What will 880 HP break first??? (Non-Mopar)
#2306203
05/17/17 06:06 PM
05/17/17 06:06 PM
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,319 Puyallup, WA
StealthWedge67
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I'll start by apologizing for dragging a Chevrolet question into our forum, but I respect the opinion of many racers and fabricators here, so I'm soliciting good opinions:
I have a buddy that bought a really nice 66 Chevelle last year. It's a solid Street/strip ride with an iron-headed 468" big block / TH400 with a brake / 9". Car runs 10.70's. Rear suspension is stock geometry, but has been upgraded with amuminum trailing arms, aftermarket upper control arms and all Urethane bushings, along with a 9" running a moser spool and 30-spline axles, and 28x10.5 tires. It has a bar only, and is only legal to go down to 10.0.
He ran across a deal on a 565" big block that was dyno'd at 885 hp., and he couldn't help himself. He wants me to help him swap it in, which I'm happy to do.
Here's my question: what issues is he going to run into with that much power on tap? We know the obvious issue that the car is not legal for what this thing will likely be capable of, but I have concerns about the whole back half of the car, which is essentially "stock". Any car I've ever seen tapping this much HP is at least on ladder-bars, if not a full back-half with 4-link. His idea is to let go of the brake and send nearly 900 horses head on into a stock 9" case & housing on a stock suspension setup.
What do you guys think he'll run into?
LemonWedge - Street heavy / Strip ready - 11.07 @ 120
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Re: What will 880 HP break first??? (Non-Mopar)
[Re: StealthWedge67]
#2306208
05/17/17 06:18 PM
05/17/17 06:18 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,404 Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda
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I'd bet the stock 9" centersection will break first if it hooks. It'll rip the pinion clean out of it. He needs at least a nodular iron center w/ a good pinion support.
CHIP '70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60 '69 road runner, 440-6, 18 spline 4 speed, Dana 60 '71 Demon, 340, low gear 904, 8.75 '73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75 '90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt '06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
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Re: What will 880 HP break first??? (Non-Mopar)
[Re: StealthWedge67]
#2306216
05/17/17 06:29 PM
05/17/17 06:29 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
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A couple of things come to mind.. axles will twist IF it hooks.. U-joint might be on the top of the list.. axle hop might be a issue and he will need good shocks to control most of the issues
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Re: What will 880 HP break first??? (Non-Mopar)
[Re: StealthWedge67]
#2306244
05/17/17 07:08 PM
05/17/17 07:08 PM
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 11,739 Fulton County, PA
CMcAllister
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The wall if he's not careful.
There are plenty of Mustangs, Camaros, and other stuff out there with a lot more power than that, hooked up and going fast on stock type suspension and small tires. It takes some work and the right parts, but those coil spring cars can be made to hook. If he manages to do that, I expect the rear will be the weak link with that heavy thing. My dream wheel says 885 HP, 3400#, 9 flat at 150...best case scenario.
If the results don't match the theory, change the theory.
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Re: What will 880 HP break first??? (Non-Mopar)
[Re: sasquatch]
#2306650
05/18/17 12:43 PM
05/18/17 12:43 PM
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,319 Puyallup, WA
StealthWedge67
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I would find out for sure what converter is in it. Converters tend to swell with that kind of smoke and only bad things happen after that..... I know the converter is a Continental, that's about all I know. I'll find out more today. Sounds like most of you think the car will handle it okay, but the rear end and axles will have to be upgraded. I'll suggest that to him, then watch him break parts.... haha. This should be fun. Thanks guys.
LemonWedge - Street heavy / Strip ready - 11.07 @ 120
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Re: What will 880 HP break first??? (Non-Mopar)
[Re: StealthWedge67]
#2306659
05/18/17 12:53 PM
05/18/17 12:53 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,385 Las Vegas
Al_Alguire
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I Live Here
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That's a pretty anemic 565" engine for sure..a 4.600 bore BBC with a decent set of heads should be pushing 4 digits pretty easy, and most do
Stock 9" stuff if not particularly strong as pointed out. Also 30 spline stuff is not the strongest either. And while a turbo 400 can be a good piece it depends on whats in it.
"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."
"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
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Re: What will 880 HP break first??? (Non-Mopar)
[Re: gregsdart]
#2306781
05/18/17 03:14 PM
05/18/17 03:14 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,376
dogdays
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A-body GM cars are body-on-frame. Decades ago it was trick to swap in a convertible frame, because it was boxed, while the sedan or coupe frame was a C-channel. This was like the early '70s.
Even though the body won't wrinkle like a Mopar, it will still have quite a bit of twist from being tied to a twisting frame. I'd say some chassis work, like a roll cage, would be a good investment.
