I just bought a 79 440 cast crank with 30k miles on it. My plan is to cram this motor into my 87 ramcharger and put a 46rh overdrive trans behind it. It will be a year round driver and hauler to bring my charger to the track. Seeing as how this motor is very low miles and there isn't even a hint of a ridge in the cylinder walls I'm thinking about milling the heads .050 to up the compression on the 90 cc 452 heads. They are true flat top pistons (I'm not sure how far down they are).
What do you guys think about the milling and possible power output? I'm not building a high rpm screamer just a strong 440 with gobs of low end torque to pull my 3500 lb car. Also, any cam and torque converter suggestions? This motor is externally balanced.

I tossd my stock 78 low milage MH 440 in as is,just bolted on a RPM intake with a q-jet,center dump manifolds,727 with a stock HS 10" TC.

with 3.91sg it is a blast to drive my 88 truck around town.

Welcome! Taking 50 off would help you tho I'm not sure how much/if it'd be worth it. Check manifold fitment when mocking up after they're milled. Should be good but check. Measure the deck height when the heads are off so you can plug all the specs in to Kieth Blacks calculator & get your exact SCR . I would spend alot of time dialing in the dist as there's alot of gain to be had there. I took 60 off of some 906's & advanced the fairly wild cam 4 deg & I definitely felt the improvement. Myself I'd drop it in as is as Scratchn said & get it running nice then go from there

If you cut the heads that much, the intake will need machine work too. Not sure how much compression that will make either. If you're not going to us a upgraded camshaft, headers and top it w/ a decent intake I wouldn't bother.

This all sounds good except for the OD transmission. They have demonstrated weakness in OD with a load (when towing with my '99 Ram I always ran with the OD switched off), you will have to saw off the front of the trans and replace it with an Ultrabell or some other conversion, because there is no stock BB application and the gas mileage payback for all this expense is so far down the road you will never see it. Far better to install a beefed, readily available 727 and just use it for it's intended (towing) job.

I'm going to run a pair of under chassis headers with 2 1/2 inch exhaust, a performer rpm ait gap intake and a holley 750 carb. Electronic ignition, and total timing will be dictated later. I'm a huge fan of the comp extreme energy flat tappet cams as that's what I'm running in my 70 charger 440. Just not sure which grind would work best for building great torque, and if I should run a stock stall speed or not. I should add that later down the line I'm probably gonna convert this to efi. And I would have to estimate the the pistons are about .15 below deck atdc. As far as the trans, I know its a bit of work, but its either convert a big block 2wd 727 trans that I already have to accept 4wd or go convert an overdrive 4wd trans to accept a big block. I think the bell housing is cheaper than having g someone gear down the 727. Also, I would like the low highway rpms and the overdrive trans it a 47rh out of a 92 w350 diesel with the correct t case.

Let's start out by saying that Chrysler regularly built engines at muuch less than the advertised compression ratio, and that every Mopar bigblock of which I'm aware came with a steel shim head gasket. So no easy compression gains by switching to the steel shim.

Your 440 has pistons that may be as far as 0.180 down in the hole. Actual compression ratio is in the low 7s.

If the block is in as good a condition as you say I'd seriously consider replacement pistons and don't spend the money on milling the heads. Check out the cost of milling both the head and head intake surfaces. It could be well above $200.

Let's say the 440 has a swept volume of 902cc. To get to 9:1 you need no more than 112.7 cc above the piston. The head is 93cc, let's make thatt 92.7 so the numbers are even. That means no more than 20 cc above the piston including gasket. Even the thinnest gasket is 5cc, leaving 15cc between piston and top of deck. This is equivalent to 0.060". So your piston is currently 1/8" LOWER than 9:1.
Rats!
Let's go to 8:1. That lets you have 129cc above the piston. Subtract 93cc, subtract 5 cc for the steel shim gasket, you have 31cc left. That puts the piston top at 0.129 below the deck. Still higher than your (my guess) 0.180"
Rats!

Lets figure out compression at 0.180" down, 93cc heads milled 0.060", thin gasket.
Heads are now at 79cc, gasket is 5cc, 0.180down is 43.3cc. Volume above piston is 127.3cc.
(902 + 127.3) / 127.3 = 8.1:1 That's AFTER milling 0.060 off the head's deck surface and 0.074 off the intake face.

Gotta get that piston up! You could actually use a 4.15" stroker crank with aftermarket 6.760 rods and your stock pistons and have very close to zero deck, which would boost your compression ratio out of your range.

Stay tuned for more.....

R.

or.... grab an old Paxton SN2000 for $800 or so and be done with it. Keep the boost under 8psi and you'll be G2G.

So here's what I'd do:

0. Take off the heads and measure the actual deck clearance at TDC. If it's 0.120" or less, you're golden, 8.1:1. But it won't be.

1. Buy these pistons and rings: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Speed-Pro-Dodge-...r#ht_1002wt_932
That gives you a brand new set of rings, plus moves the pistons up about 0.060". That has fewer problems associated with it than milling heads.

