New to big blocks, cooling issues with Meziere pump
#1841895
06/05/15 01:41 AM
06/05/15 01:41 AM
|
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 172 Champaign IL
LXguy
OP
member
|
OP
member
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 172
Champaign IL
|
Hey All:
Have a 500BB in a 1973 Road Runner. Meziere pump can't keep up. Looking to go to a stock-style pump with aluminum housing.
Car came with this electric water pump, so I basically have nothing to start with. Any recommendations on aluminum housings/pumps.
I imagine this big motor needs some serious cooling. Web search says stay away from 440 source, but I'm blind otherwise.
Any help appreciated.
Thanks, Steve
1971 Dodge Dart Swinger
5.9 Magnum, built 904
ET 11.70 / 113 mph
Want to swap a Magnum into your Mopar?
www.magnumswap.com
|
|
|
Re: New to big blocks, cooling issues with Meziere pump
[Re: 383man]
#1841950
06/05/15 06:40 AM
06/05/15 06:40 AM
|
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,845 Tampa
DusterDave
top fuel
|
top fuel
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,845
Tampa
|
I wouldn't be so quick to blame the Meziere pump for your cooling issues. I had a Meziere on my supercharged 528 Hemi, and I never had a cooling issue on the street down here in central Florida. I'm betting your problem is due to something else. For starters, does your fan have a shroud?
Gone to the dark side with an LS3 powered '57 Chevy 210
|
|
|
Re: New to big blocks, cooling issues with Meziere pump
[Re: LXguy]
#1841994
06/05/15 10:11 AM
06/05/15 10:11 AM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,385 Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,385
Marion, South Carolina [><]
|
I have a Meziere 45 gpm pump that fits in the factory housing and it keeps my 800+ hp hemi cool. I agree w/ the other guys, you may have another problem w/ your cooling system. Which Meziere pump do you have? They make 4 different ones for a BB Mopar. A 35 gpm, 40 gpm, 45 gpm like I have, and a 55 gpm monster.
CHIP '70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60 '69 road runner, 440-6, 18 spline 4 speed, Dana 60 '71 Demon, 340, low gear 904, 8.75 '73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75 '90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt '06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
|
|
|
Re: New to big blocks, cooling issues with Meziere pump
[Re: LXguy]
#1842191
06/05/15 04:11 PM
06/05/15 04:11 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 172 Champaign IL
LXguy
OP
member
|
OP
member
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 172
Champaign IL
|
This is the 55 gpm meziere. Car has an electric fan on it. Might not be up to the challenge I suppose. Original 340 small block radiator.
1971 Dodge Dart Swinger
5.9 Magnum, built 904
ET 11.70 / 113 mph
Want to swap a Magnum into your Mopar?
www.magnumswap.com
|
|
|
Re: New to big blocks, cooling issues with Meziere pump
[Re: LXguy]
#1842198
06/05/15 04:19 PM
06/05/15 04:19 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,385 Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,385
Marion, South Carolina [><]
|
Definitely not the pump at fault here.
Specifically, what kind of fan do you have? Sounds like it may be time for a new/bigger radiator too.
I use an electric fan and shroud setup from a 2003 Viper. Friend got it for me w/ his discount through the dealership he works at. Pretty cheap if you know someone that works at one. I also have a Griffin aluminum radiator w/ 2 rows of 1.25" tubes. It's a direct bolt in and is the biggest one that would fit. Not cheap, but made a BIG improvement in my temp on the street.
CHIP '70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60 '69 road runner, 440-6, 18 spline 4 speed, Dana 60 '71 Demon, 340, low gear 904, 8.75 '73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75 '90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt '06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
|
|
|
Re: New to big blocks, cooling issues with Meziere pump
[Re: LXguy]
#1842223
06/05/15 04:45 PM
06/05/15 04:45 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 172 Champaign IL
LXguy
OP
member
|
OP
member
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 172
Champaign IL
|
I believe its a Black Magic fan from Flexalite. Or at least looks like one I had on a Mustang previously.
