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Re: Carbon Fibre Hood? [Re: 604 Hemi GTX] #2128365
08/09/16 12:25 AM
08/09/16 12:25 AM
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Oregon
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AndyF Offline
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A '70 GTX hood isn't much more complicated than a barn door so it should be fairly easy to build in CF. Any CF guy worth his salt can build you a hood but it might cost a ton to do a one-off.

I have no idea if someone is already making them, Google might find them if they exist.

Re: Carbon Fibre Hood? [Re: 604 Hemi GTX] #2128373
08/09/16 12:33 AM
08/09/16 12:33 AM
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Medina, OH
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Originally Posted By 542GTX
Just wondering if anyone here has got a carbon fibre hood on there ride?
If you do who did you get it from?
I'm in the market for a carbon fibre hood for my 70 Plymouth GTX

Thanks for any and all info
Kevin



I ordered a hood from Unlimited products with a scoop on it. They offer carbon hood/hood scoops.
Unlimited Products http://www.up22.com/index.htm


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Re: Carbon Fibre Hood? [Re: dart440_72] #2128988
08/09/16 10:15 PM
08/09/16 10:15 PM
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Posts: 2,414
St. Croix, US Virgin Islands
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David_in_St_Croi Offline
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As Andy F said, a 70 GTX is not that hard to make. I made a mould for our 70 RR as the bonnet is rusty and with the tunnel ram it is now lift off. Lifting off the steel bonnet is getting old very quickly but life as it often does has thrown a spanner in the schedule.
The big thing with carbon is not so much the strength but the stiffness. The modulus of elasticity of carbon fibre is about 5 times that of glass, particularly when you are looking at unis. My plan is a light carbon cloth on either side of a 19mm nomex core. The bonnet is basically square so a 0/90 laminate works well as the stresses and required stiffness are similar in both directions. The core will give the thickness required for stiffness while keeping the weight. As I have a vacuum pump it is no problem getting both high fibre volume laminates and good core bonding. Around the perimeter and the hole for the carbies there will be some extra lamination. At the bonnet pin locations a G-10 compression tube and local build up will be utilized. For the mould I used polyester as it is cheap, for the part epoxy will be used of course.

Basically, once it is off the car, wax it like crazy and level it. Turns out I should have used some PVA in addition as will be seen later.


Then start lam inating. I put a layer of mat down then I believe 3 layers of 24 oz/yd^2 roving plus mat. Ugly but only planning on one part out of it:



Once it is cured need to put a grid on the backside that is nice and level. This grid does two things. It stiffens the mould and when placed on sawhorses and leveled with shims it ensures the part is not warped. The use of a scribe makes short work of marking the braces.



Perfect fit not required, actually a loose fit is in ways better. Easier to level and the tabbing will not create as much of a hard spot.



Transfer height to forward grid cross piece:

The wedge in former picture sets the level to level and it is sitting on the forward cross piece by that height. Set the scribe to that height and mark the forward cross piece:



Double check level fore and aft and athwarthsips:


Grid tabbed in place:



Wedging mould off of bonnet:



Even with the wax it pulled some of the paint. Poor quality paint job and I should have used PVA on top of the wax but I am sure the paint will come out easily.



Clean up the sharp edges and you are done, with the mould at least.

Or order one from the suppliers mentioned.

I know an excellent composite builder in Bristol, Rhode Island who could do a beautiful bonnet for you. You would need to ship the metal one for him to make a mould.


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Re: Carbon Fibre Hood? [Re: David_in_St_Croi] #2129049
08/09/16 11:01 PM
08/09/16 11:01 PM
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I surprised you used no gel coat on the mold, even for a one off. work

The no pva, tsk grin

Last edited by jcc; 08/09/16 11:02 PM.

Reality check, that half the population is smarter then 50% of the people and it's a constantly contested fact.
Re: Carbon Fibre Hood? [Re: jcc] #2129087
08/09/16 11:43 PM
08/09/16 11:43 PM
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St. Croix, US Virgin Islands
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Originally Posted By jcc
I surprised you used no gel coat on the mold, even for a one off. work

The no pva, tsk grin


Yes, I know on the PVA blush I think if I had used better wax would have been ok. After all, would have just waxed the mould next step so any residue is not an issue.

As far as gel coat, the mould was expensive enough (island prices). The layer of straight mat I put against the surface was resin rich and I worked it with a bubble popper roller, as I did with the subsequent layers. It should be fine for 1, at most 2 parts (all the core I have). The important thing is it is airtight and that is where the rolling out comes into play, along with wetting the material out on the bench, then transferring to the plug, rather than attempting to wet out in place. I am not expecting a straight to clear coat part, it is getting painted. We don't have the mild sun you have in Florida smile , it eats clear coats here (and subsequently the resin underneath as it is also UV sensitive).

For a mould that will see multiple uses, go straight to a tooling surface like Duratec, rather than run of the mill gel coat. It is the orange stuff in the picture. It will polish up to a nice gloss surface. That part is half of an ama for a 36 foot trimaran which will see considerable sea loads. As you can see carbon correctly engineered gives a stiff and light part. This is the shop in Bristol I mentioned.



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Re: Carbon Fibre Hood? [Re: Monte_Smith] #2129095
08/09/16 11:54 PM
08/09/16 11:54 PM
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Utah and Alaska
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Carbon is one of the stiffest fibers you can get as a consumer. When carbon is layered over a glass shell, it becomes a box beam type structure. Also 100% of the stress/strain in a multi fabric structure will be taken by the stiffest fiber (carbon) until that fails then it transfers the load to the next stiffest fiber until that fails..

Vacuum bagging is one primary way to improve the resin to fiber ratio, too much resin, it is heavier than necessary, too little and not enough bonding of the fibers.

Many epoxy resins use heat to accelerate the curing time but IR and UV light can damage the fibers so don't try to cure a part in the sun...I used a heat gun in an old refrigerator to get the temperature up to 140*f and it accelerated my west systems epoxy from 24 hours down to about 4.

Originally Posted By Monte_Smith
You have to be careful when you order carbon parts. The material costs twice as much, but weighs the same as fiberglass. The ONLY way the carbon hood is lighter, is because there is less of it, because of strength. BUT and here is the tricky part........to lay up the super light weight, super thin carbon stuff, you have to be able to pull a vacuum on the mold to do it correctly and few can do that. Also the "carbon" parts you get from some companies not only weigh the same as glass, they are also not really carbon. They will be glass, with the final layer carbon, to give it the "look".

So if you are looking for a true, super light carbon hood for a 70 GTX, probably not going to find such a thing. If you just want the "look" buy a glass one and have a carbon wrap put on it


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Re: Carbon Fibre Hood? [Re: astjp2] #2129335
08/10/16 11:41 AM
08/10/16 11:41 AM
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Neber heard of IR damaging fibers, I assume Kelvar is the most fragile, can't imagine CF would be delicate.

And about busting Davids chops grinon no use of Gel on his mold, I understand the island price concern, and sounds like you mitigated its non use. The issue is, to those here in the states also making a one off, if your mold has any/slightest imperfections, you will live with that or fix it later in the final piece, and a hood is the most visible part on a car, or close to the drivers door in visibility.The GEl coat in a mold, mainly provides as David mentioned, ability to polish the gel without a break thru into fibers concern, and mainly, IMO reduces shadow "print thru" of the first layers of fibers, be they roven, fabric, or mat onto the molds surface, not an ideal cosmetic result. twocents

Last edited by jcc; 08/10/16 11:43 AM.

Reality check, that half the population is smarter then 50% of the people and it's a constantly contested fact.
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