Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2
Filler over 2k primer? #2307699
05/20/17 12:24 AM
05/20/17 12:24 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,274
Albany, New York
66Plymouth440Six Offline OP
pro stock
66Plymouth440Six  Offline OP
pro stock

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,274
Albany, New York
I'm working on a hood but not that experienced with body work/ paint. I used an Omni 2K high build primer and blocked it out. There are were a few (high) spots that went through the primer. I reprimered again tonight with the 2k and overall not looking too bad. There are just a couple spots where emblems have been shaved and holes welded that are still pretty visible. Now I don't think primer will fill it completely.

Can I use filler over the 2K primer?
Instead of bondo, I do have some finishing putty. (USC Icing Lite Gold Finishing Glaze) Would this work?

Other issue - I used up the entire quart of primer. Can I use a rattle can filler primer (like duplicolor or rustoleum) over just the couple spots that I need? Or would it be better to re-coat the entire hood?
The autobody supply place is not open until Monday and I was looking to paint this weekend.

Thanks!


Re: Filler over 2k primer? [Re: 66Plymouth440Six] #2307738
05/20/17 02:16 AM
05/20/17 02:16 AM
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 4,848
Memphis
HemiRick Offline
master
HemiRick  Offline
master

Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 4,848
Memphis
No do not use spray can primer its garbage compared to the real stuff.

Yes you can use filler or putty over the 2k.

Recaot entire hood and block sand w/ guide coat.

my 2 cents worth.


Take care,
Rick
68 Coronet R/T 440 & 68 Charger 528 Hemi,and 5 Challengers! 6 cyl, 318, 360, 383, 451
Re: Filler over 2k primer? [Re: HemiRick] #2307741
05/20/17 03:01 AM
05/20/17 03:01 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,274
Albany, New York
66Plymouth440Six Offline OP
pro stock
66Plymouth440Six  Offline OP
pro stock

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,274
Albany, New York
Thanks for the input HemiRick.
Good news about using the finish putty. Was hoping that I could get away with some spray can in the 2 small areas and block the whole hood again. I'm guessing I shouldn't paint directly over the finish putty?

Re: Filler over 2k primer? [Re: 66Plymouth440Six] #2307825
05/20/17 11:04 AM
05/20/17 11:04 AM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 7,274
s.w.fl
B
bonefish Offline
master
bonefish  Offline
master
B

Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 7,274
s.w.fl
any putty or filler will prob show thru if not primed correctly.itried the rat can spot prime and the bondo showed thru the paint at certain angles,had to redo the whole qutr panel to make it right.

Re: Filler over 2k primer? [Re: 66Plymouth440Six] #2307987
05/20/17 03:38 PM
05/20/17 03:38 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,602
Shopping @ HoBo Fright
340SIX Offline
Doc Flappergas's Evil Twin
340SIX  Offline
Doc Flappergas's Evil Twin

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,602
Shopping @ HoBo Fright
Yes the putty is what ya use. I try and stick with a poly based primer as fillers are polly based
I like the Evercoat brand products. Fillers and primers If relly needed blocked slick sand or equatorial
If plenty work was done after blocked i use a sealer PPG DP40Lf or what ever color ya need. one part hardener, one primer and one laqure thinner {paint grade slow}
Seals the deal before paint
And yes as stated no on the spray bomb


[img]https://i234.photobucket.com/albums/ee87/fast340six/sig%20pics/2840886-340SIX-1.jpg[/img]
VP of the MPM in New Orleans
73 Dart Sport 340/ 70 challenger vert. That may still get built, If I live long enough
Re: Filler over 2k primer? [Re: 66Plymouth440Six] #2307989
05/20/17 03:43 PM
05/20/17 03:43 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,602
Shopping @ HoBo Fright
340SIX Offline
Doc Flappergas's Evil Twin
340SIX  Offline
Doc Flappergas's Evil Twin

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,602
Shopping @ HoBo Fright
Keep in mind a poly based catalysis type putty, is "Super Bondo" so it is thin and has less chance of air holes.
A heavy filler type primer like slick sand is also a poly based product and can fill plenty like a liquid bondo


[img]https://i234.photobucket.com/albums/ee87/fast340six/sig%20pics/2840886-340SIX-1.jpg[/img]
VP of the MPM in New Orleans
73 Dart Sport 340/ 70 challenger vert. That may still get built, If I live long enough
Re: Filler over 2k primer? [Re: 340SIX] #2308061
05/20/17 05:55 PM
05/20/17 05:55 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 20,699
Eagle, Idaho
Neil Offline
The Doctor is in.
Neil  Offline
The Doctor is in.

