Re: Transmission # Tied to Engine / Car
[Re: earlymopar]
#2882703
02/01/21 09:57 AM
02/01/21 09:57 AM
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Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 1,328 VA
dragon slayer
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 1,328
VA
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I have been studying this for myself as I am into Autos right now. The hemi and 440 6 pack has a larger front clutch drum that handled 5 versus 4 clutch disk. Because part of that drum was larger towards the oil pump, the oil pump housing had a different part number and had the vent casting machined down for clearance, along with a rounded internal baffle to clear the front drum. The rear clutch drum also different to fit with the front. The KD band was wider. The KD lever was 5.0, and the KD servo used single lighter spring. This is the early style non cushion KD piston. The front clutch used 15 springs. The 70 an down used the same valve body as the HP motors. It had a deeper transfer plate for the rear/low servo apply. VB did change some what with 66-67 and then 68-70 versions. The accumulator did not have a spring used. Rear servo is common. My understanding is clutch and band friction material was different. Both planetary gears were 4 pinion. Were as 440-4 HP motors would have a 4 pinion front, but 3 pinion rear.
Early the input shaft and output shaft were a hd version. Later in 69 and up I do believe all the HP motors had the same input and output HD shafts.
71 seems to be different, as 71 was a major year for modifications to the trans and valve bodies for all models. 70 somewhat with late and early transmissions. So there are a lot of changes in part numbers and such. But for at least 70 down the above is pretty accurate.
So in the modern world with the advent of better friction disc and such, and the move towards lighter rotating mass, 4 disc and different drums are considered better in a street strip car.
Last edited by dragon slayer; 02/01/21 10:01 AM.
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Re: Transmission # Tied to Engine / Car
[Re: dragon slayer]
#2882718
02/01/21 11:29 AM
02/01/21 11:29 AM
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Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,149 NW New Jersey
RSI700VIPER
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,149
NW New Jersey
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Dragon Slayer - Thanks for the info on Hemi auto transmissions. A lot of info on hemi 4-speeds can be found on the internet and elsewhere but not too much on 727s.
1970 Superbird 440 Six BBL, 4-Speed, Dana, FJ5 1969 Daytona Charger 440 4-Speed, Dana, EV2 1971 340 Challenger Conv. Flemington Speedway Pace Car, FC7 1970 340 Six Pack Callenger T/A 4-speed T8 Tan 1971 340 Challenger RT Formal Roof, EV2 w/ V2 Stripe & Orange Houndstooth 1969 Talladega Torino, 428CJ 1969 Gurney Special Cyclone Spoiler II, 351 Cleveland
"Id rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy" Ben Franklin 1755
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Re: Transmission # Tied to Engine / Car
[Re: earlymopar]
#2882763
02/01/21 02:09 PM
02/01/21 02:09 PM
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 19,470 north of coder
moparx
"Butt Crack Bob"
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"Butt Crack Bob"
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 19,470
north of coder
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i can't state this as actual "fact", but wasn't the largest KD lever factory installed a 4.8 ratio ? i always thought the 5.0 lever was a hustle stuff or direct connection piece ? if kunkle sees this post, he will know for sure, as well as transman and others.
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Re: Transmission # Tied to Engine / Car
[Re: moparx]
#2882783
02/01/21 03:10 PM
02/01/21 03:10 PM
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 3,085 Michigan
A727Tflite
master
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master
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 3,085
Michigan
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i can't state this as actual "fact", but wasn't the largest KD lever factory installed a 4.8 ratio ? i always thought the 5.0 lever was a hustle stuff or direct connection piece ? if kunkle sees this post, he will know for sure, as well as transman and others. 5.0 was the highest ratio that I am aware of in production use, for the Hemi and A12 cars. These two transmissions were pretty much identical except the governor.
Last edited by Transman; 02/01/21 03:11 PM.
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Re: Transmission # Tied to Engine / Car
[Re: 6bblgt]
#2882949
02/01/21 10:27 PM
02/01/21 10:27 PM
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 3,085 Michigan
A727Tflite
master
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master
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 3,085
Michigan
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PK2892093L 2793 4134
PK = Kokomo, IN transmission plant 2892093 = 727 for 383 4bbl, 383HP & 440HP L = ?? 2793 = Friday March 21, 1969 transmission assembly date 4134 = transmission unit number As noted earlier - it’s nothing special and it’s not a Hemi box. I would pull the pan and see how it looks inside. If it needs to be gone through, then core value on a big block box puts it around $240-300. If it’s pristine inside you may get more, depends on the market supply in your area.
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Re: Transmission # Tied to Engine / Car
[Re: dragon slayer]
#2883034
02/02/21 10:19 AM
02/02/21 10:19 AM
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 3,085 Michigan
A727Tflite
master
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master
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 3,085
Michigan
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That is assuming it stayed original. If this was being used for racing, the internals can be different. Can't really know with out disassembly. I just tore down the exact same trans part number, that was a modified one for a race car. The internals where all 1976 trans parts with a reverse manual vb. But nothing exotic. Bad part is it probably had a converter failure and lost oil pressure. So rear of case damaged, lots of damaged wear surfaces, plus poor storage and lots of rust. Correct, and that’s why I advised to pull the pan. Regardless if the trans is an early or late style there isn’t much difference in price for a stock core. While the pan is off you can see if it has a trick aftermarket drum or Hemi drum too. Same goes for the valve body. Plated separator plate could be full manual or just a shift kit. Would need closer examination.
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Re: Transmission # Tied to Engine / Car
[Re: A727Tflite]
#2883082
02/02/21 12:44 PM
02/02/21 12:44 PM
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 19,470 north of coder
moparx
"Butt Crack Bob"
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"Butt Crack Bob"
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 19,470
north of coder
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i can't state this as actual "fact", but wasn't the largest KD lever factory installed a 4.8 ratio ? i always thought the 5.0 lever was a hustle stuff or direct connection piece ? if kunkle sees this post, he will know for sure, as well as transman and others. 5.0 was the highest ratio that I am aware of in production use, for the Hemi and A12 cars. These two transmissions were pretty much identical except the governor. thanks for setting me straight ! for some reason, i always thought the 5.0 was [factory] aftermarket. maybe it's because i have two new ones in old DC packaging. Thanks again for untangling my head cavity !
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Re: Transmission # Tied to Engine / Car
[Re: moparx]
#2883129
02/02/21 02:59 PM
02/02/21 02:59 PM
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 3,085 Michigan
A727Tflite
master
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master
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 3,085
Michigan
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i can't state this as actual "fact", but wasn't the largest KD lever factory installed a 4.8 ratio ? i always thought the 5.0 lever was a hustle stuff or direct connection piece ? if kunkle sees this post, he will know for sure, as well as transman and others. 5.0 was the highest ratio that I am aware of in production use, for the Hemi and A12 cars. These two transmissions were pretty much identical except the governor. thanks for setting me straight ! for some reason, i always thought the 5.0 was [factory] aftermarket. maybe it's because i have two new ones in old DC packaging. Thanks again for untangling my head cavity ! Not sure how old you are - if you aren’t in your late 60’s yet things get worse.
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