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Alum Heads & Alum Intake - valley pan question. #1736997 01/23/15 06:23 PM 01/23/15 06:23 PM
Joined: Sep 2009 Posts: 1,377 Tennessee WyleECoyote OP pro stock
WyleECoyote OP pro stock Joined: Sep 2009 Posts: 1,377 Tennessee	I'm helping a young (21 yr old) enthusiast new to the hobby with some engine issues. He added Edelbrock aluminum heads to a 440 and now he wants to put on a Weiand aluminum manifold. I've never messed with aluminum heads, so I'm unsure about the gasket situation. Does he use just the valley pan gasket and brush on the tacky sealant stuff around the pan gasket (and rtv at the corners) like I do my steel heads and aluminum manifolds or is this the time to use the additional gaskets that come in the set? Wile E. Coyote Super Genius, Lover of FCA US LLC Products ************* 68 Road Runner (440 4-spd), 71 Superbee (383 slap), 71 Charger 500 (383 4-spd wA/C 1of 182), 72 Imperial, 74 Charger SE (440 sunroof), 84 D350 Crew-cab Dually (440), 75 D300 Dually Tandem (318 4-speed)

Re: Alum Heads & Alum Intake - valley pan question. [Re: WyleECoyote] #1736998 01/23/15 06:54 PM 01/23/15 06:54 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 31,029 Oregon A AndyF I Win
AndyF I Win A Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 31,029 Oregon	Depends how much space there is which in turn depends on if the heads/block/intake have been milled or not. You have to mock it up to see and then go from there. I always mill the intake side of my cylinder heads so I can use a double paper gasket but most people don't do that. To do it correctly the head and the block should be milled so you get a three way match at the top of the valley rail. The cylinder head, deck surface and valley rail should all meet at the same point. Lots of guys never check that which is why they have problems with the intake leaking.

Re: Alum Heads & Alum Intake - valley pan question. [Re: AndyF] #1736999 01/23/15 07:00 PM 01/23/15 07:00 PM
Joined: Sep 2009 Posts: 1,377 Tennessee WyleECoyote OP pro stock
WyleECoyote OP pro stock Joined: Sep 2009 Posts: 1,377 Tennessee	Quote: Depends how much space there is which in turn depends on if the heads/block/intake have been milled or not. You have to mock it up to see and then go from there. I always mill the intake side of my cylinder heads so I can use a double paper gasket but most people don't do that. To do it correctly the head and the block should be milled so you get a three way match at the top of the valley rail. The cylinder head, deck surface and valley rail should all meet at the same point. Lots of guys never check that which is why they have problems with the intake leaking. I'm tracking with ya - I'll put the manifold on with no gaskets and see how it all matches up bare - then determine if the paper gaskets are needed. Makes sense with how you explained it, thank you. Wile E. Coyote Super Genius, Lover of FCA US LLC Products ************* 68 Road Runner (440 4-spd), 71 Superbee (383 slap), 71 Charger 500 (383 4-spd wA/C 1of 182), 72 Imperial, 74 Charger SE (440 sunroof), 84 D350 Crew-cab Dually (440), 75 D300 Dually Tandem (318 4-speed)

Re: Alum Heads & Alum Intake - valley pan question. [Re: WyleECoyote] #1737000 01/23/15 07:16 PM 01/23/15 07:16 PM
Joined: Feb 2003 Posts: 2,560 S.E. Michigan cl440 master
cl440 master Joined: Feb 2003 Posts: 2,560 S.E. Michigan	we've ran with no paper gaskets, with only one set of paper and with both sets of paper. Just depends on how everything lines up.

Re: Alum Heads & Alum Intake - valley pan question. [Re: cl440] #1737001 01/23/15 07:35 PM 01/23/15 07:35 PM
Joined: Sep 2009 Posts: 1,377 Tennessee WyleECoyote OP pro stock
WyleECoyote OP pro stock Joined: Sep 2009 Posts: 1,377 Tennessee	Quote: we've ran with no paper gaskets, with only one set of paper and with both sets of paper. Just depends on how everything lines up. Roger that, thanks for the feedback. Made total sense when Andy laid it out like that in layman's terms!!!

Re: Alum Heads & Alum Intake - valley pan question. [Re: WyleECoyote] #1737002 01/24/15 01:21 AM 01/24/15 01:21 AM
Joined: Jul 2006 Posts: 4,319 Puyallup, WA S StealthWedge67 master
StealthWedge67 master S Joined: Jul 2006 Posts: 4,319 Puyallup, WA	I've run a couple of different B series motors, with iron heads and a set of source heads. Just the valley pan seems to be what always works for me. I usually run a thin bead of RTV right at the seal-bead that's in the pan at the ports. LemonWedge - Street heavy / Strip ready - 11.07 @ 120

Re: Alum Heads & Alum Intake - valley pan question. [Re: StealthWedge67] #1737003 01/24/15 12:26 PM 01/24/15 12:26 PM
Joined: Jul 2003 Posts: 3,377 Rancho Cordova, CA Exit1965 master
Exit1965 master Joined: Jul 2003 Posts: 3,377 Rancho Cordova, CA	I used paper gasket on top of the head, and a light film of hylomar around the ports on every sealing side. It lined up that way, and I like the idea that there is something for the assembly to press into.

