Well, merry christmas . . . .

https://www.ft.com/content/92ff16ec-2162-11ea-92da-f0c92e957a96

https://www.freep.com/story/money/c...-chrysler-fca-peugeot-merger/2687303001/



I can for see north america being "gutted" with the European company, stripping all profits from Ram & Jeep, and putting nothing back into Chrysler/Dodge . . . and we get warmed over versions of European micro cars . . . . somehow, history is repeating itself . . . ????

Hope I am wrong . . .

unfortunately Chrysler corporation as most of us here now it, is basically a shell of what used to be from similar situations as you describe.
Matt

Sample quote

The two companies have highlighted a pledge to extract $4.1 billion (3.7 billion euro) in annual savings without closing plants. That suggested cuts elsewhere — on Wednesday the companies pointed to savings in vehicle platforms, purchasing scale, marketing, logistics and information technology — but Bailo said the FCA headquarters is a "great building (in a) great location."
End quote

Over and over again,
in all types of industries- not just automotive,
90% of the time these “Synergies” for saving money in huge mergers do not come true.
It is historical fact.

Sample quote
"Chrysler is the golden goose within FCA. It makes 100% of the profits. It will also be the most profitable part of PSA-FCA, and PSA will not want to screw that up. The merger could actually help the Chrysler brand, which is down to only two vehicles, the 300 (sedan) and Pacifica (minivan)," McElroy said.
End quote

Ram and Jeep “free cash flow” cannot support everything else worldwide, especially electric conversions of all powertrains.

The main “pro” of this merger is now
several governments will pony up money to save factory jobs
when a downturn comes.
That is actually a big survival advantage.

When the merger is complete and new stock is listed,
I predict the Agnelli heirs will
use the “honeymoon period” to sell off stock and diversify their wealth.

https://www.ft.com/content/01346274-5211-11e9-b401-8d9ef1626294

https://www.crainsdetroit.com/automotive/fiat-chrysler-psa-boards-sign-47-billion-merger-deal

Sample quote

Before the closing, Fiat will distribute to its shareholders a special dividend of more than $6 billion
while PSA will distribute its 46 percent stake in car-parts maker Faurecia SE to its own investors.

End quote

Sample quote

China's Dongfeng Motor Corp., which owns 12 percent of PSA, will see its stake in the combined company decline to 4.5 percent as a result of the deal and the sale of a portion of its holding to the French carmaker.

Dongfeng's stake in PSA has attracted attention because of the possibility it could interfere with U.S. regulatory approval. U.S. economic adviser Larry Kudlow said last month the Trump administration would review the proposed merger because the deal would give the Chinese carmaker a stake in the combined company.

Tavares, on the call, said the companies don't expect any significant issues from the antitrust regulators.

Legal, tax issues
Fiat CEO Mike Manley, on the call, dismissed concerns over legal and tax issues that arose in recent weeks. GM in November filed a federal racketeering lawsuit against Fiat Chrysler, charging it with bribing the United Auto Workers union for more favorable terms. Manley called the allegation meritless.

Separately, Italian tax authorities have claimed that Fiat owes the government a hefty sum after underestimating Chrysler's value following its purchase several years ago. Manley reiterated that the case would have no material impact, and said both issues were reviewed during due diligence with PSA.
End quote

I don't think they'll gut it, Ram, Dodge and Jeep are cash registers and could be ever moreso with better leadership and apparently Tavares is a good CEO, which is why they are letting him run it all. They can send over their larger French SUV's and sell them under the Chrysler banner.

FCA's problem was "Dodge is RWD performance, Jeep is SUV's and Ram is trucks - only". All that did was limit what the brands could sell and I imagine that rule will be gone with the new guy. You can't have 10 brands and only let one of them sell SUV's when SUV's are all everyone buys these days.

One plus is it's a potential way to get more small fuel efficient Dodges here to gain sales in that way. And at least the markets don't overlap much so as long as they continue to let people who know the different makes and markets run their own divisions it should be OK. The big downside is if one is the big money maker they could use the profits from that to keep the loosers afloat and not leave enough to let the good part evolve and survive properly. On the other hand that works both ways and can also be good for Chrysler down the road as long as the Daimler fiasco doesn't happen again. People didn't like the Chrysler/Fiat thing either but that turned out OK but that was obviously smaller then this new thing is.

There you have it...sounds about correct.

The funny thing is watching all of the folks that would NEVER in a million years drive 'foreign' cars now drive 100% foreign cars....

Sergio was one slick guy...his 'legacy' will remain for a long time.

If they merge with Peugeot, you can be guaranteed they will run.

So.... the Germans build crummy cars - over-engineered, overrated, over priced, so-so reliability, expensive to fix.

The Italians build even worse cars - low quality and ALMOST the least reliable vehicles anywhere.

The French build the absolute worst cars on the planet. Maybe the known galaxy.

If you take espresso and mix it with doggy do-do, it still tastes like do-do.

But then, that might be just MY take in this!