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 20,699
Eagle, Idaho
Solvents used to reduce two part primers and paints can lift the non-hardened stuff that comes out of aerosol cans.

Re: Filler over 2k primer? [Re: 66Plymouth440Six] #2308103
05/20/17 07:26 PM
05/20/17 07:26 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,274
Albany, New York
66Plymouth440Six Offline OP
pro stock
66Plymouth440Six  Offline OP
pro stock

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,274
Albany, New York
Thanks all. I'll recoat with 2k.
No major filler, just a couple spots needed a skim coat. Was deep enough where filler primer wasn't cutting it.

Another issue - I have one small spot (.5 inch line) on the front of the hood where the primer isn't covering over. Ie. Coat with primer and it kinda lifts only along that line. How do I fix this? Hopefully the solution isn't stripping the hood to bare metal!

Re: Filler over 2k primer? [Re: 66Plymouth440Six] #2308129
05/20/17 08:06 PM
05/20/17 08:06 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 20,699
Eagle, Idaho
Neil Offline
The Doctor is in.
Neil  Offline
The Doctor is in.

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 20,699
Eagle, Idaho
What is under that line that is causing it to raise up?

Re: Filler over 2k primer? [Re: 66Plymouth440Six] #2308134
05/20/17 08:21 PM
05/20/17 08:21 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,274
Albany, New York
66Plymouth440Six Offline OP
pro stock
66Plymouth440Six  Offline OP
pro stock

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,274
Albany, New York
looks like self etching primer. It may have been a small spot I sanded and broke through to bare metal. I put the 2k over it. (The paint place said that it's not a problem if the 2k goes over small spots of bare metal.) There was other similar spots that covered no problem.

Re: Filler over 2k primer? [Re: 66Plymouth440Six] #2308241
05/20/17 11:58 PM
05/20/17 11:58 PM
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 6,257
gulfport, ms, west mi
rowin4 Offline
master
rowin4  Offline
master

Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 6,257
gulfport, ms, west mi
grease/oil?


it's ok to butt heads, just don't do it with a butthead
Re: Filler over 2k primer? [Re: 66Plymouth440Six] #2308341
05/21/17 04:27 AM
05/21/17 04:27 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,274
Albany, New York
66Plymouth440Six Offline OP
pro stock
66Plymouth440Six  Offline OP
pro stock

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,274
Albany, New York
I attached a picture of the problem after the last coat of primer. Doesn't look like much - but it kept coming back.

I did the finishing putty and re-coated. Everything looked good so I started the final block sanding. When sanding near this spot it suddenly broke through the primer and a chunk of primer came off. Under it was a red oxide looking primer. Then disaster. Was able to peel off all the new primer. The only spots that were really stuck was where I had the finishing putty. Now over $100 of material of the garage floor and have a big mess to fix. What went wrong?

The hood was painted with Hot Rod Flatz (1 stage Urethane) by the prior owner. I'm not sure what kind of primer he used. I was just going to repair and repaint it with the same paint. I sanded the hood with 220 grit. Then did a few coats of the Omni 2k high build primer. Let dry overnight and then block sanded. Another couple coats of primer, let dry overnight and then block sanded. Used the finishing putty today and sanded it. Sprayed a couple final coats of primer. I let it dry for 4 hours and then started sanding. That's when the problem arose. It was pulling the original primer off (under the original paint). What a frustrating day.

primer.jpgprimer-2.jpg
Re: Filler over 2k primer? [Re: 66Plymouth440Six] #2308491
05/21/17 01:53 PM
05/21/17 01:53 PM
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,220
West Plains, MO
DrCharles Offline
master
DrCharles  Offline
master

Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,220
West Plains, MO
Quote:
It was pulling the original primer off (under the original paint). What a frustrating day.


Unfortunately you have now been bit in the ass by the previous owner's improper paint job. That's why many shops insist on starting with bare metal. Sorry that happened to you.

Edit: Or did you mean the original factory primer/paint?

