On 6/18/18

I received the notice from the Federal Bankruptcy Court today.

Did guys who were due blocks receive them?

LINK to Chapter 7 vs 11 vs 13, for anyone who is not familiar w/ the different type of bankruptcy filings.

I thought we were making Hemi's great again?
What happened?

3-2-1. Here we go again

Got a link to your source?

If your question is for me, the answer is in my OP.

Everyone please relax. There are legal proceedings that will be ongoing for some time between Ken Black and the new ownership. This is part of that. NOTHING has changed in regards to the production of blocks at the RMC shops in Michigan. Two shipping tomorrow to me.
This is Mr Black availing himself of the legal system in regards to his finances. The new ownership is availing themselves to legal recourse and that is all.
Blocks are being made daily and all production has been moved from the California shop. Relax. This is just the lawyers sorting out the legal issues that have arisen since new ownership was brought on. That is all. There will be more information in a couple days. This is not the same ol same ol. Quite the contrary.
Todd Marsh

Thanks, Todd.
I knew you would have the info and there would be questions.

They "accidentally" erased their email servers.

Got the same letter today. Just typical lawyer stuff.

Same thing MSD sent out a couple years ago.

If you see the way that Dart now casts their blocks and the way KB does it, you'll never want one anyway.

I could be wrong but I think in simplest terms this means the buyers can not sue to get a block or refund or whatever except in the time alloted by the judge.

And have they correctly listed every single deposit and pre-pay among their creditors?

Ooppsss... there's this "tendency" to forget this. Like every single time, where you pay off your friends, father-in-law, people who will burn your house down, etc. now, and let everyone else argue over what's left.
This is supposed to be a major rule: any creditor you do not list in the petition or notify means that debt is not discharged or reorganized through the bankruptcy, and you still owe them every penny.
Except it never happens. The big creditors don't want the money to go anywhere but their pockets.

I got a call from Tim Banning last week. My block is getting sleeved this week and it's done. Woo Hoo for me. It was ordered Nov 2014.

So, who's going to be the real losers here? The suppliers? This was done to protect someone from financial obligation.

BTW: IIRC assets paid out up to 6 months prior to bankruptcy petition are subject to re-distribution per settlement. If they were smart, they all gave themselves bonuses and paid people they would need again 184 days prior to filing. Also fun: selling assets for low value to get them off the books to a shell, then they mysteriously re-appear as new purchases when they start their new company...

Also why checks no longer have a time limit as to when they can be returned, and why you no longer get your original "paid" check back in your monthly statement.

I was a banker most of my life, albeit most of it on the technical side and I don't agree with this. In almost all circumstances banks have very tight deadlines for returning checks.

Anymore almost all checks are held at the point of deposit or even by the depositor. Very few checks make it to the bank on which it is drawn, everything is imaged based. So it is practically impossible to return checks with a statement even if the bank wanted to do so.

Also remember this is a Chapter 11 Bankruptcy (Reorganization), not a Chapter 7 (Liquidation)

This is the kind of foolishness that causes the purest of the purist to question continuing to bang their head against the wall and re-examine their options. The iron block situation is even worse for guys who need and want one. Are you listening Dart?

They changed the rules years ago, again why you don't get your checks back, and why banks now require so much info on an account holder ( under the cover of fighting terrorism?), because if a claw back occurs, the bank does not want to left with no recourse. You probably have many current banking friends that can verify this, don't think I favor it one bit. I think the general public confuses bank "holds" with checks clearing. Also if fraud is part of the bankruptcy, the 180 day limit is waived till whatever the statue of limitations are for the alleged crime.

This kind of filing occurs all the time - it work like this - Form NewCo with different shareholder structure - contribute non pledged assets to NewCo from OldCo - begin operation of NewCo. All debt and liabilities remain with Oldco - wait 6+ months file Chapter 11 on OldCo and force creditors to the table to either accept a debt cram down or force a chapter 7 liquidation of all the remaining listed assets. Worst case scenario the bankruptcy judge throws out the bankruptcy plan and off to court everybody goes – and I will tell you it’s a long way from the courts to the Bank when there are no assets remaining to cover a judgement. In the end nobody is made whole and in 8 years all is forgotten. Bankruptcy is nothing more than a tool of business survival.

