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A-body dailydriver 1" torsion bar upgrade
#1527517
11/02/13 06:31 PM
11/02/13 06:31 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
BigBlockMopar
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
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Today, after a fierce few hours long battle with the driverssside torsion bar, I was able to remove my Dart's 0.87" bars in favor for a set of 1" torsion bars from Just Suspension. The pass.side bar slid out with just a few taps. The JS bars measure exactly 1". With just the 20 minute ride home from the garage as a reference I can (also) now say, from personal experience, that these 1" bars are 'nothing to be afraid of' for a performance handling orientated daily driver. I too was afraid at first these bars would be just too much for actual daily usage. One thing I did do was invert the front/outer most strutrod washers so with the dished side outwards to the front. This was done to free up the front suspension a bit more, as I noticed that even without the torsion bars installed, the spindle/suspension was kinda difficult to move up and down by hand. I would've liked to invert the inner cup washers aswell but I was a little pressed for time and didn't want to take the entire front suspension apart for that. The only 'issue' I'm still having is that the car's frame still hits the LCA bumpstops sometimes, but that's because I have it lowered as far as usuable, with only miminum play above the LCA's. A set of 1" drop spindles would be perfect now I guess.  
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Re: A-body dailydriver 1" torsion bar upgrade
[Re: BigBlockMopar]
#1527520
11/02/13 09:18 PM
11/02/13 09:18 PM
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,696
Bitopia
jcc
If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
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If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,696
Bitopia
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"With just the 20 minute ride home from the garage as a reference I can (also) now say, from personal experience, that these 1" bars are 'nothing to be afraid of' for a performance handling orientated daily driver. I too was afraid at first these bars would be just too much for actual daily usage." It would be very helpful to many if that result could be be coveyed to others just as hesitant. I've even offered to loan my bars out to prove it. Still anything over .96 is just to scary for many. Now you get to wonder what 1.06" feel like.  
Reality check, that half the population is smarter then 50% of the people and it's a constantly contested fact.
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Re: A-body dailydriver 1" torsion bar upgrade
[Re: Rapom65]
#1527521
11/02/13 09:42 PM
11/02/13 09:42 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,466
So Cal
autoxcuda
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,466
So Cal
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Quote:
So for a mix of road conditions which do you like better 1" or 1.14"? Or maybe between like 1.06ers?
What type of mix?
And is it a daily driver back and forth to work everyday?
Do you live IN the center of a big metropolis massive traffic density? I'd imagine downtown Seattle would be the closest thing?
The multiple potholes are really specific area in the middle of Los Angeles in one of it's older sections of the city: West Los Angeles to Downtown LA. Densely populated area, massive traffic, lot of vehicles, and buses. The buses are what really beat things up in the right hand lanes.
It's not like I'm driving though a bunch of beat up street the second I leave my driveway with my 1.14" T-bars. It's not a big deal to every once in a while cruise through my old neighborhood near Hollywood, Beverly Hills, etc.
Now, when I had .99" T-bars and lived there, I did go through those beat up streets the second I left the driveway. Not a big issue. And I drove the car daily back and forth to work every day. Now I don't drive it like that.
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Re: A-body dailydriver 1" torsion bar upgrade
[Re: autoxcuda]
#1527523
11/02/13 10:06 PM
11/02/13 10:06 PM
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Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 86
Battle Ground, Washington
Rapom65
member
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member
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 86
Battle Ground, Washington
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Not a daily driver but good weather back road/mountain highway twisties, freeway trips of 2 hours +, cruising & and an occasional jaunt around a road course. Just a variety of road surface conditions. Freeway, small city streets, older country roads ie. old worn asphalt but not full of pot holes, big city crap roads (Portland, OR). Do the big bars react to any surface irregularities in particular, examples ~ jolts from expansion joints or vibration/hum from old coarse pavement? I know its hard to separate as shock quality and stiff sidewalls will play into the ride quality also.
Last edited by Rapom65; 11/02/13 10:14 PM.