2. Do a MP template bowl port on the heads. Breathing is KEY even on a truck engine. Many a time I have run my trucks at 4000 rpm on long upgrades.
2A. OR, Find a pair of 516 heads and rebuild them using hardened exhaust seats and the valves etc from your '79 heads. Cleaning up the bowls is important here, too. This step with the new pistons gets you to 8.6:1, what I consider max for your setup.

3. Buy a hydraulic flat tappet cam with around 215 degrees intake, 225 degrees exhaust duration at 50 lift. I'd check Hughes, Comp and Lunati. Get springs as required by the builder. Follow break-in procedures exactly.

4. DO recurve the distributor, but after the engine is built.

5. When your bank account recovers get a Performer RPM and stick a 670 Street Avenger on it.

6. Truck exhaust manifolds aren't too bad, long tube headers are better if you want them.

REGARDING the transmission: It's been done many times, but isn't as easy as it seems. Regardless, if you're going to do it, get the transmission updated with late model truck stuff.

Follow these instructions and it'll run like a beast and get decent mileage to boot. Not great, but decent.

R.

Dog days.... I at first thought about doing a piston swap instead of head milling. I found a set of stock bore dome quench pistons from Keith black with a head volume of -9.99 cc. I was hesitant to go that route because I didn't want to worry about my piston to valve clearance, also I'm unsure as to whether or not my external balance cast crank needed to come out and get re-balanced. I got a quote to mill the heads at $225, and the cost of the pistons, and bearing far exceed that. Im still not opposed to doing a piston swap, but I'm trying to avoid the can of worms associated with may come up with a piston change. If I can change pistons without a bunch of machine e work then that's better news for me. If I have to rebalance everything then all I can really afford right now is some head milling and I can hope for the best.

Piston-to-valve clearance? In a stock style 440? With a half-inch lift cam? Don't even give it a thought.

What exactly were the KB pistons you saw? I'll look them up.
All three KB pistons for 440 have big valve pockets and weigh close enough to the stockers to not require rebalancing.

Pretty much, 440 pistons are 440 pistons until you get into the $500 and up category. The 350NP I posted are stock replacements, no rebalancing needed, with Hastings rings for $300.

IMHO it's easier to swap pistons than
to redo valvetrain geometry which could happen with big head milling.

Was the $225 quote for two or for four surfaces? My last quote was for two surfaces for $200. Maybe your shop is less expensive, depends on the market.

Your heads should be 452s with a numeral "1" cast onto the outside end of the head. These are quite desirable heads, as far as OEM heads go.

R.

Found them on summit racing, skb363. I figured a quench dome would be best for what I'm trying g to accomplish, but if I can run a flat top with a different centerline to get the same results then awesome. By the way thanks for every ones input on the subject. There's a reason why I chose to ask some of the seasoned Mopar speed veterans for some advice. And it was $225 for four surfaces, I would prefer to not mill the heads because once they're milled I can't go back and I would assume that I would be severely limited in the future with part changes.

Sorry, The later automatics are simply built to soft for big power without a lot of expensive upgrades. Your experience with a '92 vintage trans versus mine with a '99 proves it. Maybe the guts are the same but the valve body programming is not. When I was shopping for a tow vehicle to replace the '99 I went with a 6 speed stick diesel for reliability because of the automatic issues I had with towing and I did not mistreat the transmission in the '99.

Nonono! Not those! They Are a high compression piston not a step top piston you need either a 236 or 184. Tomorrow ill have a real keyboard.
R.

Another option for exhaust is the Hedman shorty hedders 78070, I used these on my 74 D100 pickup 440 and they fit great, you do need to use a mini-starter with these for clearance.

Just so I'm clear those pistons you suggested have a higher piston height so it will operate higher in the bore at tdc? Thusly increasing compression without interfering with my valves? Would a piston swap using those that you listed from eBay require rebalncing the rotating assembly or not? Or would I need to compare the piston weight to the stockers before that could be answered?

The pistons on eBay do indeed move the top of the piston to about .120 down. They are stock replacement pistons meaning no rebalancing required.
They are not ideal but a step in the right direction.

Your Summit pistons KB 363 are domed high compression pistons and NOT the "quench dome" type. Also be aware that KB counts anything that reduces chamber volume, different than a flat top, as negative.
I on purpose did not suggest any pistons that will require rebalancing or have a problem with valve clearance and I thought I had been clear about that. Big block mopars do not as a rule have V/P problems with street type cams and pistons.
Stock pistons are too far down for v/p issues. Six pack pistons have valve reliefs but compression would be too high for your application.

I spec'd out a truck 440 for a friend some years ago using KB 184s. It took a bit more machine work but at 9:1 it runs on mid grade with a Hughes cam with 214 intake duration at 50 lift. His mileage doubled. Of course the new engine parts helped.

It sounds like you don't want to put as much time and money in. I can respect that. So I suggest the Sealed Power 350NP. That will get you a real 8.1:1. Then any more could be done with heads.


R.

Thank you, thank you, thank you!
I knew there was a reason I came here for advice before I did anything. That sounds exactly like what I'm trying to accomplish with this engine and the cost sounds reasonable too. I'll be putting my parts order in soon and getting to work on this motor.
Thanks again, and happy hunting to you all.