Re: Alum Heads & Alum Intake - valley pan question. [Re: Exit1965] #1737004 01/24/15 01:06 PM 01/24/15 01:06 PM
Joined: Jul 2005 Posts: 1,472 Overland Park, KS. J Joshs68 pro stock
Joshs68 pro stock J Joined: Jul 2005 Posts: 1,472 Overland Park, KS.	I have tried without the paper gaskets and could not get it to seal. Always leaked into the valley. I used both paper gaskets and the pan with minimal RTV and it has now been fine for years. It lined up fine with all 3 also, aluminum heads and intake.

Re: Alum Heads & Alum Intake - valley pan question. [Re: Joshs68] #1737005 01/24/15 07:31 PM 01/24/15 07:31 PM
Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 8,716 Baltimore/Denver 64Post master
64Post master Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 8,716 Baltimore/Denver	I cut the runners off the tin, tuck the edges under each head, then use one copper tack paper gasket between the head and intake. No chance to suck oil into the runners.

Re: Alum Heads & Alum Intake - valley pan question. [Re: 64Post] #1737006 01/24/15 07:47 PM 01/24/15 07:47 PM
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	The hot lick is to use the paper gaskets that are available now in .015 thick( not .030 each like Fel Pros ) making it easier to use one on each side of the pan..but the coolest trick is use Holomar around the intake ports--I mean... I use RTV at the ends and up to the first bolt hole--You have to--never a leak but...fuel kills RTV so you turn to a product invented by Mercedes (I think) called Holomar--a blue goo that is NOT affected by fuel or oil or temp it will seal up around intake ports like a bank vault

Re: Alum Heads & Alum Intake - valley pan question. [Re: AndyF] #1737007 01/24/15 08:53 PM 01/24/15 08:53 PM
Joined: Feb 2005 Posts: 4,313 Prospect, PA BSB67 master
BSB67 master Joined: Feb 2005 Posts: 4,313 Prospect, PA	Quote: I always mill the intake side of my cylinder heads so I can use a double paper gasket but most people don't do that. Doing that for over 30 years. No adhesive or sealant on the head or the intake. Makes intake swaps a snap.

Re: Alum Heads & Alum Intake - valley pan question. [Re: ] #1737008 01/25/15 05:27 AM 01/25/15 05:27 AM
Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 43,173 Bend,OR USA C Cab_Burge I Win
Cab_Burge I Win C Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 43,173 Bend,OR USA	Rolls Royce, or some British firm associated with them, develop Hylomar during WW2 to seal up intake gaskets on thier liquid coooled aircraft motors. I use it, it is a great gasket sealer You need to use a very thin coat of it on both sides of the gasket and a very thin coat on each of the mating surfaces on the heads and intake, not thick at all Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)

Re: Alum Heads & Alum Intake - valley pan question. [Re: AndyF] #1737009 01/25/15 07:33 AM 01/25/15 07:33 AM
Joined: May 2008 Posts: 5,399 Aurora, Colorado 451Mopar master
451Mopar master Joined: May 2008 Posts: 5,399 Aurora, Colorado	Quote: Depends how much space there is which in turn depends on if the heads/block/intake have been milled or not. You have to mock it up to see and then go from there. I always mill the intake side of my cylinder heads so I can use a double paper gasket but most people don't do that. To do it correctly the head and the block should be milled so you get a three way match at the top of the valley rail. The cylinder head, deck surface and valley rail should all meet at the same point. Lots of guys never check that which is why they have problems with the intake leaking. My old 451 engine with the B-1 B/s heads and M1 intake, I had to have 0.100" taken off each side of the manifold. I think the block may have been milled down, not sure about the heads, but that is most I have ever had to take off to get an intake to fit.

Re: Alum Heads & Alum Intake - valley pan question. [Re: WyleECoyote] #1737010 01/25/15 12:00 PM 01/25/15 12:00 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 21,072 Niles , Ohio T therocks oh wait.but hey.lets see.oh yeah.
therocks oh wait.but hey.lets see.oh yeah. T Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 21,072 Niles , Ohio	Ive run aluminum intakes since the 60s.Never used papers.Ran the kids 413 and my 440 for the last 20 years with none.My 440 also has aluminum heads for the last 5 years at least.No papers.Rocky Chrysler Firepower

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