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Re: A-body dailydriver 1" torsion bar upgrade
[Re: autoxcuda]
#1527525
11/02/13 10:10 PM
11/02/13 10:10 PM
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
72Swinger
master
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master
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
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Bigger bars will amplify expansion joints and sharp edge type hits, its just the way it is. But overall the ride is still compliant and on the majority of roads, comfortable still. Good shocks are key. I have 1.06's.
Mopar to the bone!!!
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Re: A-body dailydriver 1" torsion bar upgrade
[Re: autoxcuda]
#1527528
11/03/13 08:28 AM
11/03/13 08:28 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
BigBlockMopar
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
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The type of roads in my area our kinda various. The majority of roads overhere have nice smooth asphalt without obvious potholes. The smaller streets in residential areas have cobble stones. Pretty much all of them are like shown below. But we do have an abundance of speedbumps and roundabouts overhere. Annoyingly much I might add. The roundabouts aren't that bad as such, but the speedbumps, which all vary in height and ramp-steepness, seem to be put down at random. 
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Re: A-body dailydriver 1" torsion bar upgrade
[Re: BigBlockMopar]
#1527529
11/03/13 08:21 PM
11/03/13 08:21 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
BigBlockMopar
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
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Quote:
Bigger bars will amplify expansion joints and sharp edge type hits, its just the way it is.
Well, I racked up a few miles today.
(after I had turned up the torsion bars about 2.5 turns to keep the car from hitting the bumpstops on speedbumps.)
I drove on various roads and the ones where say streetcar-tracks normally would try to shake the entire car to pieces, were suprisingly quieted actually.
A few other roads with some uncomfortable bumps and dips in them felt also more easy to drive on.
What I think has happened on my car, is that the beafier front springs match the (KYB) shocks much better now.
Along with the extra leaf I added aswell recently, the car has a much more 'grown up' feel about it now. More modern.
Corners are taken flatter and more stable and secure. Bumps and dips are delt with much better and on plain smooth asfalt the higher springrates aren't noticable at all.
I'm actually glad I did the upgrade!
As a short reminder, here are some specs of my car again;
1973 Dodge Dart w/ '71 front clip.
- Hellwig front swaybar
- Homemade welded subframe connectors.
- polybushings on all suspension points, even the lca's.
- C body diskbrakes upfront, drums on the rear.
- bonestock 8.6cr 318 running on propane
- A518 OD
- 8-3/4" w/ 3.91 suregrip
- 2 heavy steel propane tanks in the trunk area.
- 17" wheels w/ 215/50R17" Michelin Primacy tires. (240 threadwear)
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Re: A-body dailydriver 1" torsion bar upgrade
[Re: BigBlockMopar]
#1527530
11/03/13 10:31 PM
11/03/13 10:31 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,466
So Cal
autoxcuda
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,466
So Cal
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Quote:
Quote:
Bigger bars will amplify expansion joints and sharp edge type hits, its just the way it is.
Well, I racked up a few miles today.
(after I had turned up the torsion bars about 2.5 turns to keep the car from hitting the bumpstops on speedbumps.)
I drove on various roads and the ones where say streetcar-tracks normally would try to shake the entire car to pieces, were suprisingly quieted actually.
A few other roads with some uncomfortable bumps and dips in them felt also more easy to drive on.
What I think has happened on my car, is that the beafier front springs match the (KYB) shocks much better now.
Along with the extra leaf I added aswell recently, the car has a much more 'grown up' feel about it now. More modern.
Corners are taken flatter and more stable and secure. Bumps and dips are delt with much better and on plain smooth asfalt the higher springrates aren't noticable at all.
I'm actually glad I did the upgrade!
As a short reminder, here are some specs of my car again;
1973 Dodge Dart w/ '71 front clip.
- Hellwig front swaybar
- Homemade welded subframe connectors.
- polybushings on all suspension points, even the lca's.
- C body diskbrakes upfront, drums on the rear.