I'm hopeful they would make a similar better radiator for a B-body. The opening is pretty small on this '73
1971 Dodge Dart Swinger
5.9 Magnum, built 904
ET 11.70 / 113 mph
Want to swap a Magnum into your Mopar?
www.magnumswap.com
|
|
|
Re: New to big blocks, cooling issues with Meziere pump
[Re: LXguy]
#1842224
06/05/15 04:46 PM
06/05/15 04:46 PM
|
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
|
Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
|
Your radiator is most likely too small for the BB.. if it is you should be able to cruise at 55mph without a fan(just the air flow is enough to keep it cool).. the 55gph pump is fine... if it stays cool at 55 mph the its a low speed issue and not a radiator issue... could be a shroud or a fan... not all electric fans are made equal.. remember that a spill ring on the ends of the blades helps... try to find a fan in the 2500 cfm or more range... also.. try to get the air to cross the radiator and not slide around it
|
|
|
Re: New to big blocks, cooling issues with Meziere pump
[Re: Monte_Smith]
#1842248
06/05/15 05:21 PM
06/05/15 05:21 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,385 Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,385
Marion, South Carolina [><]
|
As others have said, the pump is NOT your problem. Small radiator and just a mediocre fan likely just slapped on the radiator where it would fit, is NOT going to get it done.
Monte
CHIP '70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60 '69 road runner, 440-6, 18 spline 4 speed, Dana 60 '71 Demon, 340, low gear 904, 8.75 '73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75 '90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt '06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
|
|
|
Re: New to big blocks, cooling issues with Meziere pump
[Re: LXguy]
#1842484
06/05/15 10:38 PM
06/05/15 10:38 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 172 Champaign IL
LXguy
OP
member
|
OP
member
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 172
Champaign IL
|
This is just idling. It just keeps going up and up.
1971 Dodge Dart Swinger
5.9 Magnum, built 904
ET 11.70 / 113 mph
Want to swap a Magnum into your Mopar?
www.magnumswap.com
|
|
|
Re: New to big blocks, cooling issues with Meziere pump
[Re: LXguy]
#1842508
06/05/15 10:59 PM
06/05/15 10:59 PM
|
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
|
Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
|
Do you have a stat in it... are you SURE its opening.. verify in a pan of boiling water... once you do that make sure the water is actually flowing
|
|
|
Re: New to big blocks, cooling issues with Meziere pump
[Re: LXguy]
#1842527
06/05/15 11:18 PM
06/05/15 11:18 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 31,073 Oregon
AndyF
I Win
|
I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 31,073
Oregon
|
This is just idling. It just keeps going up and up.
That could be caused by a bunch of things, some of which are bad. You need to figure it out. Could be a blocked water passage, a blown head gasket, a collapsed radiator hose, a blocked thermostat, a plugged up radiator, etc. None of those are good problems to have. I doubt it is the pump but it could be. The wiring might be shot on the pump or maybe the impeller is cracked or maybe there is some gunk in the system that is plugging things up.
|
|
|
Re: New to big blocks, cooling issues with Meziere pump
[Re: LXguy]
#1842537
06/05/15 11:22 PM
06/05/15 11:22 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,845 Tampa
DusterDave
top fuel
|
top fuel
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,845
Tampa
|
This is just idling. It just keeps going up and up.
In addition to what AndyF said, I would also look at the fan, because it could be a lack of air flow through the radiator. Shop for a fan based on two primary considerations: CFM rating, and radiator coverage. Put the largest, highest CFM rated electric fan(s) that will fit. The more radiator fin area that is covered by the fan(s), the better. Don't just look at aftermarket fans. There are quite a few OEM fans that pull big CFM numbers, and are reliable. However, big CFM fans typically means big amp draw, so don't expect to run one without a BIG relay, or better yet, a fan controller unit. If you decide to change the radiator, shoehorn the biggest aftermarket aluminum radiator that will fit between the frame rails, even if it means drilling new mounting holes and/or doing some surgery on the radiator core support. Extra cooling capacity is never a bad thing.