The rear end WILL bend, that's why most all 9" rears have braces welded in. The axles are suspect, as is the differential housing. 35 spline axles and a way stiffer and stronger case should be on the menu. Looking around, I see that Yukon makes both a nodular iron and a bolt-through aluminum case, also an aluminum Dayton pinion support.
As mentioned above, all this strength will be needed if you get the car to hook.
R.
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Re: What will 880 HP break first??? (Non-Mopar)
[Re: StealthWedge67]
#2306845
05/18/17 04:44 PM
05/18/17 04:44 PM
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Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,213 New York
polyspheric
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New center section and 35 spline - sell the one you have before you break it.
Boffin Emeritus
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Re: What will 880 HP break first??? (Non-Mopar)
[Re: StealthWedge67]
#2307042
05/18/17 10:21 PM
05/18/17 10:21 PM
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Joined: May 2015
Posts: 1,134 Lost in Time
Iowan
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super stock
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Break the linkage for the secondarys.
Have a great day Iowan
"obsolete is neat"
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Re: What will 880 HP break first??? (Non-Mopar)
[Re: StealthWedge67]
#2307129
05/19/17 12:16 AM
05/19/17 12:16 AM
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 6,257 gulfport, ms, west mi
rowin4
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They way it looks , the engine deal is going to cost a lot more money. Buying a bullet proof rear, shocks , springs and what ever traction devices probably will cost him as much as the motor did.
it's ok to butt heads, just don't do it with a butthead
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Re: What will 880 HP break first??? (Non-Mopar)
[Re: rowin4]
#2307182
05/19/17 02:27 AM
05/19/17 02:27 AM
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,319 Puyallup, WA
StealthWedge67
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They way it looks , the engine deal is going to cost a lot more money. Buying a bullet proof rear, shocks , springs and what ever traction devices probably will cost him as much as the motor did. Money is not a problem for this guy. He's got more than he knows what to do with. He's just not sure what to spend it on. We got the 468 out tonight. Converter is actually a brand new 8" Hughes (I forgot he had replaced the continental when he had a brand new transmission installed last year).. He's going to call tomorrow and ask their opinion, if they suggest replacing it, he will. I also suggested he look into a complete aftermarket 9" chunk. He's gonna look into that also.
LemonWedge - Street heavy / Strip ready - 11.07 @ 120
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Re: What will 880 HP break first??? (Non-Mopar)
[Re: StealthWedge67]
#2307270
05/19/17 11:11 AM
05/19/17 11:11 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,385 Las Vegas
Al_Alguire
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I Live Here
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IMO he needs to spend it on the engine..Then worry about upgrading the car.
"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."
"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
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Re: What will 880 HP break first??? (Non-Mopar)
[Re: Al_Alguire]
#2307630
05/19/17 10:01 PM
05/19/17 10:01 PM
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,319 Puyallup, WA
StealthWedge67
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IMO he needs to spend it on the engine..Then worry about upgrading the car. Not sure if you're joking, or really how to read this, Al; so I guess I'll just chuckle and wrench along.
LemonWedge - Street heavy / Strip ready - 11.07 @ 120
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Re: What will 880 HP break first??? (Non-Mopar) ***UPDATE***
[Re: StealthWedge67]
#2348259
08/04/17 01:22 AM
08/04/17 01:22 AM
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,319 Puyallup, WA
StealthWedge67
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Well, it broke something..... itself!
At the First TNT night, it spun off the line twice, until we got the right tire pressure and leave RPM. Then it hooked, bounced on the rev limiter at the top end. He just stayed in it on the limiter for a few hundred ft and it went 10.16 at like 128 or something around there. Last run he pulled limiter chip out, it hooked and was trucking but the belt came off the vacuum pump and it pushed oil out the reservoir (we think). It ran 10.04 at 132 on that run limping to the finish. Night over. (And there might have been more to that incident than he thought).
Last weekend he took it back out with the vacuum pump pulley situation re-addressed. It made a pretty good pass in Q1 and went 9.89 at 135. He was all smiles. 2nd run it nosed over when he hit drive, and spewed oil all over the engine compartment. From what I saw and he described, I feared something bad... it had actually split open a valve cover !?!? We pulled the cover and to my surprise, all the valves seemed to move correctly when he cranked it over. So he loaded it up and took off as I stuck around. He called tonight and said he had taken the intake off and immediately saw that the block is cracked and there's metal shavings everywhere in the valley, which has screen epoxied in.
All in all, he spent 8 grand and got 6 passes, only one clean. Reaffirming my feeling that I don't like engines of unknown origin, no matter how many receipts they come with.
LemonWedge - Street heavy / Strip ready - 11.07 @ 120
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