- bonestock 8.6cr 318 running on propane
- A518 OD
- 8-3/4" w/ 3.91 suregrip
- 2 heavy steel propane tanks in the trunk area.
- 17" wheels w/ 215/50R17" Michelin Primacy tires. (240 threadwear)
I think Bilstien RCD's will help reduce some harshness. When I had .99" T-bars I went from KYB's to QA1's just in the front and it reduced harshness.
Also your 215/50 series tires are pretty low profile.
I was running 245/50's and 225/60's with my .99's.
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Re: A-body dailydriver 1" torsion bar upgrade
[Re: jcc]
#1527531
11/13/13 06:19 PM
11/13/13 06:19 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
BigBlockMopar
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
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Ok guys, almost 2 weeks later, I can safely say that I'm already 'used' to these 1" torsion bars and truly believe these bars should have been standard in certain A-body models. Actually... Quote:
Now you get to wonder what 1.06" feel like.
... ehm, yes.
However, I would like to try and take out some corner bodyroll out of the car first.
The car has improved greatly ever since I bought it when it had no swaybar, stock 0.87" Tbars and 14" wheels and crappy tires.
Eventhough the wheel-upgrade, subframe-connectors, a front Hellwig swaybar, added rear leafs and the 1" torsion bars did wonders for the car, it still shows some body-lean when I really drive the car through a corner fast.
Although upgrading the front Hellwig bar to even bigger would be a probable cure for this, I think I would rather install a rear swaybar instead.
My idea is that a rear bar would help out more leveling the car, mainly because of the 2 steel propane tanks in the trunk area.
One tank is a donut-shaped tank, mounted tightly in the spare tire well, the other tank is cylindrical and mounted 'high' in the car under the package tray, right over the rear axle.
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Re: A-body dailydriver 1" torsion bar upgrade
[Re: BigBlockMopar]
#1527534
04/21/14 12:57 PM
04/21/14 12:57 PM
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,442
NW Chicago suburban area
Mopar Mitch
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,442
NW Chicago suburban area
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BBMopar -- You are a further testament to how anemically weak small TBs, such as 1.0, etc, can be. See... now that you've adjusted to them, you're saying/thinking ~"maybe bigger aren't bad.. and they'll take more roll out...". My good friend and racer John Sandberg has a 67 Formula S (sb)... he's the original owner! He runs 1.14 TBs with 16x8 minilite rims, 245-50-16 f/r tires, beefed rear leafs, red Konis, added rear sway bar... car handles great, rides great... do yourself a favor and stop waisting time and $$$... get the 1.14 from FF and be done... if you get anything LESS than 1.14 you'll wonder again... what the bigger TBs such as 1.14 would be like. The 1.14 is a size that should've been OE on a "handling" package such as the Formula S a-bodies. These TBs are not harsh or bad on thre street; they'll reduced the lean, dive and lift.. you'll find it to be the best single improvemet and wonder why you didn't get them in the first place.
You do need a rear bar... to complete the package, and favorably a little stiffer leafs.
Mopar Mitch
"Road racers and autocrossers go in deeper and come out harder!"... and rain never stops us from having fun with our cars... in fact, it makes us better drivers!
Check out MOPAR ACTION MAGAZINE, August 2006 issue for feature article and specs on my autocross T/A!
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Re: A-body dailydriver 1" torsion bar upgrade
[Re: 68cuda440]
#1527536
04/22/14 12:45 PM
04/22/14 12:45 PM
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,442
NW Chicago suburban area
Mopar Mitch
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,442
NW Chicago suburban area
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I'm pretty sure FF will make any size TB... (I thought they used to advertise 1.14 for A-bodies, and I know a few A-body owners who have the 1.14)... For your street car as you've described, the 1.12 would be fine (the 1.18 if you want better road course/autox track performance).
Mopar Mitch
"Road racers and autocrossers go in deeper and come out harder!"... and rain never stops us from having fun with our cars... in fact, it makes us better drivers!
Check out MOPAR ACTION MAGAZINE, August 2006 issue for feature article and specs on my autocross T/A!
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