Last edited by DrCharles; 05/21/17 01:55 PM.
Re: Filler over 2k primer? [Re: DrCharles] #2308519
05/21/17 02:25 PM
05/21/17 02:25 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,274
Albany, New York
66Plymouth440Six Offline OP
pro stock
66Plymouth440Six  Offline OP
pro stock

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,274
Albany, New York
No, I meant the prior owner. It appears he started with bare metal. It was already painted so I thought I could just smooth it out and repaint. Unfortunately the entire truck is done like this. It makes me cautious to do any more repainting.

For future repairs - would applying an epoxy or sealer help? The primer I applied did not separate from the paint. It went a layer below the paint.

Re: Filler over 2k primer? [Re: 66Plymouth440Six] #2308554
05/21/17 03:40 PM
05/21/17 03:40 PM
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,220
West Plains, MO
DrCharles Offline
master
DrCharles  Offline
master

Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,220
West Plains, MO
That's really odd, since the primer he applied did not adhere properly to the bare metal.

Wonder if he used a chemical stripper and didn't get all the residue off? Or some bizarre incompatibility between his paint system and yours? work

I'd be nervous about painting over any existing finish on that vehicle. Sometimes you just gotta start all over again...

Re: Filler over 2k primer? [Re: DrCharles] #2308781
05/21/17 10:23 PM
05/21/17 10:23 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,274
Albany, New York
66Plymouth440Six Offline OP
pro stock
66Plymouth440Six  Offline OP
pro stock

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,274
Albany, New York
It was painted 3-4 years ago. The original builder seems more like a fabricator than a body man. The only reason I touched it was to clean up some welded holes.

I can't see why it would be incompatible. We are both using the same paint topcoat, just different primers. It also waited 3 days before I had a problem. Would the solvent in the 2k primer seep down through the paint and impact the existing primer? I'm not that familiar with the chemistry of these paints/ primers.

I'm not stripping the entire vehicle at this point. That might be a project for a future owner!

Re: Filler over 2k primer? [Re: 66Plymouth440Six] #2308883
05/22/17 01:15 AM
05/22/17 01:15 AM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,637
Florida
G
GMP440 Offline
top fuel
GMP440  Offline
top fuel
G

Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,637
Florida
"Would the solvent in the 2k primer seep down through the paint and impact the existing primer? I'm not that familiar with the chemistry of these paints/ primers."

Yes, it can seep through and cause lifting. Best remedy is to sand the whole area to bare metal , then spray with the 2K primer.
Look at the way the whole panel is lifting. Either the primer that the PO put on was inferior or there was poor prep done before topcoating. Could be both. Sand that whole panel down to metal, prime with 2K.

Last edited by GMP440; 05/22/17 01:20 AM.
Re: Filler over 2k primer? [Re: GMP440] #2308888
05/22/17 01:40 AM
05/22/17 01:40 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,274
Albany, New York
66Plymouth440Six Offline OP
pro stock
66Plymouth440Six  Offline OP
pro stock

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,274
Albany, New York
Should I use the 2k primer or an epoxy primer over bare metal? Need to make a run to the autobody supply store tomorrow.

If I do any more panels in the future, is there anything that can be applied to prevent the lifting? It's not like the paint is falling off currently.

Re: Filler over 2k primer? [Re: 66Plymouth440Six] #2309065
05/22/17 01:58 PM
05/22/17 01:58 PM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,061
Atlanta, GA
M
mgoblue9798 Offline
super stock
mgoblue9798  Offline
super stock
M

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,061
Atlanta, GA
Epoxy first over the bare metal. Then the filler, then the high build 2k. Reason for doing this is the filler will absorb moisture and if put over bare metal. putting it between the two encapsulates it. I know most to not do it this way and will put the bondo to bare metal. I have done it myself. But if you are doing it on a car to last forever the above method is the proper way.

Re: Filler over 2k primer? [Re: mgoblue9798] #2309067
05/22/17 02:03 PM
05/22/17 02:03 PM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,061
Atlanta, GA
M
mgoblue9798 Offline
super stock
mgoblue9798  Offline
super stock
M

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,061
Atlanta, GA
BTW that red primer underneath looks like the old red oxide lacquer primer. If so make sure you strip that hood before repainting. Based on the problems you are having I would strip it to bare metal at any rate.

Page 1 of 2 1 2






Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.1