The PSA brands are actually near the top for reliability (which was a surprise), not Toyota but above Hyundai. WAY ahead of FCA brands...

Stick a Chrysler grille in this thing and give the dealers something to sell

^^^ What the hell is it???

"DS7 crossback"

"508 GT wagon"

E-legend concept, whoever did this should be given the keys to design the next gen charger and challenger

Perhaps, but that looks like the next generation Camaro to me.

Urp.

but if you knew what a Peugeot 504 coupe looked like, you would see what the E-legend concept's styling is based on

looks nearly identical to 10 or 15 other things that look nearly identical to everything else in that market. For some reason this one says buick or maybe mitsubishi or kia to me. Like it makes any difference.

That's what they said when Fiat was given Chrysler.

We see how that worked.

Oh I remember people here fantasizing like a teenaged boy with a Playboy in one hand about Alfa being sold here, rebadged as Dodges, etc.

We see how that worked.

What we've seen is FCA polishing the LX and variant turd until it shown so bright many couldn't see the lack of investment into the brand for all the "shiny" on it.

Quick, without looking name the models being sold as a Chrysler right now.

Then look at when the basic platform was introduced.

Other than 2-doors & the fact they are both silver with rubber tires, I don't see any of the 504 in that concept car.

Gotta wonder about the wagon or 2door, when everyone else seems to be going to CUV and SUVs . . . heck, FCA is killing the Journey for 2020, FWD only, 4cylinder only . . . they squeezed the $$$$ out of that 10yr old platform . . . and rather than evolve it, they are killing it . . .

The journey is based on that ancient shared mitsubishi platform (lancer, avenger). If the rumors are true I'll buy its replacement which is going to be a performance rwd/awd CUV available with a 392 hemi. Smaller than a grand cherokee and probably a good 1000lbs lighter. Based on this platform but with all dodge muscle styling and performance



Makes sense too, BMW, AMG, Audi, Alfa all make hi performance 500hp small CUV's and Dodge "the performance brand" doesn't even have one. Great only car for us in the north east

https://moparinsiders.com/dodge-is-working-on-a-new-performance-uv-to-replace-journey/

The "DS7" & the "508GT" look attractive - there's no doubt about it. Remember the Fireball XL-5? DS7 & 508GT still don't tell me a damn thing about what or who they are - I'm going to have to assume they are Peugeots?

But as an oversight here, what we have now is a huge car company that is & has been for the past 20+ years been a bouncing ball, a moving target. It gets sold over & over again to the highest bidder, each one grooming it as soon as they acquire it, for a planned future sale. They strip it down, lean it out, & harvest the millions or billions as soon as they can. They have no commitment to the employees OR the vehicles, or the country of origin. They are designed to benefit (financially of course) the handful of top schemers & screw the rest of the people. Hell, they will probably next time around be bought by a bank or investment group. Well, they are basically now owned by an investment group. Like earlier stated in this thread, we are buying a name badge without ANY ties to the heritage & history of what Chrysler & Dodge once were. This is the way so many big companies are going anymore, & it NEVER ends well - NEVER.

They had a stab at taking it back in 2007 when cerberus bought it before the recession took care of that. All their profits are still from Ram, Jeep and Dodge sold in north america so if they had been able to pull it off they could have been ok. Thats just hindsight being 20/20 though, Fiat poured a lot of money into design and interiors which helped their resurgence. The 2011 charger and grand cherokee were still pretty bleak from cerberus, 2011 charger had 4 boring square tail lights and a cheap interior still, Fiat added extras and the racetrack lights etc. They added a bunch of stuff to the 2011 grand cherokee too.

Fiats biggest blunder was sinking billions they didn't have into Alfa which has been a huge flop.

Anyone who is loyal to or a fan of Mopar or DCP based on past glory days, the history, the engineering and innovation, the cars of the 60's and 70's, is loyal to a ghost. That company has been dead for many years. What there is now has no ties to any of that, no loyalty, no commitment, and they don't care about you or your Dart, Duster, Super Bee or whatever. You may as well be loyal to that ex who's on her third husband after dumping you.

Enjoy your car, support the aftermarket that is still involved, buy a diesel Ram or Challenger if you want, but the Chrysler Corp. that built your Swinger is long gone.

Saw Larry Shepard at PRI this year. I thought that was nice, brought back some memories of when he was a regular at the races and such. The good old days.

I was hired at FCA engineering in 2011. We had roughly 8000 employees at the Auburn Hills tech center. Now there is close to 15,000. Profit sharing has gone up every year. I would say the last merger wasn't a bad thing. We don't fear his one either.
Doug

Heard cerberus had carved out entire departments and really gutted engineering leading up to the bankruptcy filing. Glad to hear things are back to normal, I imagine it takes years/decade to replace thousands of engineers.

Hopefully with completely different wiring and powertrain than the Guilia/Stelvio, they are a total reliability nightmare, worse than the TIPM equipped vehicles. My employer has one of each for demonstrating technology and the things we haven't touched break all the time.

I hope they do something good - not much investment outside of Rams and Jeeps in many years.