Gone to the dark side with an LS3 powered '57 Chevy 210
|
|
|
Re: New to big blocks, cooling issues with Meziere pump
[Re: LXguy]
#1842630
06/06/15 12:24 AM
06/06/15 12:24 AM
|
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 172 Champaign IL
LXguy
OP
member
|
OP
member
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 172
Champaign IL
|
No T-stat. I can see the pump moving water. If you run the car to temp, shut it off, let it sit for a minute then turn the pump on, the temp on the mechanical gauge takes a big dip.
Also pretty sure its not a head gasket. Car runs excellent, no oil in water and vice versa.
Radiator is 42 years old. Seems like a likely culprit. Reading a bunch about how Mustang guys don't really like this black magic fan much, and that's for a 9:1 302, not a 12:1 big block....
1971 Dodge Dart Swinger
5.9 Magnum, built 904
ET 11.70 / 113 mph
Want to swap a Magnum into your Mopar?
www.magnumswap.com
|
|
|
Re: New to big blocks, cooling issues with Meziere pump
[Re: LXguy]
#1847262
06/12/15 11:27 AM
06/12/15 11:27 AM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,385 Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,385
Marion, South Carolina [><]
|
Meziere says specifically in their instructions not to run a thermostat w/ their pumps.
CHIP '70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60 '69 road runner, 440-6, 18 spline 4 speed, Dana 60 '71 Demon, 340, low gear 904, 8.75 '73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75 '90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt '06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
|
|
|
Re: New to big blocks, cooling issues with Meziere pump
[Re: an8sec70cuda]
#1847264
06/12/15 11:34 AM
06/12/15 11:34 AM
|
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
|
Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
|
Meziere says specifically in their instructions not to run a thermostat w/ their pumps. Being that I'm running injection I drill 4 1/8" holes in the stat.. that way the pump isnt dead headed... but still lets the engine heat up fairly quick.... but your correct.. they dont like the pump to be dead headed
|
|
|
Re: New to big blocks, cooling issues with Meziere pump
[Re: an8sec70cuda]
#1847276
06/12/15 12:05 PM
06/12/15 12:05 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 19,318 State of confusion
Thumperdart
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 19,318
State of confusion
|
Meziere says specifically in their instructions not to run a thermostat w/ their pumps. Same w/my Moroso so I gutted a t-stat and all`s well BUT I run a 26" Griffin and the hhr fan which fully covers the cores and runs bet 170-180 on average.
72 Dart 470 n/a BB stroker street car `THUMPER`...Check me out on FB Dominic Thumper for videos and lots of carb pics......760-900-3895.....
|
|
|
Re: New to big blocks, cooling issues with Meziere pump
[Re: LXguy]
#1847303
06/12/15 12:39 PM
06/12/15 12:39 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 4,243 Charlotte, North Carolina
sgcuda
master
|
master
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 4,243
Charlotte, North Carolina
|
This is just idling. It just keeps going up and up.
If it's only at idle, and the car cools down while driving, it is not a water pump issue. It is a radiator/fan/airflow issue. Grab a temp gun and check temp difference from inlet to outlet of radiator.
[image][/image]
|
|
|
Re: New to big blocks, cooling issues with Meziere pump
[Re: LXguy]
#1847334
06/12/15 01:24 PM
06/12/15 01:24 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,845 Tampa
DusterDave
top fuel
|
top fuel
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,845
Tampa
|
Radiator is 42 years old. Seems like a likely culprit. Reading a bunch about how Mustang guys don't really like this black magic fan much, and that's for a 9:1 302, not a 12:1 big block....
Time to replace that 42 year old radiator! You can buy a nice aluminum rad for less than $300.
Gone to the dark side with an LS3 powered '57 Chevy 210
|
|
|
|
|