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505 dry sump headed to the dyno #152453
11/17/08 04:24 PM
11/17/08 04:24 PM
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AndyF Offline OP
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Lots of new parts on the 505 for this round of testing. Dry sump system is main focus with custom drive parts and mounts. Jesel sent me some 1.85 ratio rocker arms so I'll be doing some ratio testing. I'm using a cam from Jones in this motor. This is the first time I've worked with Mike Jones over there since I've always worked with Comp in the past. I also have a full ignition system that MSD sent for testing. 7AL2+ with a big honking HVC coil. Guess we'll see how it all performs here shortly.

4819530-505.jpg (1579 downloads)
Re: 505 dry sump headed to the dyno [Re: AndyF] #152454
11/17/08 04:27 PM
11/17/08 04:27 PM
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Close up of the ignition plate I built for the back of the motor. This makes it more self contained so we don't have to rewire the dyno cell. Thanks to the guys at MSD for the parts and tech support.

4819535-ignition.jpg (870 downloads)
Last edited by AndyF; 11/17/08 04:30 PM.
Re: 505 dry sump headed to the dyno [Re: AndyF] #152455
11/17/08 04:28 PM
11/17/08 04:28 PM
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AndyF Offline OP
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My son is 11 now so he is starting to help out with building motors. By the time he is in high school he should be a decent mechanic.

4819541-josh.jpg (717 downloads)
Re: 505 dry sump headed to the dyno [Re: AndyF] #152456
11/17/08 04:31 PM
11/17/08 04:31 PM
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that's cool that your son is interested- mine couldn't care less. good luck with that motor, i hope you blow it up (the dyno)!


for what is the good life if not doing things thoughtfully?
Re: 505 dry sump headed to the dyno [Re: maximum entropy] #152457
11/17/08 06:51 PM
11/17/08 06:51 PM
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Rock Springs
Bob_Coomer Offline
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Is this a Flat cam, or a roller?..Cant wait for some details...

I'm sure the boy will be pumping out Custom Billet peices before ya know it LOL
That's good that he shows a interest in that stuff, I'm hoping for the same with Mine


[color:"red"]65 Hemi Belvedere coming soon [/color]
[color:"#00FF00"]557" Indy engine 1.07 60ft 144mph in the 8th 2100 lbs package [/color]
Re: 505 dry sump headed to the dyno [Re: AndyF] #152458
11/17/08 07:19 PM
11/17/08 07:19 PM
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Andy your stuff is always so flippin clean it's discouraging to we mere mortals

Re: 505 dry sump headed to the dyno [Re: AndyF] #152459
11/17/08 07:20 PM
11/17/08 07:20 PM

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what kind of testing will you be doing with the MSD? is it a comparison test against something else?
tell us more about the "ratio testing" as well. what's that all about, just to see if they're really as advertised, or how much difference they make against something else?

Re: 505 dry sump headed to the dyno [Re: Bob_Coomer] #152460
11/17/08 09:02 PM
11/17/08 09:02 PM
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AndyF Offline OP
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Roller cam, 266/272 at 0.050. Mike Jones is an interesting guy to talk to about cams. He does a lot of circle track stuff but he also has some drag race profiles. He posts a lot over on SpeedTalk if anyone is interested in reading some of his posts.

http://www.jonescams.com/2006catalog_001.htm

Re: 505 dry sump headed to the dyno [Re: AndyF] #152461
11/17/08 09:59 PM
11/17/08 09:59 PM
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Charleston
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hate to ask about something so trivial, but whos vc gaskets are they? how do they hold up?


Gen 3 power 6.22@110, 9.85@135
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performance only racing, CRT, ultimate converter, superior design concepts, ThumperCarbs
Re: 505 dry sump headed to the dyno [Re: sixpackgut] #152462
11/18/08 12:14 AM
11/18/08 12:14 AM
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Plymouth Meeting, PA
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moroso makes those gaskets. 93055 is the number. They will last forever unless you do something to them. They work best on machined surfaces and cast valve covers.

One more thing is i only use the center 4 bolts.


BB, TT5,Procharged 3300lb Street Car 4.79/154
Re: 505 dry sump headed to the dyno [Re: bigtimeauto] #152463
11/18/08 01:21 AM
11/18/08 01:21 AM
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you gonna dyno it with that oil pan.. looks like a wet sump pan to me..

