a budget thread. #37408
08/28/07 11:08 PM
08/28/07 11:08 PM
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My co-worker went that route on his s10. Bought regular auto primer, paint, and reducer, and an hvlp gun set. Once he figured out the proper settings on the gun to get a good coat, he'd already painted the entire truck and sanded it all off (because it looked like crap) 3 times. He finally got a good smooth coat of paint on it, but the clear coat is dull, almost like it's not even there. He did finally figure out the problem, but he's not going thru the hassle of sanding the truck and repainting it again. His total investment so far, not counting the guns, is about $400. That's why I'm going to try the roller method on my truck. I can't afford $400 for a do it myself paint job.

Re: New Paint job on a budget thread. [Re: dodgeram440] #37409
08/28/07 11:53 PM
08/28/07 11:53 PM

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Hi everyone -- first time posting here. I have read through ALL 3 threads on this topic, and have started it on my wagon (not a mopar, sorry) and thought I would post the progress. here.

I bought my paint a long time ago, tested it out on some scrap metal, then painted a motorcycle tank with this method. I finally started the prep work about a month ago on my car-- removed almost everything I can, and doing bodywork right now. Here's a picture of what I started with

the pic is about a year old -- it looks much better than it actually is -- paint is faded and dead all over.

Anyway, I'll post progress pics as I go. I'll get a pic of the current stage sometime tomorrow. Hoping to put on the first coat in the next few days.

Re: New Paint job on a budget thread. #37410
08/29/07 06:44 PM
08/29/07 06:44 PM

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Quote:

I really dont want to spend THAT much time, when I could just pony up the extra $40 for paint that needs no polishing..... It seems like the $50 paint job is $50 but 40 hours of hard labor, where as a real paint job might be $70 for a gallon of real auto paint, plus you need a paint gun, but it can be done in an afternoon and done with it.... Factor in the labor and its much cheaper to just spray real automotive paint on there....




Nowhere in this exhaustive thread does anybody say this is quicker or cheaper than spraying IF you already have the capital equipment and expertise. That is a big if.

Also, "Real" automotive paint requires you to mix reducers and hardeners in the right combinations for the atmospheric conditions. If you can't handle mixing mineral sprits with rustoleum, you are in for some real disappointment along with your $70 of "real" automotive paint.

And don't get me started about trash in the paint. If you don't have a clean place to roll, you definitely do not have a clean enough place to spray.

Cal96 got excellent results with regular Rustoleum and a Wagner, so it can be done:


If you require more gloss out of the can, might I suggest Brightside. AussieDriver has had good results:



Be realistic with your expectations. This method is not intended to be a shortcut. It is an alternative that allows for a quality paint job with A: little investment in cash and capital, and B: personal control over the finished product.

But it does require time and effort.

Cheap, Good, Quick - pick any two.



PS: If I have linked to images inappropriately, let me know.

Last edited by Mike Da Wrench; 08/29/07 07:18 PM.
Re: New Paint job on a budget thread. #37411
08/29/07 09:17 PM
08/29/07 09:17 PM

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I agree with Mike.

As for the 40 hours .... that might be enough time to get a car with ruff body and paint into condition for the next 40 hours of painting and 40 hours of precision wetsanding and polishing .... but you can cut that down using a better polisher than the $25 single speed ones that won't give the top results you have seen here.

Now the way I figure it .... making $25 and hour that would make this about a $3000 paint job that I will only have to spend not more than $300 hard cash on if I don't have the paint, paper, PC7424, pads and PoorBoys already .... and after that is purchased I can gloss up 2 of my other cars that have good OEM paint for FREE.

And .... I am sure there are a lot of Miata owners that have spent more than 3 Grand for results half what Aussie has.

Can't wait to get started ... with Brightside or Pettit or both.

Re: New Paint job on a budget thread. #37412
08/29/07 10:23 PM
08/29/07 10:23 PM

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Quote:



... that have spent more than 3 Grand for results half what Aussie has.






Thats me. I would have been happy with that metric if anyone could have ever delivered.
I have yet to get a paint job as good as promised - at any price.

Conventional wisdom says without access to a booth, compressor and gun, and the chemical expertise to mix modern paints, the average Joe had no choice. When is the last time you saw a non-metalic color other than red, white, black or yellow on a new car?

"...The only way to win is not to play..."

Its a revolution, Baaay-bee, yeah.

Re: New Paint job on a budget thread. #37413
08/30/07 12:41 AM
08/30/07 12:41 AM

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after 2 coats of rustoleumn Gloss White, here's a coat of Brightside White on the fenders, this paint shines!

I got a few runs, so I need to fix those then I'll do a second and final Brightside coat.
Pics of Paint JUST sprayed:



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