In this case you had owner A who took deposits and didn't deliver any product for many years. Then owners B, C, D, and E buy into the company. Owner A then files bankruptcy. Owners B, C, D, and E then sue owner A. IMHO owners B, C, D, and E are glad to be rid of owner A and want nothing more than the name.

I think we have a winner here! last post is

Today's fun errand: write to any company "promising" to supply a new Whatzit in (whatever time span) whether the deposit, pre-pay, discount rate for early buyers, etc. is in escrow.
Probable response: [dial tone].
Possible responses: "what? (Buffy the-phone-girl isn't a lawyer)", "we don't release that information", "it's in the prospectus (500 pages of legalese)".
Doesn't mean they're not honest - IMHO very few mfg. begin by saying "how can we cheat our customers?".
But when faced with a choice of using your deposit to pay rent, operating expenses, their own salary, employee withholding they tend to exhibit "situational morality".
I don't know of any way to tell if the money is escrowed, and what the release terms are (judicial order? your signature?), unless they tell you.
Be warned.

Ken was a thief, pure and simple. No excuses for his actions. Nuff said.

Fixed

Be aware

li·bel
ˈlībəl/Submit
noun
1.
LAW
a published false statement that is damaging to a person's reputation; a written defamation

If you edit the above, I will also. I am not speaking to the truth, but in court you would need to be able to prove the above as a defense.

I didn't say Ken who, just said I know a Ken who is/was. BTW, who the hell are you?

If the courts were really interested in that sort of thing, almost the entire mainstream media (and most of Congress) would be in jail now.

Absolutely!

and completely idiotic how fast a thread gets derailed.

I have only been retired two years, but I am going to spare the others all the dead horse beating. In my opinion you don't have all your facts straight. Your opinion of my view is probably the same so let's just leave it there.

Doesn't matter who I am, I am not the one risking making libel statements.
I might also reconsider editing your quote,
Glad to help.

We could, but somebody is mistaken, and if it's me, I want to know. You sound like you have a better/faster back channel to get to the facts. That option being declined, I will dig further. My difficulty, when I submit this question, my gut feeling is those who really know, prefer not to have full disclosure, as keeping the public selectively uninformed is to the banking worlds advantage,
Just to be clear, the issue is, as I see it here, "is there a time limit as to how long a deposited check can be returned to the originator?".
I'll get right on it.

1st discovery subject to 60+15 day limits

What is the Purpose of Rule 9?
Forged and counterfeit items are sometimes recognized
by bank customers after the midnight return deadline.
Rule 9 allows the Paying bank to file a claim to recover
from a fraudulent item after the UCC midnight return
deadline. Rule 9 shifts responsibility, in some cases,
from the Paying bank (as assigned in UCC Article 4
(4-407 & 4-408) to the depositor when there are sufficient
funds in the depositor’s account.
Why Shift Responsibility?
Checks are no longer processed as in the past:
 Financial institutions (FIs) no longer verify signatures
on all checks.
 Checks are collected using digital images so the
Paying bank never sees the paper check.
 Items can be remotely deposited so even the
Depositary bank does not see the physical item.

I really don't have much input on that, it was some of the other statements I questioned.

Reg CC has to do with funds availability and could be of some interest. I think you are correct in that there are instances where a check can be returned past the normal deadlines.

This has gotten off topic from the original post and I accept some of the credit for that. You might want to start another thread if you want to post your findings.

you two fellas want to take it to pms? Please...

And all this has what to do with KB and chapter 11?

All I want is to be able to make a phone call, give someone a card number, tell them what I want and how I want it and have it delivered to me in a reasonable amount of time (days or maybe a few weeks, not months or years) without having to worry about getting ripped off, BSed, being involved in legal proceedings, having oil and/or water squirt out of it like a lawn sprinkler, having to fix pxxxpoor machining screw ups and on and on. I don't want to have to be educated on the finer points of bankruptcy law. I'm too old, and I have about zero tolerance for such bullxxxx, which happens when you get old.

FTFY

Yeah, good luck with a libel claim against a poster on a message board. If you can find some claims that went through please post them. I’m guessing nobody has proven they were actually damaged by such a post.