4820901-dump2483.jpg (495 downloads)

Remember in here some don't think you should have a Opinion.. sad fact..
Re: 505 dry sump headed to the dyno [Re: kens avenger] #152464
11/18/08 01:38 AM
11/18/08 01:38 AM
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Sherwood park, Alberta.
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505 Dry sump Pedestrian head engine why ?

With that engine combo Dry sump would never even be a consideration.
Under 1000HP dry sump should not even be in the picture.

Thank you for the data but it does not seam realistic ??



6.50 @ 226 MPH 4.25 @ 186 MPH
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YX86DHGKBo0
Re: 505 dry sump headed to the dyno [Re: go green] #152465
11/18/08 02:36 AM
11/18/08 02:36 AM
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Quote:

505 Dry sump Pedestrian head engine why ?

With that engine combo Dry sump would never even be a consideration.
Under 1000HP dry sump should not even be in the picture.

Thank you for the data but it does not seam realistic ??




HEY GO GREEN!!!!
COOL CAR!!!

Re: 505 dry sump headed to the dyno [Re: go green] #152466
11/18/08 02:51 AM
11/18/08 02:51 AM
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AndyF Offline OP
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No dry sump unless the motor makes more than 1000hp? That sounds like a really stupid rule you made up there.

Re: 505 dry sump headed to the dyno [Re: AndyF] #152467
11/18/08 06:16 AM
11/18/08 06:16 AM
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Quote:

No dry sump unless the motor makes more than 1000hp? That sounds like a really stupid rule you made up there.



Looking forward to the report on the dry sump. My bet is the gains will start small at 4500 to 5500 rpm, and be very substantial by 6500, awsome by 7500.
One thing a dry sump will always have over any wet pan, oil control on the launch. Even the best wet pans have to lose some hp to windage in the first few feet due to extreme G forces at work. The faster the car, the worse it would be. No dyno can show that. It would be great to do back to back track tests to see how much of a difference there would be in each segment of the run.

Last edited by gregsdart; 11/18/08 07:32 AM.

8..603 156 mph best, 2905 lbs 549, indy 572-13, alky
Re: 505 dry sump headed to the dyno [Re: AndyF] #152468
11/18/08 11:17 AM
11/18/08 11:17 AM
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Sherwood park, Alberta.
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Quote:

No dry sump unless the motor makes more than 1000hp? That sounds like a really stupid rule you made up there.




Sorry I didn't mean to ruffle you feathers .

Is this a test engine or a engine for your car ?

I will go back in your posts and get up to speed on what you are doing..

Engine looks great



6.50 @ 226 MPH 4.25 @ 186 MPH
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YX86DHGKBo0
Re: 505 dry sump headed to the dyno [Re: gregsdart] #152469
11/18/08 04:17 PM
11/18/08 04:17 PM
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AndyF Offline OP
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I could do back to back wet-sump vs. dry sump testing but I probably won't bother since it takes a bunch of time and costs a bunch of money. Nobody is paying me for this testing so it all comes out of my pocket.

I am planning on moving most, if not all, of my future engine work over to dry sump. There are just so many advantages to the dry sump that I doubt I'll switch back to a wet sump configuration now that I have the dry sump. The dyno cell is configured for dry sump testing so it has a big tank, plumbed lines and a remote filter. So all I need to do is plug into that and go.

I like being able to change the speed of the oil pump since that is one thing you can't do with a wet sump pump. I also like the fact that the oil on the pressure side tends to be in better shape on a dry sump system than in a wet sump system. And if I put a larger pump on there I'll be able to run pan vacuum which should help with the power a bit. So basically I don't see any reason to run wet sump anymore on the dyno, even with street motors.

Re: 505 dry sump headed to the dyno [Re: AndyF] #152470
11/18/08 04:54 PM
11/18/08 04:54 PM

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Quote:

I could do back to back wet-sump vs. dry sump testing but I probably won't bother since it takes a bunch of time and costs a bunch of money. Nobody is paying me for this testing so it all comes out of my pocket.






can you do this and sell it to the magazine to make your money back???????

Re: 505 dry sump headed to the dyno #152471
11/18/08 05:57 PM
11/18/08 05:57 PM
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AndyF Offline OP
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Well the economics don't quite work out that simply. Magazine articles do provide some income but you can't really make a living building engines for $15,000 and selling articles for $1000.

Re: 505 dry sump headed to the dyno [Re: AndyF] #152472
11/18/08 06:22 PM
11/18/08 06:22 PM
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Andy I am curious about the oil pan just like Kens Avenger. It looks pretty deep for a dry sump set up. Is there a reason for the extra depth. Thanks for the posts, you always seem to find something interesting.

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